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Post by t697 on Nov 27, 2010 17:20:53 GMT
To me, a train in winter should be less than 'room' temperature, but more than ambient. Exactly what the LU standards demand and S stock delivers. I'm sure some will say this is too hot or too cold. Or too 'green' or not 'green' enough but you can't exactly satisfy everyone... |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2010 20:13:36 GMT
I was on an A stock today, the temperature outside is -3 in Chesham, as was the temperature on the train (train 407 approx. 18:50).
I'm going to file a complaint to LU, it's not acceptable.
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metman
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Post by metman on Nov 27, 2010 20:19:24 GMT
Was the heating on? They normally have fierce heating!  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2010 20:19:38 GMT
Nope
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Post by citysig on Nov 27, 2010 20:27:20 GMT
Whilst it may not have been ideal to have a cold shuttle train, the alternative is to cancel the train altogether. Our drivers generally keep us up to date with things of this sort. I received no other reports that the train was defective. That's not to say there wasn't a problem at the time you travelled though. Unfortunately our many millions of customers travel all at different times and have differing expectations of what to expect. The circumstances leading up to each and every trip can alter considerably as well. The next time the shuttle ran, the circumstances may have altered and the train may have had time to warm up. The problem with the shuttle is that it tends to spend more time than most trains sat in platforms with doors open. By all means file your complaint. You will no doubt receive some feedback and your comments will indeed be taken on board. It would be nobody's intention to send a train with no heating into service, not least to the Chesham service. In a couple of weeks it will be much less likely that a (slightly) defective train will be stuck on the branch. You will have the choice of many other A-stocks with a more wide-ranging list of defects  As a footnote, did you make your feelings known to any member of staff? Always best to do so, then the problem is highlighted earlier and measures may be able to be taken to avoid your fellow passengers suffering in the same way. |
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metman
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Post by metman on Nov 27, 2010 20:29:58 GMT
Or even an S stock telling you the next station is Rickmansworth ;D
If that happens again, ask the driver if the heating is on?
If the heating is broken, there's not much you can do I guess, its better than walking!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2010 20:52:32 GMT
I've asked a driver I know over facebook once, he said he deliberately doesn't turn the heating on to stop drunk people falling asleep and being trouble to detrain at the end of the line. Surely this isn't fair and is against the rules in some way? Here:  Obviously I've censored a swear and names/pictures of two LU drivers who commented on this. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2010 11:56:52 GMT
It is quite common for drivers to turn the heaters off for the last trip to try to stop the drunk passengers falling asleep, but not at 18:50!
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Post by deadmans on Nov 28, 2010 18:40:45 GMT
In the summer due to large number of complaints, regarding heating being left ON , the depot went round, and took ALL the heating fuses out. I suspect the carriage you were on, on indeed the unit, is still without the required fuses..... ;D |
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Post by citysig on Nov 28, 2010 20:03:00 GMT
Made a few enquiries.
The same train is doing the shuttle today, and all heating is working fully. The train was not worked on overnight, and no other complaints of the heating (or lack of) were received.
At this point during a cold spell, if the heating is not working it is not down to missing fuses. The faults are due to either blown fuses, defective heaters (mainly due to sheer age of the trains) and isolated heaters which have caused traction earth faults. If we are made aware of defective heaters in weather like this, trains are more often than not withdrawn from service.
1 train had this today and was taken out of service at the request of the driver - leaving a 20 minute hole on the Watford service. I'm sure those stood in sub-zero temperatures at places like Northwood would have rather had a "chilly" train.
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Post by citysig on Nov 28, 2010 20:10:41 GMT
In the summer due to large number of complaints, regarding heating being left ON , the depot went round, and took ALL the heating fuses out. I suspect the carriage you were on, on indeed the unit, is still without the required fuses..... ;D Deadmans, in all honesty I tire of your endless negative remarks and unfounded comments. Your quips do nothing but fuel a ready and waiting audience of LU critics, not least organisations such as certain free newspapers. It does make me wonder how much you value your employer, and whether maybe your negativity is such that perhaps your bills could be better paid by another, much more negative organisation. Remarks, accusations and rumour mongering are nothing short of annoying to those of us who are trying to get things right for as many people as possible. We all have our moans. We all say the odd thing that may not be as supportive as it could be. But not each and every single day. We leave that to the passengers we carry. If you really don't have anything positive to say about LU then I for one would rather you kept quiet. It is beginning to go beyond what could be considered reasonable discussion. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2010 21:15:05 GMT
This heaters chestnut rears it's head every winter ... but surprisingly makes little headlines compared to trains being too hot! As a passenger I have rarely found a train too hot but frequently find them too cold.
