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Post by superteacher on May 14, 2020 10:22:46 GMT
You may have noticed that this thread has moved location. However, the rules for posting in it have not changed. The staff are keeping a very close eye on it . . .
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on May 14, 2020 10:35:42 GMT
You may have noticed that this thread has moved location. However, the rules for posting in it have not changed. The staff are keeping a very close eye on it . . . In other words you're staying alert...
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Post by A60stock on May 14, 2020 11:27:34 GMT
Does anyone know if the Met will be retaining the off peak fast trains for the foreseeable future? Or is there a planned end date?
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 14, 2020 11:37:27 GMT
Normal working timetable on all lines from Monday.
I’m not familiar with the Metropolitan line timetable but that’s the basic answer.
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Post by John Tuthill on May 14, 2020 11:39:54 GMT
You may have noticed that this thread has moved location. However, the rules for posting in it have not changed. The staff are keeping a very close eye on it . . . In other words you're staying alert... "Be Alert-your country needs lerts"
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Post by nig on May 14, 2020 12:59:49 GMT
Getting back on topic, we’ve officially been told the District line will be reverting to its normal working timetable from Monday. But only on weekdays - we’ll continue with our current arrangements at weekends. Whether or not we have the driver availability across the line to run it I don’t know; nor am I going to speculate on whether health & safety objections will poo poo it. I believe all other lines are planned to also revert to their full working timetables from Monday. I’m just stating what is planned by senior management and am not getting involved in the politics or whatever around the combine. That certainly applies to the Picc although I haven't heard about the weekend as yet. I've also heard that night tube drivers are being asked if they want to be seconded to full time so this could possibly be the end of night tube for the foreseeable. As Colin stated, this is the plan, it's a long time between now and Monday and any number of decisions can be taken and reversed in that time! Night tube drivers are on a 12 week secondment if they wish to and also have to do there normal night turns so be 2 night turns on friday and saturday a minimum of 30 hours rest and 3 normal turns totalling 36 hours in all weekend is pre convid-19 timetable duties and bank holiday is normal mon to friday duties
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Post by nig on May 14, 2020 13:19:29 GMT
Timetable Notices now issued (except Waterloo & City) for Lines to resume normal WTTs from Mon 18 May. Heathrow T4 station remains closed. Night Tube services remain suspended. On Bank Holiday Monday 25 May, Lines running will operate normal Monday service (Victoria Line closed) Starting on Monday 18 May 2020, our intention is to build up service levels and to start operating as much as possible of the pre-COVID-19 working timetables. We’ll no longer use the emergency timetables which have been in place since ‘lockdown’. I stress this is not aimed at encouraging more people to travel on our network. The message to customers is clear: they should avoid public transport where possible. However, we expect there to be an increase in demand resulting from the Government’s approach to lifting lockdown • We plan to increase Tube service capacity to at least 70 per cent to help maintain social distancing for our customers and for you. To meet the national requirement for social distancing we will only carry 13-15 per cent of our usual passenger numbers. We are currently operating around 60 per cent of the usual peak period service levels not sure how they going to do 70 percent of service with normal duties and not a emercency timetable but sure they would of worked it all out !!
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 14, 2020 13:56:25 GMT
You’ve quoted parts of an internal email that was sent out a short while ago. As I’ve already said twice today and Dstock7080 has also posted, all lines are reverting to their normal working timetables from Monday. The 70% reference is probably a bit of bottom covering due to gaps in driver availability but I’m staying out of any such conversation on that front.
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Post by aslefshrugged on May 14, 2020 14:14:24 GMT
Sorry Colin, did you say something...
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Post by nig on May 14, 2020 14:56:21 GMT
You’ve quoted parts of an internal email that was sent out a short while ago. As I’ve already said twice today and Dstock7080 has also posted, all lines are reverting to their normal working timetables from Monday. The 70% reference is probably a bit of bottom covering due to gaps in driver availability but I’m staying out of any such conversation on that front. i know you have previously said its normal timetable from monday and people might expect its going to be a full service although we all know that wont happen because of driver availability etc . the purpose of my post was it might only be a 10 percent increase to what we have now so will possibly mean there will still be a bit of overcrowding
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Post by Tomcakes on May 14, 2020 15:18:18 GMT
Presumably there will be increases in station control being implemented when the number of intended passengers outnumbers the capacity; wonder if the queues will be as civilised as those outside the supermarket.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on May 14, 2020 15:29:50 GMT
Not every station has the same capacity for external queueing as a supermarket. Good luck at Leicester Square and Holborn for example.
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Post by philthetube on May 14, 2020 16:40:01 GMT
Stations closer to london would not see any queue movement in the peak, as very fuw leave trains at stations such as Belsize park or preston road.
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Post by philthetube on May 14, 2020 16:41:24 GMT
70% or services on the outer ends of the met or central will lead to serious deterioration of service.
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Post by Red Dragon on May 14, 2020 16:45:37 GMT
What happens if TfL doesn't get a bailout from central government?
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Post by aslefshrugged on May 14, 2020 16:52:39 GMT
What happens if TfL doesn't get a bailout from central government? The Mayor of London was blunt, services will have to be cut. Fewer buses (currently running at 80% according to London Reconnections), fewer Tubes (currently 50%), fewer DLR and tram services.
They certainly won't get the 70% Tube services they're asking for (they probably won't anyway)
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Post by superteacher on May 14, 2020 17:17:24 GMT
There is no way people will queue outside a tube station!
