rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Mar 17, 2019 22:40:27 GMT
Well the 1938 TS came out to play today, and play it did - especially at the end of the day when the journey from Acton Town to Northfields was dropped and the train returned straight to Ruislip! 7.1 (Unusual Train Movements) This forum does not actively encourage the posting of the timings for unusual train movements for the following reasons: - (7.1a) The information is usually available only within documents marked 'for internal use only'
- (7.1b) The timings can never be guaranteed - in fact these sort of movements often don't happen at the times published, if at all
- (7.1c) Making the details of such movements public could cause issues with unplanned overcrowding at stations or other locations
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Post by brigham on Mar 18, 2019 8:56:22 GMT
I have clearly misunderstood section (7.1).
I mistakenly thought it referred to events yet to happen, rather than subsequent reports of such events.
Good job I live so far away. I could have inadvertently got myself into trouble!
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 18, 2019 10:06:06 GMT
I have clearly misunderstood section (7.1). I mistakenly thought it referred to events yet to happen, rather than subsequent reports of such events. Does 7.1 really apply to past train movements as well? I understood the Admin comment to be to illustrate the reason for 7.1, to avoid the "Disappointed of South Ealing" situation discussed earlier. However, on this occasion it seems to have been the Museum's own published information which caused it. |
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Post by theblackferret on Mar 18, 2019 10:15:51 GMT
I'd suggest the rule is there to try and stop people anticipating a repeat of the unscheduled service, especially as DD's aren't providing the said service.
In those circumstances, we surely oughtn't to be seen publicizing such services if that puts pressure on heritage railway organizers to repeat it?
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Mar 18, 2019 13:23:53 GMT
My understanding is that the rule is there primarily for things like RAT* and engineering train movements, as reason 7.1a clearly does not apply to heritage train trips publicised by the Museum (at least those on which paying passengers are conveyed). However reasons 7.1b and 7.1c do apply and so posting the detailed timings beforehand would be at best significantly inadvisable. I think rincew1nd was simply using this example of 7.1b in action as another** reminder of why the rule exists and a hint that this is not the place to complain about the change in plan*** rather than as an indication that the quoted post had breached the rules. None of the reasons given for rule 7.1 apply to the posting of timings of events in the past, unless there is a suggestion that these are regular timings that will reoccur. *Rail Adhesion Train **I remember some similar mod or admin comments about RAT runs during last year's leaf-fall season ***Not that I think Simon was on this occasion complaining, merely noting |
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Post by edgemaster on Mar 18, 2019 13:40:34 GMT
However, on this occasion it seems to have been the Museum's own published information which caused it. The museum did not publish details of the movements to/from depots, only the scheduled passenger workings. |
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Colin
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My preserved fire engine!
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Post by Colin on Mar 18, 2019 15:09:33 GMT
Rule 7.1 was written in response to some pretty unsavoury behaviour that was exhibited at a special rail tour. A station almost had to close due to overcrowding and LU staff on the day were shown little respect. Although District Dave’s London Underground Forum was never directly implicated in what went on that day, a lot of information before the event was posted here and so the forum staff at the time felt it was appropriate to set a standard of expectations that members ought to abide by.
It should be noted that since the event referred to above, LU has improved how it conducts its special rail tours and enthusiasts have upped their game too. We’ve seen many good events since which include the last runs on A, C and D stocks as well as numerous 38ts tours. I was about 5 trains or so ahead of the 38ts on its eastbound trip on Sunday and I have to say that every enthusiast I saw behaved impeccably. **shameless request: if anyone has any photo’s of train 035 destined for Barking, leading car 21389 IIRC, I’d love to see them**
We also used to see lots of moans and arguments about the quality and source of information as publicised special trips would often happen differently to that stated, or not run at all. Having this clarified within our rules has seen this sort of negativity completely disappear off the forum.
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Post by spsmiler on Mar 19, 2019 20:44:52 GMT
My understanding is that the rule is there primarily for things like RAT* and engineering train movements, as reason 7.1a clearly does not apply to heritage train trips publicised by the Museum (at least those on which paying passengers are conveyed). However reasons 7.1b and 7.1c do apply and so posting the detailed timings beforehand would be at best significantly inadvisable. I think rincew1nd was simply using this example of 7.1b in action as another** reminder of why the rule exists and a hint that this is not the place to complain about the change in plan*** rather than as an indication that the quoted post had breached the rules. None of the reasons given for rule 7.1 apply to the posting of timings of events in the past, unless there is a suggestion that these are regular timings that will reoccur. *Rail Adhesion Train **I remember some similar mod or admin comments about RAT runs during last year's leaf-fall season ***Not that I think Simon was on this occasion complaining, merely noting I have clearly misunderstood section (7.1). I mistakenly thought it referred to events yet to happen, rather than subsequent reports of such events. Does 7.1 really apply to past train movements as well? I understood the Admin comment to be to illustrate the reason for 7.1, to avoid the "Disappointed of South Ealing" situation discussed earlier. However, on this occasion it seems to have been the Museum's own published information which caused it. My thoughts too! Especially for such an unusual service which is unlikely to be repeated.
btw, as was pointed out by edgemaster, the journeys after the train had been 'detrained' were not detailed on the London Transport Museum's website. But I got to hear about them somewhere else.
