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Post by philthetube on Aug 20, 2020 15:53:52 GMT
It’s not the driving brigade that need tackling, but the work from home/shop online brigade. If they don’t return, then the base of demand and fares will stay permanently lower. I think working from home will go as quickly as it came. There’s only so many times people will get caught out answering the phone with beach noises in the background! When the current fear factor has gone, which one way or it other it will have to, I think many elements of normality will recover quicker than people think. Just that we won’t then be able to afford things like Holborn congestion relief! If you can do the job as efficiently from the beach then why not, however most people working from home need desktop and everything that goes with it so not an option for many .
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Post by 35b on Aug 20, 2020 21:11:38 GMT
More like 4 days at home, 1 day in an office, I'd say, with hot desking. The economics stare you in the face. As for shopping, nine times out of ten online is more convenient... I can see very few companies allowing a 4:1 ratio of home to workplace! Don’t bet on it
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Post by 35b on Aug 20, 2020 21:12:27 GMT
I think working from home will go as quickly as it came. There’s only so many times people will get caught out answering the phone with beach noises in the background! When the current fear factor has gone, which one way or it other it will have to, I think many elements of normality will recover quicker than people think. Just that we won’t then be able to afford things like Holborn congestion relief! If you can do the job as efficiently from the beach then why not, however most people working from home need desktop and everything that goes with it so not an option for many . Amazing where you can work with a laptop
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Post by superteacher on Aug 20, 2020 21:25:45 GMT
I can see very few companies allowing a 4:1 ratio of home to workplace! Don’t bet on it I’d bet a huge sum on it - if I had it! The most I can envisage is 2:3
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Post by jimbo on Aug 21, 2020 0:28:23 GMT
The article says that only half are back at work, but car trips are almost back to normal. As the other half start to return, they will have to find other means as the roads will be full. Cycling is already above pre-Covid levels. What is left but the trains! I know this forum doesn't 'do' buses, but they do exist! Trams also, although they have a rather more limited geographic coverage than would be the case in an ideal world. Buses are part of the road solution. If the roads are full, buses have problems. Trams relate to buses or trains, as appropriate.
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Post by Chris L on Aug 21, 2020 8:18:12 GMT
I know this forum doesn't 'do' buses, but they do exist! Trams also, although they have a rather more limited geographic coverage than would be the case in an ideal world. Buses are part of the road solution. If the roads are full, buses have problems. Trams relate to buses or trains, as appropriate. If the roads in Central London are back to pre COVID-19 levels it is likely the higher £15 congestion charge will remain or be further increased. It seems the DLR is carrying more people now than the other lines.
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Post by 35b on Aug 21, 2020 9:32:45 GMT
I’d bet a huge sum on it - if I had it! The most I can envisage is 2:3 Time will tell.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 21, 2020 9:57:57 GMT
Buses are part of the road solution. If the roads are full, buses have problems. Trams relate to buses or trains, as appropriate. If the roads in Central London are back to pre COVID-19 levels it is likely the higher £15 congestion charge will remain or be further increased. It seems the DLR is carrying more people now than the other lines. I went up the West End last week, early afternoon, the roads are nowhere near pre-Covid 19 levels, I was actually able to cross parts of the Marble Arch junction without having to wait for the "green man"!
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hobbayne
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Post by hobbayne on Aug 21, 2020 11:32:37 GMT
ASLEF are balloting for a strike on LUL. It seems rather pointless to me, and I dont know that many drivers will vote for it either.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 21, 2020 12:30:33 GMT
ASLEF are balloting for a strike on LUL. It seems rather pointless to me, and I dont know that many drivers will vote for it either. Being discussed here since Monday districtdavesforum.co.uk/thread/30018/strike?page=6Its far from pointless with management refusing to make a commitment to respect existing agreements or to negotiate any changes and from talking to other drivers there seems to be plenty of support.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Aug 21, 2020 12:51:29 GMT
I wonder how much the DfT are tying LU management's hands (or trying to)?
