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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2011 17:53:31 GMT
Back last year I had a go at building a 1938 stock train in N scale, mainly just to see if it was possible. After a lot of work I came to the conclusion that in theory it was, but in practice there were too many problems with the method of construction. However, I still hoped to build an N scale tube train, especially as I had already bought a Kato Portram to power it. Having been following the development of 3D printing over the past few years, I've been wanting to have a go at using this new technique, and discovering that Sketchup can now be used to create models for Shapeways plus the release of the Frosted Ultra Detail material has spurred me into action. Instead of 1938 stock I'm trying a Northern line 1995 stock train this time, as the simpler shape is easier to create a computer model of. Designing the model to use the Frosted Ultra Detail material allows walls down to 0.3mm thick and details as fine as 0.1mm. There are a few corners which should be rounded but I have modelled sharp, due to the limitations of Sketchup/my skills with it. I'll sort these out on the real thing with a bit of wet and dry paper. The model consists of a separate body and chassis which should fit neatly together. It will be powered using the tiny Kato Portram motor bogies, which means the mechanism will not protrude above the height of the tops of the seats, and I may even be able to reduce it from that once I've seen how it all goes together on the real thing. So far I've ordered a single driving car from Shapeways which will hopefully arrive within the next few days. Once I've seen how it looks and checked it all goes together I'll think about ordering the rest of the train. The modular nature of the 1995 stock design means adapting it into an intermediate car should be an easy task. Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2011 13:04:35 GMT
That looks great Let us know how you get on. I am sure there are many on here that are interested in LU stock in N gauge. Ian
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metman
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Post by metman on Jun 2, 2011 19:37:04 GMT
Interested yes, but I may loose sanity trying..... Keep up the good work
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2011 19:48:55 GMT
An advantage would be the space that N scale takes up. A disadvantage is my myopic old eyes ability to cope with such small stuff. I struggle at times with OO! Quality work so far though. Excellent.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2011 21:20:23 GMT
An advantage would be the space that N scale takes up. A disadvantage is my myopic old eyes ability to cope with such small stuff. I struggle at times with OO! Quality work so far though. Excellent. Best stay away from T-gauge then!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 14:39:29 GMT
Easily scalable to OO gauge. Nice work and would really like to see the pics of the 3D printout!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 21:22:48 GMT
T scale is just silly! For those who haven't come across it (and it's easy to miss) the rails are a mere 3mm apart! Mind you, it would make a scale model of Clapham Junction feasable. Or even the entire Epping-Ongar line!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 14:23:28 GMT
The driving car arrived by courier this morning and it's a lovely little model. All the detail has come out as expected, and the surface is very smooth even on the curves. It needs some careful cleaning of the remaining yellow waxy residue though. A bit of light sanding and a few fine coats of primer should also improve it further. The chassis slightly resembles a banana, but the body is very rigid so when the two are together everything should be fine. I might putting it in warm water and gently bending back to shape too. Now I can get on with finishing and painting this car, and finishing the design for the intermediate vehicles. Some photos of the parts as delivered: Paul SE13 edit to change links into pictures.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 15:01:43 GMT
Very impressive, I think it would work great in OO scale too.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 15:34:17 GMT
Would it be transferable to 00 gauge, and how much was it, as I'd love to have 67/72TS for my 00 layout, which is under construction, it is going to be a fictional interchange station.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 17:28:55 GMT
The model would definitely work in OO scale, though for an OO version I'd want to make some changes to improve the detailing and modify the material thicknesses to keep the cost down. The N scale version cost £29 for the body, chassis and bogies. Because the price is by volume, which increases with the cube of an increase in scale, the cost would go up quite a bit for OO compared to N, though as mentioned above altering the design would keep the cost down as much as possible.
Paul
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metman
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Post by metman on Jun 29, 2011 17:30:02 GMT
Yes, I am planning to make kits of 67/72 stock to fit EFE chasis but this may be quicker! What sort of cost would we be looking at for the body in OO scale? It looks amazing btw!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 17:41:39 GMT
Yes, I am planning to make kits of 67/72 stock to fit EFE chasis but this may be quicker! What sort of cost would we be looking at for the body in OO scale? It looks amazing btw! If you do, would you mind adding a second one to the order? I'd pay accordingly.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 18:03:25 GMT
I think a tube car in OO would cost around £100, but that's a fairly rough guess, it's impossible to know exactly without designing and uploading the model. The price could be brought down further by using Frosted Detail rather than Frosted Ultra Detail, which does not allow quite such fine detail but would probably be fine in OO.
Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 20:33:48 GMT
Personally, I'm not fussed about super ultra fin detail, as long as it looks how it should, it suits me fine.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 20:38:42 GMT
I would love to see that with the (somewhat unrealistic) satin finish that Hornby and Bachmann, etc put on - makes a lovely model. I can't wait to see the pictures of the end result, probably look quite flash.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2011 23:53:28 GMT
If that's the level of quality you can achieve in N scale then who knows what is possible in OO! Top job. OO Sleet Loco next perchance? ;D
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2011 15:13:43 GMT
I can't say I'd thought of doing a sleet loco before, but they're interesting vehicles and as single units would make good models. Drawings are available and there's one at Acton so it would be quite feasible. I've now given the driving car a careful clean with acetone, which has removed the remaining yellow wax from the printing process and exposed some of the detail which was previously hidden. It now needs some careful sanding with fine grade sandpaper, alternating with thin coats of primer, to get a good smooth finish. Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2011 15:29:54 GMT
When I first tried to fit the body over the chassis they were a bit tight and I didn't want to force them together in case they broke - or got stuck. Having given the chassis and inside of the body a going-over with fine sandpaper, I've now successfully tested the two parts together. I did think I'd have to use small screws to hold them together, but the fit is sufficiently tight that I don't think that will be necessary. Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2011 19:32:37 GMT
If you could do 38TS this way you'd sell thousands!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2011 19:42:09 GMT
I may have been at Covent Garden with a tape measure and a similar thought in mind earlier this week...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2011 15:59:30 GMT
This is brilliant, and in my view represents a significant step forward in modeling.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2011 21:54:10 GMT
Thanks Cyberman. As well as working on the first printed driving car, I've also been making some changes to the CAD model to incorporate some improvements. I wasn't happy with the underframe details, but couldn't find any good photos of it on the net, so I took a ride to Edgeware to take some of my own. Using them I have been able to increase the accuracy and detail quite considerably. Before After Other modifications to the design have been made to improve the fit between the chassis and body, strengthen some vulnerable parts, and allow more space for the bogie to rotate in. I have also been working on the CAD models for the intermediate cars. The whole lot should hopefully be available to order on Shapeways within a couple of days. Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2011 7:29:59 GMT
I've got a couple of coats of paint on now, still several more and lots of sanding to go. I think I'll also need to use a scalpel to remove a bit of paint from some of the details where they have become slightly clogged. I have also tested assembly of the trailing bogie. The fit between the sides and centre was a bit sloppy so I have tightened it up on the design, as well as reducing the thickness of the bogie sides to improve clearances. With modifications to the design and design of the intermediate cars now complete, I have made the 95 stock models available to order from Shapeways. There are three vehicles, the driving motor, the trailer car, and the uncoupling non-driving motor. Each includes the body, chassis, and bogie parts. The driving motor and uncoupling non-driving motor are available in two versions, one unpowered with parts for two trailing bogies, and one designed to be powered with a Kato Portram bogie, with parts for one trailing bogie and sideframes only for the power bogie. If anyone is interested there is a link to them on Shapeways in my signature below (posted there with admin permission). Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2011 7:39:10 GMT
Very impressive Paul - Have you thought of producing these as commercial enterprise?
How easy would it be to up scale them to 4mm?
Xerces Fobe
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2011 10:14:02 GMT
Those models look superb. It's hard to believe that they are 2mm scale! Truly incredible. Congratulations.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2011 20:14:51 GMT
Thanks Nigel and Glyn. I'm looking at doing an OO version, which should be a fairly simple modification to the model. I need to reduce the wall thickness to keep the price down, and should be able to add a bit more detail in some areas. However since volume, and therefore price, increases with the cube of an increase in scale, I'm not yet sure whether the cost of an OO model would be viable.
Paul
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2011 14:50:30 GMT
Very, very impressive!
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Post by metman on Jul 18, 2011 16:41:29 GMT
You'll have to be careful by reducing the thickness of the pieces as it may warp. Looks fantastic!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2011 22:13:55 GMT
Following the enquiries above about the possibility of an OO version, I've made a rough CAD model of an OO scale 95TS car to check the volume and therefore price. I now reckon that an OO 95 stock car could be printed in Frosted Detail for around £80. That seems like a fairly reasonable price so I'll get on with doing a proper version and uploading it to Shapeways.
Paul
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