solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 21, 2006 21:34:01 GMT
'C' Stock were refurbished by RFS in Doncaster (1992 onwards) was a big improvement IMHO. Now now - I would expect you to know that it was 199 1 onwards ;D ;D ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Sept 15, 2006 18:44:16 GMT
The 09ts and 'S' Stock are going to utilise an RKL220 type key, but one that is more robust. As I am so important I got to choose which colour the fobs will be! Just in case your wondering, they are going to be yellow (how original!). That is the Circle Line in you still crying to be released ;D ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Feb 15, 2006 19:21:36 GMT
There was also a trial red half front 62 stock, which I thought looked quite good, which ran on the Central line for a while. Ahh - you mean the one on my website (albeit in B&W) here ;D These were done after the 73 stock arrived, but there were only the 2 cabs done. I must agree - they did look good though.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Feb 15, 2006 0:25:35 GMT
Couldn't it just be that it's part of LU's livery? Is it definitely safety motivated? Ahh - but the red half front cabs were introduced with the 1973 stock, and were introduced purely to increase the sighting of the train by staff working on the track.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 25, 2006 21:39:22 GMT
I think one of the major problems with getting drivers to e-mail suggestions is that most drivers are not interested in the job once they are finished work. Since there are only very limited numbers of drivers who have access to internal e-mail, the responses will always be limited. Perhaps, and this is only a quick suggestion, if a questionnaire was put out offering drivers some of the options available, for example, and asking them to choose which they would prefer, there may be more response. Although, thinking about it, there is also the element, particularly at the East End of the line (OK - Upminster then ) where drivers think 'well - it won't affect me as I'll be gone before the new trains arrive' ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Jul 31, 2006 7:03:02 GMT
Low - is the warmer of the three settings Medium - well it's the in between setting ;D High - is the coolest setting I think thats the right way round ;D Are you sure? I thought low was lowest temperature! Where's Solidbond? Did somebody call? ;D Although the original information we were given, and the original version of the refurb handbook showed the air con to be as Colin described, the actual situation, as amended in the update pack to the refurb handbook, is as adw describes. So, LOW is the coldest setting and High is the warmest setting. I have got some more technical info at Upminster on how the whole system works. I will try to get a copy and give the actual details later this week.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Jun 13, 2006 21:47:08 GMT
Only just entering this thread, so forgive me if I've missed it being discussed already (I haven't had time to read the entire thread!). Can I ask that the PEA's are placed at a decent height away from kids? Since the refurbs were introduced on the District with much lower PEA points, I've been pulled down 6 times, and every time it has been a child playing with the handle! The last occurance of this was yesterday on the Ealing-Acton shuttle having to force my way through a pcked car 6 to find the activated handle! If you look at the CIS display, when a Pass Alarm is pulled, not only will it tell you in which car the alarm has been pulled, but it will also tell you which handle has been pulled, numbered from 1 to 5 from the front of the train
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Jun 13, 2006 21:38:22 GMT
Can I ask that the PEA's are placed at a decent height away from kids? Since the refurbs were introduced on the District with much lower PEA points, I've been pulled down 6 times, and every time it has been a child playing with the handle! I know what your saying but it is a difficult compromise to reach (no pun intended!). We are bound by RVAR on the the issue of handles in RVAR compliant areas. They are buttons now and not handles, Not on the refurb D stocks they aren't!! All handles on there
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 26, 2005 21:32:22 GMT
Yes Q8 sorry sleet loco not de-icers, they were indeed extremely fast and extremely heavy, only trouble was the westinghouse brakes in the snow,no saviour with EP,hence the large dents in Hainult depot shutters, oops! I had the privilege of being one of the last 4 drivers on the Central line to be refreshed on the sleet locos. I did the training on a (Buckshee!) Sunday at Hainault in April 1984 or 85. It was the last Sunday of the 'winter' season, and the following month the locos were scrapped. (And they'd only just repainted them as well )
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Nov 18, 2006 22:37:07 GMT