After a work function the other week I rode from Earls Court to the far east end of the District on a car with the heaters off/defective, I was not impressed.
Some drivers do turn the heaters off on late trips because it does encourage sleepers to wake who otherwise can't be roused at the line end. However as somone who is invariably awake and thus cold on these trains I am not impressed! I never turn them off in these circumstances and feel LU need to take action on this.
However, as large a problem is depots putting out trains where the fuses have been removed in the summer and not replaced, despite drivers booking the defects the depots don't do anything about them and they often run all winter with the same defect being booked almost daily.
Refusing the train or returning it to depot is the only thing that may fetch results! Otherwise the train running cold being better than a cancellation is used as an excuse not to bother with the repair. I shall be refusing them if I spot the defect in the depot!
The cab's heaters are also not immune to having repeat defect reports ignored!
I can't speak for Neasden or the Metropolitan of course!
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Post by londonstuff on Nov 28, 2010 21:19:30 GMT
In the summer due to large number of complaints, regarding heating being left ON , the depot went round, and took ALL the heating fuses out. I suspect the carriage you were on, on indeed the unit, is still without the required fuses..... ;D Deadmans, in all honesty I tire of your endless negative remarks and unfounded comments. Your quips do nothing but fuel a ready and waiting audience of LU critics, not least organisations such as certain free newspapers. It does make me wonder how much you value your employer, and whether maybe your negativity is such that perhaps your bills could be better paid by another, much more negative organisation. Remarks, accusations and rumour mongering are nothing short of annoying to those of us who are trying to get things right for as many people as possible. We all have our moans. We all say the odd thing that may not be as supportive as it could be. But not each and every single day. We leave that to the passengers we carry. If you really don't have anything positive to say about LU then I for one would rather you kept quiet. It is beginning to go beyond what could be considered reasonable discussion. I think Deadmans should come to the Christmas Meet in a couple of weeks. We can all be cheery and happy for a few hours - it'll probably be too much for him  ;D |
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Post by citysig on Nov 29, 2010 8:56:44 GMT
I never turn them off in these circumstances and feel LU need to take action on this. And the action they should take when they find the train was fully serviceable and the heaters have been switched off by the driver? However, as large a problem is depots putting out trains where the fuses have been removed in the summer and not replaced, despite drivers booking the defects the depots don't do anything about them and they often run all winter with the same defect being booked almost daily. Refusing the train or returning it to depot is the only thing that may fetch results! Otherwise the train running cold being better than a cancellation is used as an excuse not to bother with the repair. I shall be refusing them if I spot the defect in the depot! The cab's heaters are also not immune to having repeat defect reports ignored! I can't speak for Neasden or the Metropolitan of course! I think to be honest it is the same company-wide. As far as the Met and H&C are concerned, at time of writing any fuses that were removed over the summer (to prevent heaters being left on in error) are all back in place except where the heaters have needed to be isolated for defect. Now whilst this means the heaters are indeed defective, and should be repaired, the issue should not be confused with fuses simply being forgotten to be replaced. Just to clarify, to a controller a cancelled train is a right-time train, and it is not us that withdraw the trains from service. That decision is made on the ground, and is made regardless of how many times the fault has been booked up. We take defects as they happen and do not remove trains as a political statement. Each defective train is dealt with as a separate case. A train that goes into depot numerous times for such a defect will not always rise high on the list of things needed to be done. The "system" does not work as straightforward as that. Reporting any fault anywhere on the combine 100 times does not mean it will be fixed any quicker than reporting it 10 times I'm afraid. My statement about having cold trains rather than cancelled trains should not be interpreted as me saying it's ok to run defective trains, but I think that in most cases some would rather have a cold train than no train at all. |
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Post by mrfs42 on Nov 29, 2010 11:26:53 GMT
It is beginning to go beyond what could be considered reasonable discussion. It is not within the purview of any subscriber to this forum to question another subscribers motives in public. Please continue this part of the conversation in private, or you could fall into the same trap of going beyond reasonable discussion. |
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Post by citysig on Nov 29, 2010 12:45:13 GMT
Big stick noted.
