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Post by andypurk on Mar 25, 2010 20:47:38 GMT
there are quite a few dual voltage units around which have never used the ability, a prime example being the class 375/6 units with South Eastern. ....but, like the dc-only 378s (and the SWT Desiros), they don't have pantographs fitted. Similarly, north of the Thames Desiros could work on dc, but would need shoegear fitted As others have said, the 375/6 units were delivered complete with pantographs (and all the other AC kit), but only a couple ever ran under the wires for testing purposes. Some of the units have had the pantographs removed, but most still carry them. There were plans to used them on 'Thameslink' services when the class 377/5s were running late, but the modifications needed (due to differences between classes 375 and 377) were deemed too expensive compared to the cascade releasing 377/2s. A proportion of the London Midland class 350/1 Desiros did run as dual voltage units last year, to release the 377/2s. The shoe gear 'came with' the trains, as they were a modification of part of the original class 450 order. The shoe gear is/was stored in the Northampton depot. |
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Post by andypurk on Mar 25, 2010 20:51:52 GMT
Similarly, north of the Thames Desiros could work on dc, but would need shoegear fitted All of the 350/1s have shoegear, and some units ran on DC when they were used by Southern last year. Whilst all the units retain the shoe beam, the actual pick up shoes are stored off the units. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 25, 2010 21:28:05 GMT
All of the 350/1s have shoegear, and some units ran on DC when they were used by Southern last year. Whilst all the units retain the shoe beam, the actual pick up shoes are stored off the units. What about the Class 360s on Heathrow Connect and NEEA, neither of which can easily reach 3rd rail territory? |
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Post by andypurk on Mar 25, 2010 23:29:58 GMT
What about the Class 360s on Heathrow Connect and NEEA, neither of which can easily reach 3rd rail territory? These, together with the London Midland 350/2s, don't have DC capability. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2010 8:58:44 GMT
So why not make all new EMUs dual voltage? I know there is the extra cost when building them, but would the flexibility be worth it?
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Post by geebeezed on Mar 26, 2010 9:33:15 GMT
It would BUT there is the issue of Electrical equipment not liking being disused, this will be a problem with Southern's 313s because Lover's walk isn't currently (pun intended) fitted with any 25k kit... Southeastern's 378s at least get tested every now and again but the Transformers still need regular oil changes, with the obvious extra cost. I would imagine they'll start to lose their overhead equipment in the fullness of time..
The class 442 units were built with ETH equipment with a view to loco haulage to Salisbury & beyond but I don't think anyone even tried it! When we were hauling the units out of Eastleigh I asked what would happen if I were to put the jumpers up... 'Either nothing or the mother of all explosions' was the reply!
What does mystify me in this advanced day & age is why everything isn't coupling compatible... It'd make life so much easier! But as usual a Buckeye and Blue Star isn't clever or complicated enough!
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Post by andypurk on Mar 26, 2010 11:26:33 GMT
It would BUT there is the issue of Electrical equipment not liking being disused, this will be a problem with Southern's 313s because Lover's walk isn't currently (pun intended) fitted with any 25k kit... Southeastern's 378s at least get tested every now and again but the Transformers still need regular oil changes, with the obvious extra cost. I would imagine they'll start to lose their overhead equipment in the fullness of time.. It is reported that Southern 313s will have their pantographs removed, to save on the maintenance costs of the AC equipment which will never be used. (BTW I think you mean Southeastern's 375s!!) Getting a bit off-topic now, but... The 442s ETH equipment certainly was used, during diversions from Basingstoke - Southampton via Laverstock Loop (Salisbury Area) in the years after introduction. Haulage was generally by class 33. It fell out of use once the Havant - St. Denys line was electrified, as this gave a electrified alternative route. Well, it was equally complicated in the past  Blue Star wasn't the only system in use. There was a range of systems in use for different EMU (and DMU) sets of classes. |
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Post by geebeezed on Mar 26, 2010 12:15:51 GMT
Yep, should've proof-read that shouldn't I?  At least back in the day, most vehicles had buffers and a coupling of some sort so rescue was usually easy. Back to 378s though, is/there any rescue plans planned should one sit down somewhere awkward? With the Tightlock fitted 313s, a Buckeye fitted loco could haul them with the adaptor kit (Which I'm presuming is carried as they are on SR units). Our GLVs carry a Dellner/Buckeye adaptor which is a 2 man job to fit, what are LOROL doing? Made me smile when the 378s were starting to be made ready for bringing down, 'Aha' we thought 'A Virgin 57 will do, those have got similar couplings'... And when they tried, seems the Virgin coupling as carried on Pendolinos is a couple of inches higher! Of course, no-one thought of this when they were converting the locos & theres no adjustment! (Railwayman goes AAAARRRGH!!) |
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Post by flippyff on Mar 28, 2010 22:05:57 GMT
I went from New Cross Gate to East Croydon this afternoon, there was a fairly regular LOROL service heading northbound with, much to my surprise, 378013 seen at Anerley heading north. Why was this being used?