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Post by John Tuthill on Aug 21, 2020 14:12:43 GMT
If the roads in Central London are back to pre COVID-19 levels it is likely the higher £15 congestion charge will remain or be further increased. It seems the DLR is carrying more people now than the other lines. I went up the West End last week, early afternoon, the roads are nowhere near pre-Covid 19 levels, I was actually able to cross parts of the Marble Arch junction without having to wait for the "green man"! Don't do that in Copenhagen. I was there a few years ago, one Sunday my wife and I were strolling around, not many people about.At the crossing, there were three or four locals waiting to cross. Nothing coming in either direction, so I started to cross. Big mistake. Seeing I was carrying a copy of the Sunday Telegraph a man behind me said something to the effect "This is not London, wait for the green man!" Wasn't sure if this was the way they are instructed or their being robotic. I thought to myself if they did that in Oxford Street, fatalities would cease overnight.
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Post by Chris L on Aug 21, 2020 14:12:52 GMT
If the roads in Central London are back to pre COVID-19 levels it is likely the higher £15 congestion charge will remain or be further increased. It seems the DLR is carrying more people now than the other lines. I went up the West End last week, early afternoon, the roads are nowhere near pre-Covid 19 levels, I was actually able to cross parts of the Marble Arch junction without having to wait for the "green man"! This is why I said "If" The 20mph speed limits now being introduced on many main roads and the use of traffic signal phasing to choke traffic make trains a much more attractive way to travel.
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North End
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Post by North End on Aug 21, 2020 15:01:13 GMT
If the roads in Central London are back to pre COVID-19 levels it is likely the higher £15 congestion charge will remain or be further increased. It seems the DLR is carrying more people now than the other lines. I went up the West End last week, early afternoon, the roads are nowhere near pre-Covid 19 levels, I was actually able to cross parts of the Marble Arch junction without having to wait for the "green man"! Depends when and where one is. I’d say the suburbs are back to normal levels at many times of day, indeed the eat out days I’d say are busier than normal especially in the evenings. Central London is undoubtedly a bit quieter, though the last few weeks have seen things pick up. City of London is still very dead. The big thing is there still isn’t much of a morning peak. I’d expect that to change when the schools return. One way or other there’s certainly been a return to things like traffic jams in the last couple of weeks. I’ve been driving in more often recently for a number of reasons, and been held up a number of times recently, which was naturally unheard of back in April, May and June - and indeed would be very rare on a normal weekday at the times in question. It’s tended to be for silly reasons too - a KFC drive-through queue blocking back onto a major roundabout was one such reason!
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hobbayne
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Post by hobbayne on Aug 21, 2020 15:45:35 GMT
ASLEF are balloting for a strike on LUL. It seems rather pointless to me, and I dont know that many drivers will vote for it either. Being discussed here since Monday districtdavesforum.co.uk/thread/30018/strike?page=6Its far from pointless with management refusing to make a commitment to respect existing agreements or to negotiate any changes and from talking to other drivers there seems to be plenty of support. Apologies, I didnt realise that thread was still active. It is pointless because who is going to be inconvienced? The trains are running around half empty out there! Even the strike happy RUMPTEES are wondering why a ballot is being called.
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Post by stapler on Aug 22, 2020 7:09:48 GMT
More like 4 days at home, 1 day in an office, I'd say, with hot desking. The economics stare you in the face. As for shopping, nine times out of ten online is more convenient... I can see very few companies allowing a 4:1 ratio of home to workplace! Rather uncomfortable bosses than dead ones. Or workers.
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Post by superteacher on Aug 22, 2020 8:25:51 GMT
I can see very few companies allowing a 4:1 ratio of home to workplace! Rather uncomfortable bosses than dead ones. Or workers. Was thinking post Covid.
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 22, 2020 9:50:11 GMT
If you can do the job as efficiently from the beach then why not, however most people working from home need desktop and everything that goes with it so not an option for many . Amazing where you can work with a laptop yes but if this requires web access it is only ideal if you have an encrypted connection - ideally at home you would use a physical cable as it is more likely to be secure than a wireless connection.
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Post by 35b on Aug 22, 2020 17:38:34 GMT
Amazing where you can work with a laptop yes but if this requires web access it is only ideal if you have an encrypted connection - ideally at home you would use a physical cable as it is more likely to be secure than a wireless connection. My employer provides VPN and has not mandated use of wired connections outside the office since home wireless became normal. My biggest problem now is persuading the Helpdesk that when I’m in the office I don’t have access to a wired connection .