Not a T/op myself, but can imagine that the flash must be pretty intense on the eyes when coming out of a dark tunnel. It is pretty insignificant compared to the arcing of passing trains in the tunnels Try having 27 flashes from 'proper' cameras, not pocket cameras, all going off at the same time, and you may change your opinion I had that some years ago when entering Victoria Westbound. In case you're wondering how I know EXACTLY how many flashes there were, after I stopped partway down the platform, blasted the whistle, then finally pulled into the platform, someone approached the cab and knocked on the door. I opened the door, and was asked if there was a problem. When I explained that I had just been blinded by a load of flashguns, he apologised and said that he was with - wait for it - LU Press and Public Relations, and was escorting 27 Japanese tourists around, and they didn't speak English . I did wonder what the hell was the point of him being with them if they didn't speak English and he didn't speak Japanese
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Nov 5, 2005 23:55:42 GMT
At first glance, I thought it looked like Father Jack Hackett ;D Drrrink ;D ;D ;D Sorry ADW, I couldn't resist I am partial to a few drinks ;D But not more than 7 units if I'm working tomorrow In that case, check your PMs ;D
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solidbond
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96TS
Jun 8, 2005 21:05:04 GMT
Post by solidbond on Jun 8, 2005 21:05:04 GMT
The depot staff used to hate us 'little train' drivers anyway! Especially Neasden tower who used to have nice conversations with the A stocks when giving them stabling instructions ("Good evening driver, can you stable the train on shed road 35, off juice please? Thank you driver"), but when we called up it was just "59 north" if they answered the radio at all! A lot of the time they'd completely ignore us, and when we rang him he'd say "can you not just follow the white lights, driver?" [meaning the shunt signals]. You sure that wasn't just you? ;D ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Jun 14, 2007 18:47:32 GMT
If you read the RAIB report of the incident, it seems that it was the train from the High Barnet platform which went in the wrong direction, which would mean it was the same train that had been routed into the wrong platform. Therefore it must have been the driver who hadn't accepted the incorrect signal that ended up going the wrong way. In other words, it seems that both drivers had made a mistake - one taking the wrong signal, the other heading in the wrong direction.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 19, 2005 19:44:39 GMT
Heh, well, 5 out of 9 isn't too bad for something like that So the revised list is: 2 at Upminster w/b 1 at Barking w/b 1 at Aldgate East e/b 1 at Minories w/b 1 at HSK DR w/b 1 at Earls Court e/b 1 at Acton Town e/b 1 at Ealing Broadway e/b (I don't know how I managed to mess this one up...) Not quite ;D There isn't one at Earl's Court, but there is one at Hanger Lane Jct E/B
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 19, 2005 18:04:30 GMT
trainopd78 once went into road-learning mode and posted the locations of all nine sets on the District. I think they are as follows: 2 at Upminster w/b 1 at Aldgate East e/b 1 at Minories w/b 1 at Tower Hill w/b 1 at Mansion House w/b 1 at Earls Court e/b 1 at Hanger Lane e/b 1 at Ealing Broadway w/b Someone else posted a list for the Piccadilly, but I don't know what it stated. A few errors in that list There are no Spring Toggle points at Tower Hill, Mansion House or Earl's Court. There are however, as Q8 says, a set at the bottom of the flyover leaving Barking W/B. The other 2 sets are at High Street Ken W/B, where the Edgware Road branch joins the roads from pfms 3 & 4, and also approaching Acton Town on the E/B, where the Picc fast from Northfields crosses to the local line. Also the Ealing Broadway set are on the E/B where pfm 7 joins the other lines.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 14, 2005 21:17:27 GMT
Yes, I believe that is exactly what the problem is. I believe, from what I have read elsewhere, that the problem is twofold. 1. The tripcocks 'resetting' themselves, as was shown on the BBC news item 2. The pressure switches, (more specifically, pressure switch 3 ;D) which should set up a 3 minute time-delay, not working correctly
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 14, 2005 20:20:24 GMT
The BBC local news tonight had a pretty good explanation of the tripcock system and they filmed a Northern line train being tripped in the depot. Now all our passengers will know what a tripcock is! Although what I found 'interesting' was that, despite the train being tripped, the tripcock didn't latch back - probably because of the low speed - but isn't that part of the problem with the Northern line stock?