Is platform 1 at NXG ever going to get a PIS to show the ELL services?
Simon
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Post by mcmaddog on Mar 29, 2010 8:39:21 GMT
Is platform 1 at NXG ever going to get a PIS to show the ELL services? I think the original one from the ELL is still there - I assume they're just continuing to use those. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2010 9:56:42 GMT
I went from New Cross Gate to East Croydon this afternoon, there was a fairly regular LOROL service heading northbound with, much to my surprise, 378013 seen at Anerley heading north. Why was this being used? Is platform 1 at NXG ever going to get a PIS to show the ELL services? Simon Seconded - I saw two 378s at Surrey Quays yesterday and I was only there for a short time (twice). What surprised me a bit was the elevation of the track alongside Oldfield Grove. I know there's a grade separated junction there now, but the northbound (from Croydon) track goes from being at embankment height near Reculver road to going underneath Rothehithe New Road. This must be a pretty steep gradient. |
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Post by mcmaddog on Mar 30, 2010 8:31:25 GMT
Is platform 1 at NXG ever going to get a PIS to show the ELL services? I think the original one from the ELL is still there - I assume they're just continuing to use those. I double checked this morning - it's definitely there, just not powered on. |
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Post by patstonuk on Mar 31, 2010 17:39:25 GMT
378226 on its way from Derby this evening. Thanks to TT who also reports 172002 has been seen today on the Litchurch Lane test track.
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Post by dpb on Mar 31, 2010 22:03:57 GMT
Footage of 378225 working in tandem with 378004 is on Youtube.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2010 7:42:06 GMT
Don't you mean in multiple?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2010 21:45:09 GMT
Hi.
I don't know if this has been posted yet, but 378023 and 378024 were both at Willesden today. 023 was at Kensal Green turnback siding and 024 was on the TMD. Don't know how long they've been here but it is the first time I've noticed them. I think that just leaves 001,002 and 004 and we've got the the lot!
Regards
Martin
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Post by andypurk on Apr 6, 2010 21:54:56 GMT
Hi. I don't know if this has been posted yet, but 378023 and 378024 were both at Willesden today. 023 was at Kensal Green turnback siding and 024 was on the TMD. Don't know how long they've been here but it is the first time I've noticed them. I think that just leaves 001,002 and 004 and we've got the the lot! I first noticed 023 at Willesden on 31st March. |
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Post by astock5000 on Apr 6, 2010 23:00:35 GMT
I don't know if this has been posted yet, but 378023 and 378024 were both at Willesden today. 023 was at Kensal Green turnback siding and 024 was on the TMD. Don't know how long they've been here but it is the first time I've noticed them. I think that just leaves 001,002 and 004 and we've got the the lot! 378023 was in service on the WLL: Have 020 - 022 entered service yet? Was 024 delivered to Willesden, or did it go to Ashford first? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2010 11:12:01 GMT
020, 021, 022 have all been in service, I don't have any dates though
024 was delivered to Ashford first where it did its mile accumulation on the DC and then headed to Willesden to do a small bit of AC
(all the units are now doing this sequence)
mercerandy on se-gen reports that 378024 has now finished all its mileage and is ready.
