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Post by goldenarrow on Aug 28, 2019 17:42:23 GMT
Due to the planned commissioning of SMA 1 & 2, the latter encompassing the Metropolitan line between Finchley Road and Euston Square, crew availability issues will persist from Monday 2nd to Thursday 5th September.
As a result there will be a reduced service on the entire line for the aforementioned dates.
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 28, 2019 19:52:22 GMT
Oh joy, just when everyone is back at work (and school) after the holidays!
Why could this not have been even a week earlier, which means this week which is a Bank Holiday week?
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Post by Dstock7080 on Aug 28, 2019 19:57:28 GMT
Why could this not have been even a week earlier, which means this week which is a Bank Holiday week? Three words: Notting Hill Carnival |
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Post by superteacher on Aug 28, 2019 21:21:41 GMT
What’s the issue with using the terminal platforms?
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Post by MoreToJack on Aug 29, 2019 0:26:43 GMT
Why could this not have been even a week earlier, which means this week which is a Bank Holiday week? Three words: Notting Hill Carnival The irony is that Carnival might have gone a whole lot better if CBTC had gone live! Certainly on the C&H services were affected all day BH Monday by a signal track circuit failing at Edgware Road; a type of failure that won't occur under CBTC. (Slightly tongue in cheek!) |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2019 16:18:44 GMT
Your right but then it be boring
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Post by metrider on Aug 30, 2019 21:32:14 GMT
What’s the issue with using the terminal platforms? ... and what percentage of trains will be running? ...Is it a straight cancellation of all Baker St reversers or are they managing to squeeze more trains down to Aldgate. My interest is that I'm currently suffering from reduced mobility (entirely different issues with each leg) and one of my coping strategies is to board a Baker St starter where I can choose my seating to steady one of my legs against the carriage wall. There is little chance of me getting a suitable seat on a through service at Baker street (or when changing from the Jubilee at Finchley Road). |
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Post by croxleyn on Aug 31, 2019 16:17:35 GMT
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Post by goldenarrow on Aug 31, 2019 19:28:45 GMT
What’s the issue with using the terminal platforms? ... and what percentage of trains will be running? ...Is it a straight cancellation of all Baker St reversers or are they managing to squeeze more trains down to Aldgate. Two factors will determine this, one technical, one logistical. The issues with the terminal platforms at Baker Street may or may not come to be a hindrance as this weekend's final round of testing ensues. The logistical factor may come to be more disruptive if there aren't enough CBTC trained operators to operate the service which has limited testing hours in the past. |
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Post by metrider on Sept 1, 2019 6:54:12 GMT
(off topic)Thanks for the suggestion and i've already thought of that (but I wasn't aware there was a formal signup). However as it's not just 'a seat' but the 'right kind' of seat I need - it would get a bit awkward if in some situations if an unsuitable seat is offered. Hopefully both my conditions are temporary (bur probably several more months not days, one involving minor surgery that I've had to defer to to a significant bereavement earlier in the year). (Back on topic) goldenarrowSo are we saying that there are plans of a few service patterns that thin out the service to cope with the situations that might arise, and that these with be activated on the fly to provide the best service that the service controller feels he can do with reasonable reliability? - Is that an educated guess or hard knowledge? |
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DWS
every second count's
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Post by DWS on Sept 1, 2019 10:29:08 GMT
(off topic)Thanks for the suggestion and i've already thought of that (but I wasn't aware there was a formal signup). However as it's not just 'a seat' but the 'right kind' of seat I need - it would get a bit awkward if in some situations if an unsuitable seat is offered. Hopefully both my conditions are temporary (bur probably several more months not days, one involving minor surgery that I've had to defer to to a significant bereavement earlier in the year). (Back on topic) goldenarrow So are we saying that there are plans of a few service patterns that thin out the service to cope with the situations that might arise, and that these with be activated on the fly to provide the best service that the service controller feels he can do with reasonable reliability? - Is that an educated guess or hard knowledge? I believe it's an issue with training of Metropolitan Line train operators, not all will have experienced the CBTC in a service time table unlike the Hammersmith & City and Circle train operators. Instructor Train Operators will be in great demand and it will be very hectic for them this week.. |
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Post by scheduler on Sept 1, 2019 11:27:19 GMT
Totally agree with what's been said. The logistics issue regarding trained operators is the biggest issue.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 1, 2019 11:45:07 GMT
I’m looking forward to the reason TFL give for the reduced service. It’s a poor show that the introduction of SMA1 / 2 is running some way behind schedule yet they still didn’t ensure that enough Met line drivers were trained.