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Post by andypurk on May 14, 2020 17:20:19 GMT
As several experts and doctors have pointed out masks don't prevent you getting the virus. They stop you passing the virus onto others. This is not completely true and there are scientific papers showing the protective advantage of wearing a mask in an environment with infected people. What is important to remember that masks are properly worn and that the idea is to reduce risk, not complete protection. Here is a recent review of the uses of masks etc. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7191274/
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Post by aslefshrugged on May 14, 2020 17:58:00 GMT
Apparently under the Greater London Authority Act 1999 TfL don't have to run the Tube
They are legally required to:-
Run a minimal bus service for children living more than two miles away from their school. Run the Woolwich Ferry Regulate and license the taxi and private hire trade Some bits of highways maintenance
Just heard on BBC that TfL have been given £1.1bn grant and £500m loan
The Mayor of London has agreed to put fares up every year from January 2021.
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on May 14, 2020 18:47:20 GMT
Either use, 'The Mayor of London' or 'The Government' to describe the various institutions involved. No more individual politician's names and no more hints at opinions. We all have them, but they'll not be published here. Simple.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on May 14, 2020 19:04:31 GMT
According to the BBC News article the 1% above inflation fare rise has been "offered". It is listed separately from things agreed: So it is not clear that the fate rise is set in stone.
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Post by Red Dragon on May 14, 2020 19:06:34 GMT
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Post by MoreToJack on May 14, 2020 19:19:45 GMT
The interesting part is that this is being agreed as a '100% return of services'... so is Night Tube returning?
Although I would fully expect any financial review to identify that it remains to be a complete white elephant, whatever some will say.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on May 14, 2020 19:21:05 GMT
Sit on the Board, or attend Board Meetings? The two are very different.
I think a fare rise is guaranteed, what will be interesting is what else comes as part of the review of TfL's finances. Personally whilst I think the Government might welcome Night Tube returning it was always used to sweeten the bitter pill of ticket office closures and there will be no 'sacred cows' when it comes to cost-cutting, especially if it is running at a loss.
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Post by North End on May 14, 2020 20:20:43 GMT
The interesting part is that this is being agreed as a '100% return of services'... so is Night Tube returning? Although I would fully expect any financial review to identify that it remains to be a complete white elephant, whatever some will say. I can’t see how it can include Night Tube, as it’s almost certain the Night Tube train operators are going to be used to top up the day numbers. It’s essentially the only way they can even hope to make a viable attempt at doing a normal weekday WTT service. *Unless* something gives, if the shielded people remain so into the medium term, and training can’t resume, I’d say this seals Night Tube’s fate. Good riddance in my opinion, I’d certainly crack open a champagne to celebrate its demise.
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Post by Tomcakes on May 14, 2020 20:25:45 GMT
If nighttube T/Ops are currently working dayshift to help prop up the service, there's no way that they could (politically, or morally) reintroduce it. Especially since one of the major demands for night tube (i.e. folk getting trollied in pubs) isn't going to be happening for a while. And whilst some nightbus routes which parallel tube lines were were cut as a result, they are still running albeit at reduced frequency (e.g. N20, N91, N5).
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Post by MoreToJack on May 14, 2020 20:36:30 GMT
Alas, the two are not mutually exclusive. My understanding is that the secondments being offered to Night Tube operators still require them to cover their Friday/Saturday night turns (although quite how this can give any reasonable sort of rostering of rest days and shift patterns defeats me). Indeed, it would be difficult to offer a 'normal' service on Friday/Saturday nights and Saturday/Sunday morning as many first/last trains are covered by TO23s. Any such secondments are also for (initially?) limited to a 12-week period.
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North End
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Post by North End on May 14, 2020 20:45:41 GMT
Alas, the two are not mutually exclusive. My understanding is that the secondments being offered to Night Tube operators still require them to cover their Friday/Saturday night turns (although quite how this can give any reasonable sort of rostering of rest days and shift patterns defeats me). Indeed, it would be difficult to offer a 'normal' service on Friday/Saturday nights and Saturday/Sunday morning as many first/last trains are covered by TO23s. Any such secondments are also for (initially?) limited to a 12-week period. I think ultimately the NT drivers will become proper full time drivers (assuming many of them want to, of course). Shielding seems unlikely to come to an end any time soon, and it’s not just drivers that are short - Trains Managers for example are heavily affected by shielding at certain locations, indeed there’s even been a few snap retirements where people have brought forward plans. Unless training is able to resume in a meaningful way, and even if it does this doesn’t help as many LU roles take time to train for, there’s going to be massive shortages for some time. Stealing the NT drivers helps solve several headaches in one hit. And a convenient way of getting rid of a loss-making operational headache.
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Post by MoreToJack on May 14, 2020 20:52:48 GMT
I don’t disagree, but just putting out the fact as they currently stand. I’m firmly in camp ‘No to Night Tube’ and have been since day one.
The staffing and training resources are the big unknown that no-one is taking about. My own part of the business was running on overtime prior to Covid and that shows no signs of letting up soon - as one of the few Instructors I’ve also been given no assurances as to how we can safely deliver local training in the cabins. This obviously extends also to trains and stations etc, and of course classroom based stuff itself. A lot of trainers are shielding AIUI too which further depletes resources... and then there will be the backlog of the annual rules tests/refresher training and the like.
As I’ve said on recruitment threads elsewhere, I doubt we will be seeing any new intakes for some time unless areas become absolutely desperate.
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Post by Chris L on May 15, 2020 3:20:30 GMT
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