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Post by Red Dragon on Aug 31, 2018 9:22:35 GMT
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Post by gals on Aug 31, 2018 9:28:22 GMT
Not surprising I don't think but disappointing...another summer of the central line!
Plus, what is this going to do to TfL's finances if it subsequently delays the western opening?! They were really banking of the money from the Lizline.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Aug 31, 2018 9:29:52 GMT
Click/Tap here if above embedded tweet fails to display. Click/Tap here if above embedded tweet fails to display. |
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Post by bearbin on Aug 31, 2018 9:31:38 GMT
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Post by Chris W on Aug 31, 2018 9:32:04 GMT
The full text of the press release reads:
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Post by silenthunter on Aug 31, 2018 10:26:56 GMT
Didn't a substation blow up a few months back?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2018 10:31:47 GMT
And once again yet another big rail project is delayed, considering the amount of Premature PR this does not surprise me.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 31, 2018 10:41:56 GMT
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Post by trt on Aug 31, 2018 12:07:05 GMT
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Post by superteacher on Aug 31, 2018 12:36:02 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed?
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Post by John Tuthill on Aug 31, 2018 12:50:49 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed? By the time it's finished it will be the 'Charles Line'  According to the BBC web page they are dealing with 'Three different signalling systems' Please don't tell me they've just discovered this? How much is the 'Project Manager' or not getting paid? Progress meetings-target dates are these terms not used these days!  |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 31, 2018 12:52:11 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed? I suppose its not the Elizabeth Line until its joined up. Shame we can't ditch that too, another piece of nonsense bequeathed to us by Boris. Sir Terry Morgan was chairman of Crossrail from 2009 until July when he was appointed by Grayling as chairman at HS2. Andrew Wolstenholme was Crossrail chief executive from 2011 until March when he joined BAE Systems. Did they jump because they knew what was coming? |
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Post by snoggle on Aug 31, 2018 13:08:43 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed? I suppose its not the Elizabeth Line until its joined up. Shame we can't ditch that too, another piece of nonsense bequeathed to us by Boris. Sir Terry Morgan was chairman of Crossrail from 2009 until July when he was appointed by Grayling as chairman at HS2. Andrew Wolstenholme was Crossrail chief executive from 2011 until March when he joined BAE Systems. Did they jump because they knew what was coming? Terry Morgan is shown as still being Crossrail Chairman. I believe the HS2 role is additional. The Lizzie Line branding does not kick in until the core tunnel service commences. Therefore it's delayed until Autumn 2019. |
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Post by snoggle on Aug 31, 2018 13:27:32 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed? By the time it's finished it will be the 'Charles Line' According to the BBC web page they are dealing with 'Three different signalling systems' Please don't tell me they've just discovered this? How much is the 'Project Manager' or not getting paid? Progress meetings-target dates are these terms not used these days! Anyone with a pair of eyes and some knowledge of what is needed to get a brand new railway service into service would know that this day was coming. I have been saying the final phase of completion, installation, commissioning, integration, handover, training and regulatory sign off was the most difficult bit of the project for well over 18 months. I'm no project manager but I've been client of enough projects and been involved in major projects to know this. Clearly things have been wrong for about 18-24 months but I expect there was a genuine belief that if sufficient money was thrown at the project that things could come right. However construction delays at three or four sites have been evident for a long while as has the radio silence in press releases etc. That was enough of a clue for me. Once the handover to the operators was delayed and then the testing phase was compressed it was inevitable the opening wouldn't happen. There was just too much to do and I could never see the TfL operations director for Crossrail (whose name escapes me) agreeing to take the hit of taking on a partly finished railway and then have the service fall to bits. No one on the project will have been unaware of the signalling integration issues - it was why the original project timescale was extended to Dec 2019. Remember the original plan was to open the whole lot this December! It is understandable that people are fed up / disappointed / cross / whatever BUT at least we have a decision now rather than 48 hours before a new timetable starts. The biggest issue for Crossrail will be to stop people going "phew, more time" rather than "keep going, keep going". There is still a lot to do and a bad winter could cause further problems. For me it is the knock on consequences which are the biggest issue - rescheduling the Liv St platform reconstruction works, pushing back the 7 car to 9 car extension process and possibly having to do it faster, being able to cope with the national rail timetable consequences for the planned May and Dec 2019 changes which are now pushed back to undefined dates. There are also all the impacts on the bus network for TfL to unravel and schedule plus the financial consequences. It's a bit of a mess and it's a shame but it's certainly not a surprise. |
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Antje
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Post by Antje on Aug 31, 2018 13:42:24 GMT
Sadly, I will likely not make it to Autumn 2019. It is likely that I will be in the Republic of Ireland, or… well, we’ll see where my deteriorating health will take me…
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Post by silenthunter on Aug 31, 2018 14:57:56 GMT
So will the rebranding of the existing services to Elizabeth Line also be delayed? By the time it's finished it will be the 'Charles Line' According to the BBC web page they are dealing with 'Three different signalling systems' Please don't tell me they've just discovered this? How much is the 'Project Manager' or not getting paid? Progress meetings-target dates are these terms not used these days! The signalling issues are known already; there's 'traditional' TPWS on the GE Electric Lines, ATP on the GWR section and the Heathrow branch has ETCS, which is also going on the central core. I may be wrong on that, so please correct me.