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Post by metrider on Sept 1, 2019 12:54:16 GMT
... I believe it's an issue with training of Metropolitan Line train operators, not all will have experienced the CBTC in a service time table unlike the Hammersmith & City and Circle train operators. Instructor Train Operators will be in great demand and it will be very hectic for them this week.. How much time will it take with an instructor to add the CBTC endorsement (or whatever the qualification is called) for an existing, otherwise experienced train op? They are only talking about four days reduced service... Will they really have enough suitably trained train ops at then of that to fun a normal service? I can imaging it dragging on silently with some minor disruption (cancellations?) beyond that...... Of course the public service status will be hard wired to " Good Service" throughout.... |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Sept 1, 2019 13:42:33 GMT
The issues with the terminal platforms at Baker Street may or may not come to be a hindrance as this weekend's final round of testing ensues. The logistical factor may come to be more disruptive if there aren't enough CBTC trained operators to operate the service which has limited testing hours in the past. It's not being tested this weekend - it's going live this weekend. In fact trains have been running in service with passengers on for some two hours now (not advertised as it's a "soft start"). How much time will it take with an instructor to add the CBTC endorsement (or whatever the qualification is called) for an existing, otherwise experienced train op? They are only talking about four days reduced service... Will they really have enough suitably trained train ops at then of that to fun a normal service? I can imaging it dragging on silently with some minor disruption (cancellations?) beyond that...... Of course the public service status will be hard wired to " Good Service" throughout.... The minimum is six trips with the support of an Instructor Operator, two of which must be manually driven. It will be up to drivers to deem themselves competent once the minimum number of trips are completed. You can't really count Finchley Road to Baker Street as a trip so presumably the idea is that with all trains running through, drivers will be "signed off" quicker as they'll get their six trips by doing Finchley Road to Euston Square six times in three rounders. Once enough are signed off, reversing at Baker street won't be such an issue. Incidentally District line drivers doing Paddington to Edgware Road will coninue to have Instructor Operator support for some time as they won't be doing their sign off trips till SMA3 goes live (Stepney to Monument). |
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DWS
every second count's
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Post by DWS on Sept 1, 2019 16:31:14 GMT
The issues with the terminal platforms at Baker Street may or may not come to be a hindrance as this weekend's final round of testing ensues. The logistical factor may come to be more disruptive if there aren't enough CBTC trained operators to operate the service which has limited testing hours in the past. It's not being tested this weekend - it's going live this weekend. In fact trains have been running in service with passengers on for some two hours now (not advertised as it's a "soft start"). How much time will it take with an instructor to add the CBTC endorsement (or whatever the qualification is called) for an existing, otherwise experienced train op? They are only talking about four days reduced service... Will they really have enough suitably trained train ops at then of that to fun a normal service? I can imaging it dragging on silently with some minor disruption (cancellations?) beyond that...... Of course the public service status will be hard wired to " Good Service" throughout.... The minimum is six trips with the support of an Instructor Operator, two of which must be manually driven. It will be up to drivers to deem themselves competent once the minimum number of trips are completed. You can't really count Finchley Road to Baker Street as a trip so presumably the idea is that with all trains running through, drivers will be "signed off" quicker as they'll get their six trips by doing Finchley Road to Euston Square six times in three rounders. Once enough are signed off, reversing at Baker street won't be such an issue. Incidentally District line drivers doing Paddington to Edgware Road will coninue to have Instructor Operator support for some time as they won't be doing their sign off trips till SMA3 goes live (Stepney to Monument). Did the number of Instructor Operators employed on the District line increase for the 4LM (CBTC) project ? |
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Post by Colin on Sept 1, 2019 16:53:44 GMT
No.
Each depot has a number of “project pool” drivers. These are extra drivers over and above the normal depot establishment and are funded by the 4LM budget.
Each depot’s project pool is made up of newly promoted drivers that are initially ring fenced to their project pool role and will then move on to more permanent positions around the combine once they’re released by the 4LM program.
The project pool drivers fill the gaps created by rostered drivers doing their CBTC training or Instructors released to provide support at migration boundaries.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 1, 2019 19:24:02 GMT
Still no concrete word regarding the service tomorrow, not helped by a very vague message on the Twitter feed!