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Oct 5, 2005 7:16:59 GMT
There is also one at Upminster (52 road), and IIRC one at Neasden. Not quite - The new wheel lathe is in the new sheds being built alongside 49 road at Upminster. The thing on 52 road at Upminster is a Wheel Monitoring equipment shed ;D It checks the profiles of the wheels, records them on computer, and when the train goes into the new lathe, which then knows exactly what adjustments need to be made to the wheels.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Sept 12, 2005 7:11:21 GMT
Then if someone was overcarried it wouldn't be a major H&S issue, just get off when you're back in the station and change platforms. Actually it would be a H&S issue! The instruction to detrain each car individually is issued to LUL by HMRI. It is therefore a legal requirement, is part of LUL's safety case, and has been so since the Liverpool Street incident. Anyone that does not carry out this procedure correctly, is effectively committing an offence. Absoutely correct Colin - and it is the reason that we have an Upminster driver pending a DB (disciplinary board) for not detraining correctly at Parsons Green, and then lying about it.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 9, 2005 18:41:28 GMT
IIRC the District line alone has 8 sets of spring and toggle points, but they are only ever traversed in the same direction and are all at converging junctions. To run over them the wrong way, they must be scotched and clipped. Nearly right - there are actually 9, although at 8 locations ;D These are - 2 sets at Upminster; Barking; Aldgate East E/B, Minories Jct W/B; High St Ken W/B District; Acton Town E/B (on the approach to Acton); Hanger Lane Jct E/B; Ealing Broadway E/B
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 9, 2005 6:02:12 GMT
With reference to Covent Garden, I'm thinking of the old X-over at North Ealing (controlled from a ground frame) that remained until the late 1960s. Would it be possible, in today's environment, to have a very 'basic' X-over (possibly secured by clips & scotches or similar during regular 'through' working) for emergency reversing? I'm thinking of trains being tipped-out at Leicester Sq or Holborn (allowing passengers to transfer to other lines) and reversing empty at Covent Garden. I would think it possible, (although unlikely in a tunnel), as that is exactly what was used at Royal Oak to allow the H&C to run from Hammersmith to Paddington while Edgware Road was out of use. The only problem with that is that the X-over is hand-worked, hence the reason why it would be unlikely to be usable in a tunnel.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 9, 2005 18:41:28 GMT
IIRC the District line alone has 8 sets of spring and toggle points, but they are only ever traversed in the same direction and are all at converging junctions. To run over them the wrong way, they must be scotched and clipped. Nearly right - there are actually 9, although at 8 locations ;D These are - 2 sets at Upminster; Barking; Aldgate East E/B, Minories Jct W/B; High St Ken W/B District; Acton Town E/B (on the approach to Acton); Hanger Lane Jct E/B; Ealing Broadway E/B
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Aug 9, 2005 6:02:12 GMT
With reference to Covent Garden, I'm thinking of the old X-over at North Ealing (controlled from a ground frame) that remained until the late 1960s. Would it be possible, in today's environment, to have a very 'basic' X-over (possibly secured by clips & scotches or similar during regular 'through' working) for emergency reversing? I'm thinking of trains being tipped-out at Leicester Sq or Holborn (allowing passengers to transfer to other lines) and reversing empty at Covent Garden. I would think it possible, (although unlikely in a tunnel), as that is exactly what was used at Royal Oak to allow the H&C to run from Hammersmith to Paddington while Edgware Road was out of use. The only problem with that is that the X-over is hand-worked, hence the reason why it would be unlikely to be usable in a tunnel.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Sept 7, 2005 20:44:08 GMT
Indeed the platform was widened, and what is currently the Eastbound platform was the location of the running line. One other problem - if they started using the original platform 4, where would they put all the 'Platform for Art' displays? ;D ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Mar 11, 2008 8:03:10 GMT