Antje: I'm really sorry to hear that. |
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Post by roybadami on Aug 31, 2018 15:12:06 GMT
There's no ATP(GW) used. The three systems are traditional signalling (AWS/TPWS), ETCS, and Trainguard MT (to provide moving block signaling in the core.
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Post by silenthunter on Aug 31, 2018 15:16:51 GMT
Well, two out of three ain't bad...
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 31, 2018 15:32:58 GMT
Some workers on the project have called it the "Hokey Cokey" Line, no sooner have they put something in they have to take it back out again.
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Post by abe on Sept 2, 2018 7:04:14 GMT
OT for this thread, but an interesting statement in the linked article about lighting: I haven’t seen mention of this type of system on Crossrail before... |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 2, 2018 8:20:32 GMT
There's no ATP(GW) used. The three systems are traditional signalling (AWS/TPWS), ETCS, and Trainguard MT (to provide moving block signaling in the core. This discussion has also been happening on Twitter: Click/tap here if embedded tweet fails to display. |
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Post by countryman on Sept 2, 2018 8:29:01 GMT
It's a shame but no surprise that it is late. Let's hope that it doesn't turn out to be such a farce and national embarrassment that Berlin's Brandenburg airport has become for Germany!!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2018 12:00:18 GMT
Because in this day and age everyone is a terrorist or criminal.  |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 2, 2018 13:19:06 GMT
There's no ATP(GW) used. The three systems are traditional signalling (AWS/TPWS), ETCS, and Trainguard MT (to provide moving block signaling in the core. This discussion has also been happening on Twitter: Click/tap here if embedded tweet fails to display. The Chief Inspector of Railways at ORR confirms no ATP: Click/tap here if embedded tweet fails to display. |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 6, 2018 12:41:36 GMT
Confirmation that the root cause of the delays are the substations that went bang. Click/tap here if embedded tweet fails to display. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 13:24:37 GMT
Or just a convenient point of blame?
I'm rather disappointed with this delay, as I won't be living in London or UK by then :-(
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Post by superteacher on Sept 6, 2018 13:27:59 GMT
Or just a convenient point of blame? I'm rather disappointed with this delay, as I won't be living in London or UK by then :-( It does make sense though. I believe that the core signalling is also a reason, |
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class411
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Post by class411 on Sept 6, 2018 14:14:59 GMT
Or just a convenient point of blame? Indeed. Even if they are custom devices it seems a long time to source new ones. They are not the most complicated of components. |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 6, 2018 15:42:33 GMT
Or just a convenient point of blame? I'm rather disappointed with this delay, as I won't be living in London or UK by then :-( It does make sense though. I believe that the core signalling is also a reason, The article explains that the substation problems delayed the start of testing, which means they haven't got rid of the signalling gremlins. If it hadn't gone pop, testing would have started earlier and the signalling issues should have been solved by now. |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Sept 6, 2018 16:47:12 GMT
I wonder if someone's insurers are going to be taking a hit regarding that "pop"?
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