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 1, 2019 20:00:56 GMT
Incidentally District line drivers doing Paddington to Edgware Road will coninue to have Instructor Operator support for some time as they won't be doing their sign off trips till SMA3 goes live (Stepney to Monument). Good to see the Green/Maroon rivalry is still going strong! |
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Post by cooperman on Sept 1, 2019 23:40:48 GMT
Still no concrete word regarding the service tomorrow, not helped by a very vague message on the Twitter feed! It's going to be a right Nightmare . Well done TFL |
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DWS
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Post by DWS on Sept 2, 2019 5:30:15 GMT
Monday 2 September 2019 , 06:30 Metropolitan Line Severe delays while we establish our new signalling system. 😡
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Post by a60 on Sept 2, 2019 6:30:33 GMT
I knew it was going to be pretty woeful. I was thinking about working from home, but as it’s month end for our accounts so that’s not an option. Dependent on how today goes, I might book a hotel in Southwark for the rest of the week because the journey from Chesham even with the regular service is hard enough going without this added into the mix.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Sept 2, 2019 9:02:48 GMT
Did the number of Instructor Operators employed on the District line increase for the 4LM (CBTC) project ? If the District is anything like the Central Line then the number of IOps has decreased in the last few years as very few drivers seem interested in doing it, they only get paid £2365 more than TOps (4.2%). Its boring enough driving a train, spending the day watching someone else drive a train must be mind-numbing! |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Sept 2, 2019 9:33:25 GMT
The District has a full compliment of I/O’s - 10% of each depot as per the company’s standard ratio.
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Post by edb on Sept 2, 2019 14:15:00 GMT
I knew it was going to be pretty woeful. I was thinking about working from home, but as it’s month end for our accounts so that’s not an option. Dependent on how today goes, I might book a hotel in Southwark for the rest of the week because the journey from Chesham even with the regular service is hard enough going without this added into the mix. Someone's got some budget...  Having just moved from central Chesham to the wilds of Wigginton, I'm glad I'm not still walking to the station, as I saw the crowds huddled outside I quickly decided to drive onwards to Chalfont. I can imagine the only guy who was happy this morning was the coffee guy in the carpark... |
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Post by t697 on Sept 2, 2019 17:04:35 GMT
My experience; Left for work about an hour earlier than usual. Service was slow but not terrible. About 5 - 10 mins slower than normal. Return this evening a little better but slow KX - ESQ.
The run into Baker St Met platforms is a bit smoother now without the speed control trainstops as definite spot checks. Door release noticeably slow at ATC platforms.
Word of the week; 'Establish'. The special announcements at stations and on notices are full of it!
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Post by superteacher on Sept 2, 2019 17:32:28 GMT
By using the word “establish”, the announcements imply that the signalling will be complete. Most passengers won’t believe that this level of disruption is only for one section of the upgrade!
I just wish TFL would provide open and honest information. It would really help them and the average passenger.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 2, 2019 18:18:13 GMT
Due to the planned commissioning of SMA 1 & 2, the latter encompassing the Metropolitan line between Finchley Road and Euston Square, platforms 1 or 4 at Baker Street are expected to be out of commission from Monday 2nd to Thursday 5th September. Platforms 1 and 4 have been in operation all day today. |
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Post by metrider on Sept 2, 2019 19:06:20 GMT
....Door release noticeably slow at ATC platforms.... Oh dear! are we in for that now? It still annoys me that the Jubilee pauses for maximum contempt when it comes to rest before opening the doors. Other passengers customers stab hopefully at the inside door buttons (that have been disconnected for years) in vain hope!. It amazes me how some simple things like that are screwed up by supposedly better systems. Another example is that Oyster PAYG usually opens the barrier without a perceptible delay. Bank card contactless pauses for maybe half a second. And what is pushed in all of the announcements? contactless.... Given that all of these seconds (whether it be door opening or getting through the barriers) add up - surely they must have an impact on capacity. Thanks to those who responded to my earlier enquires in this thread - really useful info. Me - I bugged out of the Met and used the Chiltern instead today - Tomorrow I'll not travel at all. |
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Post by Colin on Sept 2, 2019 19:10:48 GMT
The door open delay is because the system needs to confirm the train is stationary (and in the right place).
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