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 25, 2020 20:46:57 GMT
I caught an eastbound TFL Rail train at Stratford this afternoon at around 4pm / 16:00 hrs and noted that platform 8 was far busier than I've seen in a while, there were too many people for full social distancing, although 1 metre was possible.
The near empty Class 345 train absorbed everyone with ease - but again we were closer than 2 metres apart!
So, passenger numbers are increasing - albeit slowly!
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Post by Chris M on Aug 25, 2020 21:08:08 GMT
I interchanged at Stratford this afternoon also, arriving on platform 11 about 17:30 and then leaving on the DLR from the high level platforms. I was near the rear of the train (as that was by the shelter at Waltham Cross) and it wasn't busy in my carriage but I was very surprised how many people got off from further forwards on the train. Likewise the DLR was busier than I expected, although nowhere near a normal rush hour levels still enough that people had to stand to avoid sharing seats.
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Post by Chris L on Aug 26, 2020 5:45:00 GMT
I interchanged at Stratford this afternoon also, arriving on platform 11 about 17:30 and then leaving on the DLR from the high level platforms. I was near the rear of the train (as that was by the shelter at Waltham Cross) and it wasn't busy in my carriage but I was very surprised how many people got off from further forwards on the train. Likewise the DLR was busier than I expected, although nowhere near a normal rush hour levels still enough that people had to stand to avoid sharing seats. My recent journeys on the DLR suggest that social distancing is being ignored with people occupying all seats that are available.
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Post by stapler on Aug 26, 2020 6:54:01 GMT
Just wait till next wek when the hordes from the Anglo-European School at Ingatestone jam up 10A and the subways.Personally, I don't understand Boris's headlong rush to restart schools. Chris Whitty says the likelihood of transmission in schools will be low, but he carefully didn't mention buses, trains, and stations...
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Post by brigham on Aug 26, 2020 7:21:24 GMT
Just wait till next wek when the hordes from the Anglo-European School at Ingatestone jam up 10A and the subways.Personally, I don't understand Boris's headlong rush to restart schools. Chris Whitty says the likelihood of transmission in schools will be low, but he carefully didn't mention buses, trains, and stations... I think it's something to do with people losing out on their education. Some 'government' types seem to regard it as important.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Aug 26, 2020 10:43:23 GMT
Studies elsewhere (Paris, Tokyo et al) have come to the conclusion that the chance of being infected on public transport is considerably lower than if you were to go to (for example) a bar or club. Personally I'd say thirty kids in a classroom together for an hour at a time have a much greater chance of spreading infection, but as brigham states, children have already lost out on half of the last academic year and shouldn't lose out on even more. On that note, back to the transport implications of Covid-19.
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class411
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Post by class411 on Aug 28, 2020 18:09:28 GMT
A country insisting people obey the law and do not risk the lives of others does not mean that said country is a police state. I’m pretty sick of seeing the majority of people behaving in a considerate and responsible manner and a few getting away with risking everybody else’s health. Quite true; a country insisting on civil obedience is not necessarily a police state. Only if the police are also the judiciary does it become one. Like France, for instance. You should pray to God every night of your life that you don't live in the US. There, not only are the police judge and jury, they're executioners, too. Another US police officer kills an unarmed man.
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Post by brigham on Aug 28, 2020 18:13:22 GMT
Not black?
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class411
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Post by class411 on Aug 28, 2020 18:19:40 GMT
Tough, white lives don't matter. I won't even pretend to know what you mean by that. You might also like to know that they have now handcuffed the black man they shot in the back and is currently paralysed and unable to walk to his hospital bed. BBC ReportI'll say no more as this is off topic, but since your attack on the French was allowed, it would be invidious not to point out that there are far worse police states. ETA: I see you've now changed your posts, but it's still not clear exactly what you're trying to get across.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Aug 28, 2020 18:48:48 GMT
On that note, back to the transport implications of Covid-19. Tom has said it in green and I will now say it in red. On topic please.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Aug 29, 2020 15:39:45 GMT
I've travelled to Euston and back this afternoon and it was only slightly quieter than a normal Saturday this time of year would be. The DLR was full and standing with every available seat taken (the areas for staff take out 16 seats and two vestibules per train). When the tourists come back it will be back to very near normal on weekends.
It seems clear that those who are talking about a collapse in ridership in public transport are the ones who are not themselves using public transport. Those of us who are looking at what the evidence actually is are not seeing any collapse.
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