I seem to recall the one that rode up on to of the buffer stops in Hammersmith many years ago was scrapped. I have seen a photo of it! Was the West Ham Bombing one scrapped but another one order as part of the C77 batch? Yes. 5585 is actually a C77 DM numbered in the C69 series to replace the original 5585. You are of course correct about 5585, although it is actually a hybrid car, ss parts of the original 5585 were salvaged and used for the replacement car, plus of course the trailer is still the original car. As to other units being scrapped, up until at least 2004, there were 46 complete trains of C stock available, although one unit, 5506, had been robbed of so many parts that it was going to be scrapped, but the depot then spent about four months putting it all back together again As to the buffer stop collision units, there was one about a year ago, which I posted some pictures of herebut none of them have been scrapped as of last year.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Mar 11, 2008 0:11:08 GMT
ah-yes, you're right! It was 35 1/3 C69 and 11 C77! Not sure about today. The 1/3 ceased to be available in about 1993, when unit 5606/6606 was scrapped, due to non-standard motoring equipment. That left 105 units of C69 (=35 trains) and the 33 units of C77 (=11 trains) Obviously, the number of available units was reduced as a result of July 7th 2005.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Feb 11, 2008 18:05:00 GMT
I'll try and answer some of the questions raised here The C stocks continued to run to Neasden on nights until well after Baker St Met depot closed, which was in 1993. They still ran to Neasden when I left Edgware Road depot in Oct 1995, but I'm not sure exactly when they stopped running. I do believe it was in connection with the introduction of the 96 stock, to create additional stabling room in the depot. There were five trains booked to run to Neasden each night, with some running up the Jubilee and into depot from Neasden, some running fast up the Met to Wembley then into depot, and I believe there were even some which ran to Wembley up the Jubilee. In the morning, as already mentioned, some came down the Jubilee and some came down the Met. Regarding the sole bar on C stock, it is deeper than the A stock, in that it has to provide additional strength due to the extra doorways, and thus the bottom is indeed lower than the A stock. The problem was first discovered many years ago when there severe flooding in Central London, and a C stock was diverted to Harrow. On its way out of the siding the driver called the controller to say that the train had hit the platform. When the controller told the driver to go slower, the driver explained that he was only doing about 1mph as it was The problem came about, I believe, due to the use of metric nosing stones on the platforms, the same problem as at the East End of the District.
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Apr 19, 2007 22:20:49 GMT
Something else I've only just noticed about those pics is where the 'boundary' for the roof/body is. You'll notice that the beading between the roof and body on the prototype is painted in the body colour, but on the final product it is painted in the roof colour
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Apr 19, 2007 22:17:23 GMT
In view of the thread under "Metropolitan" about A stock liveries, I thought I'd post these pictures of the C stock unit in prototype corporate livery (options for the refurb interiors were also contained in these cars). Did they actually run in service like this ? Nice pictures Aspect They did indeed run in service, although only ever as a middle unit. Since they were the prototype for the refurb programme, the unit was fitted with a Spring Applied Parking Brake. As a result, the unit was not allowed to run at the end of a unit, as the SAPB was designed to stop a unit rolling, but the hydraulic handbrake fitted to the other C stock units was designed to stop a whole train from rolling. Therefore the unit wasn't allowed to run at the end of a train as once the train was stabled the driver would not be able to apply the handbrake on that unit (as there wasn't one!) and the SAPB wasn't enough to prevent the train from rolling. I have to say, one thing that always amused me about the C stock Rolling Stock Notice was that it stated 'One Handbrake will hold a fully loaded train on the steepest gradient ....... when stabling at Parsons Green two handbrakes must be applied' ;D ;D
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solidbond
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Post by solidbond on Apr 3, 2007 23:32:26 GMT
It says lack of trains; What about that one that bashed the stops at Hammer 9 road? Is that still there? I'm on ATOR this week and had the C stock refresher at Hammersmith on sunday (as trainers don't work bank holidays : Oi - I'll have you know I am doing training next Monday - unless of course you are referring to Ashfield House trainers Actually, the reason boils down to a union agreement that as many staff as possible should be booked off on Bank Holidays. So, even though they keep increasing the Bank Holiday service (remember - it used to be a Sunday service, now it is a Saturday service : there is still no training carried out on a Bank Holiday (well, except for me next Monday ;D ;D)
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