Apologies for taking until this evening to share this film here - I was up until after 2am making it and was just too whacked.
As I needed images of a Goblin Class 378 at Barking I decided to film the railtour train there too. Happily I got what I wanted - and even more! As the 1938 TS railtour train was running a few minutes early it stopped here for several minutes, I stayed where I was (at the back of the platform) as there were too many people milling around at the front of the platform and I wanted to film the 378 departing too. Hopefully filming 378's at this station will be a very short lived possibility. Colin, I saw the train you asked about and will share an image (still image from video) once its been published on Flickr.
I also filmed at Bow Road, things here did not quite to plan as I has wanted to film from the middle of the platform, approximately where I filmed a railtour many years ago. But service trains were scheduled to come too frequently so I went to one end of the platform and in the end it all worked very well. I did not see any other people with cameras here, which in a way was a shame as this is a distinctive Edwardian era historic station.
So, I padded out the film with other scenes, including when InterCity went underground! Ah, if only such was still possible - and maybe yet it could still be .... as far as I recall some battery locos will be kitted out for CBTC!
One other comment. What weather! Sun, rain, hail, wind... almost an entire season in one day!!!
Enjoy!
Simon
edit to add: Colin, as the image would be off topic for this thread I'll just share a link to it on Flickr. |
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Post by spsmiler on Mar 19, 2019 21:31:19 GMT
someone has asked me, how well did this train cope with the higher voltage on the SSL?
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Post by brigham on Mar 20, 2019 9:02:05 GMT
someone has asked me, how well did this train cope with the higher voltage on the SSL? That's a good question. Was it noticeably more 'lively'? |
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Post by edgemaster on Mar 20, 2019 12:12:58 GMT
No experience of it running on other tube lines, but do have to say it was immensely fun riding it fast on the met.  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2019 16:07:49 GMT
It should be able to take 1000v DC quite easily
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2019 21:30:29 GMT
It should be able to take 1000v DC quite easily I believe it has 750V mods when it was overhauled at Acton Works, but might be wrong. |
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Post by t697 on Mar 24, 2019 16:26:42 GMT
It should be able to take 1000v DC quite easily I believe it has 750V mods when it was overhauled at Acton Works, but might be wrong. I understand that it did have mods for operation on 750V supply / 890V Regenerative braking from S stock, but the spec for the works to the 1938 heritage train didn't include 1000V. Would need another assessment. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2019 18:01:13 GMT
I believe it has 750V mods when it was overhauled at Acton Works, but might be wrong. I understand that it did have mods for operation on 750V supply / 890V Regenerative braking from S stock, but the spec for the works to the 1938 heritage train didn't include 1000V. Would need another assessment. Can't remember the specs of what was fitted, but I do know 890V is a myth haha. I have heard rumours of the regen braking peaking at 1000V+ (from a very reliable source) but unsure for how long that voltage was sustained.. |
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Post by t697 on Mar 27, 2019 16:20:07 GMT
Can't remember the specs of what was fitted, but I do know 890V is a myth haha. I have heard rumours of the regen braking peaking at 1000V+ (from a very reliable source) but unsure for how long that voltage was sustained.. Could you explain the "890V is a myth" and "peaking at 1000V+" please? If you don't think it appropriate to do so in public, PM me. Thanks. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2019 16:22:20 GMT
Can't remember the specs of what was fitted, but I do know 890V is a myth haha. I have heard rumours of the regen braking peaking at 1000V+ (from a very reliable source) but unsure for how long that voltage was sustained.. Could you explain the "890V is a myth" and "peaking at 1000V+" please? If you don't think it appropriate to do so in public, PM me. Thanks. Let me pm you |
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Post by Dstock7080 on Apr 22, 2019 20:12:14 GMT
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Post by silenthunter on Apr 22, 2019 20:27:24 GMT
Alas, I won't be able to get to a computer before all those sell out...
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Post by Red Dragon on May 2, 2019 15:22:03 GMT
Managed to bag myself the front car on the longer journey A! Very pleased with it - my first heritage train run on LU and I'm hoping all will go to plan. Was hoping to go on the Steam on the District, but the prices are just too far out of my reach. In case anyone is interested, the shorter journeys two and three still have spaces (journey one is sold out), but neither have spaces in the front car (A).
| Journey 2
| Journey 3 | | Car B | sold out | nearly sold out
| | Car C | sold out
| limited availability | Car D
(rear) | limited availability
| limited availability
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Post by silenthunter on May 2, 2019 18:39:39 GMT
I think I'll pass on this particular trip, especially as I am doing a rail tour the previous weekend.