I have no desire to continue such a conversation in private. My point has been made.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2010 19:03:13 GMT
And the action they should take when they find the train was fully serviceable and the heaters have been switched off by the driver? Thats what I was refering to. |
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Post by citysig on Nov 30, 2010 9:47:28 GMT
I thought it was.
Let's string the drivers up as well, and shove them into the same poorly performing pool that depot staff and lots of other things like the S-stock has been shoved into.
Anyone got the ES's phone number, as to be honest with the amount of LU bashing (including revealing that some staff are not performing as they should it seems - as revealed here by one of their colleagues) they could certainly gather a lot more material. It's all fully backed up by experienced LU representatives as well.
I'm not denying we don't have a few issues within our company, but sometimes - especially in a thread where an outsider has said they have lodged a complaint against a train (or it could end up being against an individual) perhaps a little more restraint could be exercised? Or is that just me being sensitive?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2010 0:17:28 GMT
is that just me being sensitive? No, it's not. It's called being true to the ones that pay your wages. It's not just LUL. I see it it in plenty of other walks of life. There are far too many people content to take the good money provided and knock the hand that feeds them at every opportunity. Pathetic. |
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metman
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Post by metman on Dec 1, 2010 18:07:32 GMT
Can we get back to talking about S stock please, perhaps this 'discussion' should be in the 'rant' section?
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Post by den on Dec 1, 2010 21:05:19 GMT
Heater on 007 was nice and toasty this evening. Must've been where I was sitting the other time. Also the BTP officer on board enjoyed walking up and down the train.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2010 9:50:55 GMT
Heater on 007 was nice and toasty this evening. Must've been where I was sitting the other time. Also the BTP officer on board enjoyed walking up and down the train. Was just thinking how the new stocks aircon (they heat as well) was coping with it's first dose of chilly weather. Sounds like it stood up to the job. Bet you notice that your clothes dry out quicker too. Metcontrol: I see your point and I agree |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2010 20:03:15 GMT
Will (has?) the S8s be tested to South Harrow? For the inevitable time when a Met driver decides the time is right to press ahead with the Introduction of the type on the District? Or will it simply be a case of set back over the crossover at Rayners?
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Post by greatkingrat on Dec 11, 2010 12:54:47 GMT
The TfL Journey Planner is showing some additional runs outside the normal pattern next weekend. Would these be S Stock testing runs?
0906 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 0938
0950 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 1029
1106 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 1138
1150 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 1229
1306 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 1338
1350 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 1429
1506 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 1538
1550 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 1629
1706 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 1738
1750 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 1829
2006 Wembley Park - Amersham arr 2038
2056 Amersham - Wembley Park arr 2129
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metman
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Post by metman on Dec 11, 2010 14:29:54 GMT
That appears the case. They may not run however....
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Post by greatcentral on Dec 11, 2010 16:08:11 GMT
An LU personage said on the Chesham shuttle that up to 4 S8's would be in service Baker St - Amersham from Monday. Chesham to remain A stock until full testing has taken place.
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Post by citysig on Dec 11, 2010 19:14:58 GMT
An LU personage said on the Chesham shuttle that up to 4 S8's would be in service Baker St - Amersham from Monday. Chesham to remain A stock until full testing has taken place. Not quite true, but it is true that the S-stock will be on a few more workings from tomorrow. It will be able to cover any service north of Baker Street - but for the time being there are only a handful of workings that are being concentrated on. The trips manage to cover one trip to each terminus except Chesham - but the stock could easily end up on a through Chesham at some point in the not too distant future. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2010 19:27:17 GMT
Have any test runs taken the trains south of Wembley Park to Baker Street and Aldgate yet?
Also, when testing the trains to Chesham commences, will TfL stick in rail replacement taxis, or just run it in the gap between normal trains?
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Post by 100andthirty on Dec 11, 2010 19:30:37 GMT
Yes, many test runs south of Wembley Park. Timetabled service starts with the 12th December timetable change
Similarly tests have been carried out to Chesham.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2010 19:52:37 GMT
Have any test runs taken the trains south of Wembley Park to Baker Street and Aldgate yet? Also, when testing the trains to Chesham commences, will TfL stick in rail replacement taxis, or just run it in the gap between normal trains? Mind the gap/what gap !?!?! There is no gap between normal trains on the Chesham branch ! Would imagine any such testing required would occur in engineering hours. |
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;D
