S stock delivery & introduction - discussion

My 1st post please no flaming !

Last week was not the best on the S stock however it seems to be teething problems.

Monday – On at Northwood Hills at North Harrow front carriage doors did not open – ended up waiving at the punters on the platform telling them to go down to the next carriage. When we got to Harrow the train got taken out of service, however again the front carriage doors did not open and had to call out to the other passengers to tell them to turn round and exit so we could get out.

Tuesday - got on a Finchley road however looks like the train stopped slightly north of the point and so the front doors would not open. Had to fight my way though from the 2nd carriage back to the 1st most travellers have not worked out that you can move between carriages and are still bunching up at the door they get in. Unfortunately the front doors would not open again all the way to Harrow and a few passengers were stuck not able to get off at their stop as they did not release you have to move down however compounded by the fact other passengers do not realise they have to move out of the way. Once we got to North Harrow the doors were back in operation.

Wednesday – yes you guessed it I was on the one that detrained at Neasden.

The “big” reported problems to me are life when you have new stock, I am sure they will sort out the gapping and get the voltage right once all is over. The door thing is starting to frustrate. I guess (I can only guess as I don’t ride in the pointy bit) that if you don’t stop on a pin the front doors are locked as this has happened on trains that I have been on at least 8 times. I am sure me and the other punters will get used to it however it may need a few more prompts to tell people to move down or make way for others when it happens. I am sure even this will go away once drivers have got used to the stock under all conditions, although will the Met go all ATO ?

So as an average punter am I happy with the S stock, I would say yes. Will I miss the A’s to a degree however like everything it is progress that needed to happen.

I'm sure the S Stock will make it. After the agonies that the 73TS went through for years, it became one of the most reliable stocks on the system. Mind you, a lot of money was spent getting it right.

As for the S Stock door opening trouble, I found getting it to stop in the right place was difficult, and I was on the simulator! I thought it was just the simulator. If it's not and the real thing is also difficult to stop in the right place, the simulator was very good!

My impression was that the sighting is difficult but this will improve with practice. The other point is that, if the CSDE system is designed for future ATO, it will be set up for +/- 250mm. This will cause trains to lose time while drivers position the cab in the right place, like the Jubilee PED situation. Perhaps the range needs widening.

Oh yes, did anyone do gapping tests before letting the trains go into service?

21009/10 has been on Train 451 for the last 3 days (including today) although it was showing All Stations to Baker St when heading north from Harrow this morning! I also noticed that the driving car side display does show the train number intermittantly but none of the other cars do.

Train 441 was an UID S Stock yesterday to, seen going back to Neasden from Uxbridge on the way home last night

I saw 451 at Baker Street yesterday, and certainly the side displays in the middle of the train were saying '451 Metropolitan Line / Semi-Fast / Watford'

the 20's and the barriers do not leave ruislip depot until tommorow night (friday)

they used to transfer toinght (neasden-ruislip) but have often gone during the day

However I doubt that the non-stopping at Wembley Park selection would cause the scroller to say Wembley Park is closed.

ribbit - Just to double check, this was being said on the internal DMI's right?

That they were, so where have they been hiding since Wednesday night then? They usually leave the 20's etc where they were this morning.

The ones are Ruislip are different,these are 20189+20227
the ones at Neasden are the GB ones 20/3s
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They were reported to be next to West Ruislip Station

You know what it's like with a simulator, even one as good as ours just doesn't give you that 'seat of your pants' external feedback.
I don't have very much 'S' Stock handle turning time under my belt but took the train out a week or so ago (under the supervision of a qualified Instructor Operator naturally) and stopped on the mark every time without any issue. I think it is more a matter of confidence than expertise, because I am very familiar with the train systems I felt able to 'give it a handful'!!


This is an interim system brought in to cover the gap that ATO left when we retendered. It is envisaged that the system will be replaced with fully integrated functionality when the new system is brought in.


Yes, but the gapping study in this area is being revisited.

Yes, I wanted one more down to bolster our passenger service operations. We won't have another for a little while now as we have enough in London and want to allow testing outside of London to continue unhindered.

On the class 378s the windows are provided for emergency use only - ie if the train fails and it is hot outside. This prevents people smashing windows in the event of an aircon failure.

I have to admit I'm disappointed with the performance of the S Stock at the moment. My original post was edited for reasons unknown but on departure from Northwood Hills towards Northwood 35 mph took 30 seconds to achieve. A class 378 does this in 20 seconds.

Obviously it's capped to match the acceleration of an A stock with weak field flag up!

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That was the idea on the Thames Turbo( now FGW) Class 166 Turbos however nearly 20 years later the window latches are often broken windows remain open and the air-con is totally useless

I was on a Class 166 last Friday and I heard the air con kick in a couple of times with zilch effect. I bet it still has the original coolant in the system. Lets hope the S stock works like the Chiltern Turbos rather than the First Great Sweatstern Turbos

Xerces Fobe

The A stock pulls away like a snail- it'd be silly to have them uncapped or they'd be running on reds a little too often!

Also yes, the S stock power upgrade involves going to 750v- all axles motored + air con is a big power draw! That is probably another reason. PRJB? ;D

09ts are still matched down a little, you can feel it- they should have the same acceleration as a 92ts.