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Post by Red Dragon on May 10, 2019 15:31:51 GMT
Managed to bag myself the front car on the longer journey A! Very pleased with it - my first heritage train run on LU and I'm hoping all will go to plan. Was hoping to go on the Steam on the District, but the prices are just too far out of my reach. In case anyone is interested, the shorter journeys two and three still have spaces (journey one is sold out), but neither have spaces in the front car (A).
| Journey 2
| Journey 3 | | Car B | sold out | nearly sold out
| | Car C | sold out
| limited availability | Car D
(rear) | limited availability
| limited availability
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The updated availability for the 1938ts tour next Sunday. Still some spaces left! Although I have no link to the LTM etc., it would be nice to see all tickets sell out. This would ensure that the costs of running these trips can be covered and that money is available to look after LU heritage vehicles too - possibly even add to the fleet rolling stock which will be withdrawn over the next 50-or-so years!
| Journey 1
| Journey 2
| Journey 3 | | Car A | sold out
| sold out
| sold out
| | Car B | sold out | sold out | sold out | | Car C | sold out
| sold out
| sold out | Car D
(rear)
| sold out
| sold out
| limited availability
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on May 10, 2019 18:31:20 GMT
Although I have no link to the LTM etc., it would be nice to see all tickets sell out. This would ensure that the costs of running these trips can be covered and that money is available to look after LU heritage vehicles too - possibly even add to the fleet rolling stock which will be withdrawn over the next 50-or-so years! Spot on Dragon, this is important. No museum runs on thin air and a rolling museum even more so. Even though the viable track on the system is dwindling where these trains run, there may be scope for preserved units to operate elsewhere one day and the funds to allow this are always welcome. |
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Post by MoreToJack on May 10, 2019 19:39:25 GMT
The gist of this is spot on but generally speaking LU heritage runs at a loss, even when sold out...
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pitdiver
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Post by pitdiver on May 10, 2019 20:12:07 GMT
Even Steam on The Met ran at a financial loss despite most of te staff who worked on it were volunteers. However froma publicity ppoint of view they were always sucessful as far as I am aware.
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metman
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Post by metman on May 11, 2019 7:11:24 GMT
Personally thinking with the improvements inBattery technology it may be possible in years to come to run LUL heritage trains on parts of the National Rail network but that’s a discussion for another time.
Might try and film/photograph this trip.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2019 19:22:10 GMT
Personally thinking with the improvements inBattery technology it may be possible in years to come to run LUL heritage trains on parts of the National Rail network but that’s a discussion for another time. Might try and film/photograph this trip. This is actually the current plan with the Q stock (having a trailer inserted into the formation housing diesel generators). Whether it goes ahead or not, that is the real question. |
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Post by spsmiler on May 11, 2019 23:40:13 GMT
Personally thinking with the improvements inBattery technology it may be possible in years to come to run LUL heritage trains on parts of the National Rail network but that’s a discussion for another time. Might try and film/photograph this trip. This is actually the current plan with the Q stock (having a trailer inserted into the formation housing diesel generators). Whether it goes ahead or not, that is the real question. A new build trailer that looks exactly like the original trains would be very welcome. In addition to supplying the power for use when away from juice rails and creating a longer, more realistic 5 car train, it could be designed to be accessible. In thinking about the Q stock and its many body shapes, it already has flared sides but what about the different roof designs of trains built in the 1920s / early 1930s? There were several of these - do the still extant cars represent them all or maybe the new build could plug the gap? As an aside, although diesel might be the chosen fossil fuel at the present time, in the future this might change - with (for instance) hydrogen fuel cell / electric hybrids becoming seen as 'the standard' for trains not powered from a direct connection to the overhead wires / electric rails. Hopefully whatever is built would be designed with easy conversion in mind. edit to add: re: the forthcoming 1938 tube train trips on Sunday 19th May, I will be travelling on one of the Heathrow journeys. |
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 12, 2019 4:45:38 GMT
This is actually the current plan with the Q stock (having a trailer inserted into the formation housing diesel generators). Whether it goes ahead or not, that is the real question. A new build trailer that looks exactly like the original trains would be very welcome. It’s already been mentioned on this Forum that the Museum has set aside an A Stock trailer car for this purpose. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2019 8:17:15 GMT
A new build trailer that looks exactly like the original trains would be very welcome. It’s already been mentioned on this Forum that the Museum has set aside an A Stock trailer car for this purpose. Exactly, with space for generators, luggage space and a mobile shop for the museum |
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