378227 was delivered to Ashford in the night - thats now the third dual voltage 4-car unit down there, some other news on se-gen was that 001 & 002 will now be delivered as 4-car straight away. Watford DC will utilise the 4 car bunch initially.
He also mentions some 378s being in Warm store (namely 010/011/018) this will be due to depot space whilst they still have the 8 313s for the Watford line.
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Post by dpb on Apr 7, 2010 12:36:25 GMT
I rode on 378021 yesterday from Gospel Oak to Willesden Junction, and then was fortunate enough to catch 378023 back from Shepherd's Bush to Willesden Junction. Also saw 378020 heading to Richmond whilst waiting for my Gospel Oak train at Willesden.
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Post by patstonuk on Apr 13, 2010 19:08:52 GMT
378228 reported on its way south from Derby this evening. Elsewhere, 378225-227 still at Ashford yesterday. Building up nicely for DC Lines services in due course?
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Post by astock5000 on Apr 13, 2010 21:52:36 GMT
Elsewhere, 378225-227 still at Ashford yesterday. Is 378004 still at Ashford? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2010 11:26:05 GMT
Elsewhere, 378225-227 still at Ashford yesterday. Is 378004 still at Ashford? Yes, well, its still down south of the river. Its been out with at least 225, its also been out on its own near New Cross - its been down there for a far lot longer than the other 3car commissions, so maybe they are using it for some testing? |
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Post by flippyff on Apr 24, 2010 19:52:50 GMT
As the 13:37(?) NXG to LBG arrived in platform 5 today I am sure I saw a 378 in platform 2 with another in platform 1. Was I seeing things?
Simon
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2010 21:33:47 GMT
Elsewhere, 378225-227 still at Ashford yesterday. Is 378004 still at Ashford? 378004 now in squadron service having had it on the 1300 Richmond-Gospel Oak on Thursday 22nd April. HTH Regards Martin |
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Post by flippyff on Apr 25, 2010 9:32:06 GMT
We can use platform 2 as well as platform 1 but its very rare to do so, there is a turnback siding just beyond the flyover on the Up Slow.....go in there and change ends and can then go into platforms 2,3,4,5 Its only really used in times of disruption at present. Thanks Vitesse. I had wondered if that turnback had been used yet. Simon |
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Post by pippy1505 on Apr 27, 2010 22:39:01 GMT
378002 en route to Ashford 27/04/10 5X78
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Post by astock5000 on May 22, 2010 23:01:19 GMT
He also mentions some 378s being in Warm store (namely 010/011/018) this will be due to depot space whilst they still have the 8 313s for the Watford line. 378011 is back in service, but I was at Willesden on friday, and the depot didn't seem as full as I would have expected (and no 378s were stabled at Watford), so are there any 378/0s that are not in service at the moment? Also, there doesn't seem to have been a delivery for several weeks. |
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Post by dazz285 on May 23, 2010 7:50:54 GMT
Whilst the block between Gospel Oak & Stratford is on 3 class 378/0's are being stored at the PRDC at Stonebridge Park.
Hope this sheds some light on things?
Can't help about the lack of deliveries I'm affraid.. all quiet on the western front ;-)
Everything goes over to Ashford and we never get to hear about them unless posted on hear etc..
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2010 1:37:09 GMT
Also, there doesn't seem to have been a delivery for several weeks. The delivery situation with the 378 appear to be; 378202 378225 378226 378227 378228 378229 378230 All of these have all been delivered to Chart Leacon the last one being 230 on 13th May - not sure if all those units are still at Ashford or if any have gone to New Cross? Its also been reported that the 313s on the DC lines won't swap to 378's on June 1st like proposed - infact a 313 that was going off lease has had to be retained to get back to 8 units. Perhaps thye thought trying to reopening the full NLL, changing the GOBLIN to 15 minute peak trains with a loaned unit AND swapping the DC 313's to 378's ALL on the same day would be asking for trouble! |
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Blue Star wasn't the only system in use. There was a range of systems in use for different EMU (and DMU) sets of classes.
At least back in the day, most vehicles had buffers and a coupling of some sort so rescue was usually easy.
