slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
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Post by slugabed on Oct 9, 2010 21:28:33 GMT
Steam trains are still running and they are over a hundred years old. What is it about 60s engineering that we're replacing all of it? Point is,how many 100-year-old ELECTRIC trains are there,still useable? Steam locos are made of huge chunks of iron with relatively few moving parts (ie:things to go wrong) and the main source of bother with them is the boiler,which isn't exactly rocket science to fix (though admittedly replacement can be expensive). Electric trains,on the other hand,have loads of moving parts,are made of materials which deteriorate (insulation,switchgear) and,to make best use of their characteristics,are built lightweight,so they will not be as robust in the long term. My 40-year-old gas cooker passes its test every year with no maintenance,but how many 40-year-old electric cookers would you trust to use every day? The A-Stock's 50 years is,in these circumstances,a tribute to their robust design and construction. That's just my opinion,though! |
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prjb
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LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
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Post by prjb on Oct 9, 2010 21:45:41 GMT
Steam trains are still running and they are over a hundred years old. How many 100+ year old steam trains are there in daily passenger carrying service? Not many, if any at all. 'A' Stock have been a workhorse for 50 years and as a result they are now life expired. |
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prjb
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LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
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Post by prjb on Oct 9, 2010 21:47:46 GMT
Somewhat old news now, they have been of the asset register for years. They will have their semi permanent coupler cut, and they will be lifted out crane onto low loaders. Various scrap firms, are taking two cars each. I witnessed 5197, today, sadly its 5173 turn on Sunday. Its all happening close to the TMR, as you come in from the north. It's 3 firms taking delivery and they are having 3, 3, and 2 cars respectively. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 8:30:05 GMT
Can I ask why you're not telling us where they're going for scrap? They're going to be crushed for scrap metal so even if yobs find out it's not going to cause a problem and we were told where the 67s are going.
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Post by Chris W on Oct 10, 2010 9:51:36 GMT
Can I ask why you're not telling us where they're going for scrap? They're going to be crushed for scrap metal so even if yobs find out it's not going to cause a problem and we were told where the 67s are going. Bengley I've read you're post several times to understand the undertone, but I have to say that it comes across as accusatory insinuating some sort of conspiracy rather than as a genuine question... something I think or rather hope you didn't mean to do. Your post may have come across better if you had simply asked where the withdrawn A-stock cars were being scrapped. Accusatory posts are not fitting with the tone of the current thread and are certainly not welcome on the forum. Regards ChrisW |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 12:15:51 GMT
and how long is 'nigh' !!!  |
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Post by uzairjubilee on Oct 10, 2010 12:16:15 GMT
Ahh I would love a destination blind.
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Post by citysig on Oct 10, 2010 12:35:45 GMT
Can I ask why you're not telling us where they're going for scrap? They're going to be crushed for scrap metal so even if yobs find out it's not going to cause a problem and we were told where the 67s are going. Because there are certain individuals in the world who would take it upon themselves to trespass within such a company's grounds to steal what they believe to be "anybody's" property, when in fact the scrapping of the trains is part of a business transaction, and the trains are not merely a "free for all." Scrapping, particularly in this day and age, is not simply wrecking something until it becomes a small pile of nuts and bolts. There are many components which will go on to be recycled, and as such have their own value. Anyone helping themselves will be stealing. If you have a right to know, you will be informed of the location(s). If not, then there are good reasons why not. |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Oct 10, 2010 13:33:45 GMT
I understand all that MetControl, but I agree with bengley it does seem odd that the locations of the scrapping of the 67s and As are being treated so differently.
Presumably the scrapping of Victoria Line stock is exactly the same sort of business transaction as the scrapping of Metropolitan Line stock?
I'm not saying that either approach is right or wrong, just trying to understand why such different approaches have been taken.
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Post by harlesden on Oct 10, 2010 13:44:31 GMT
It must be the luggage racks. ;D
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 14:07:25 GMT
It must be the luggage racks. ;D And the hooks ;D ;D |
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SE13
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2013
Glorious Gooner
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Post by SE13 on Oct 10, 2010 16:57:52 GMT
To back a couple of others, AIUI no destination has yet been resolved, nor whether stock will be sold off privately or scrapped.
At this stage in proceedings with the 67 stock, I think the situation was the same.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2010 17:10:40 GMT
I was driving along the A40 (towards Central London) and across the road i saw a car being transported on a lorry, i'm not a train buff or anything but i was sad for a moment
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Oct 10, 2010 18:41:20 GMT
Can I ask why you're not telling us where they're going for scrap? I agree with bengley it does seem odd that the locations of the scrapping of the 67s and As are being treated so differently. Maybe the contract between LU and the scrappers has a secrecy or security clause - I don't know as it's not something I'm privy to, but it's not beyond the realms of possibility is it. I'm sure in the fullness of time such details will become public knowledge - patience is a virtue.... |
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prjb
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LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
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Post by prjb on Oct 10, 2010 23:04:16 GMT
Can I ask why you're not telling us where they're going for scrap? Yes, you can ask. You might not get the answer you are looking for though. The two units that left for scrap this weekend went, as I stated, to three different companies. That in itself should make it apparent that there are at least three companies vying for the contract, which then logically leads one to the conclusion that the contract cannot be let at this time. Everyone knows that the 67's are going to Booths and that's because they have been awarded the contract and it is now public knowledge as a result. When the 'A' Stock contract is let that will become public knowledge too. |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Oct 10, 2010 23:30:01 GMT
Ah that makes sense.
I'd got the impression that contracts had been signed with three companies to scrap ~1/3rd of the fleet each (or one contract signed by all parties). I hadn't considered that units would be scrapped before the contract had been let.
Presumably then the companies who've taken (or are taking) delivery of the units will be using them to get an accurate idea of what is actually involved in scrapping them, so as to provide an accurate quote.
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Ben
fotopic... whats that?
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Post by Ben on Oct 10, 2010 23:37:37 GMT
Is the process of scrapping really that physically complex? I mean its not like everything is fastidiously disassembled.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Oct 11, 2010 0:13:13 GMT
Well, some bits will be disassembled. However, they'll need to see for themselves what and how much is and isn't recoverable/recyclable, how, how much effort and how long it takes to get at it, etc.
Once they know all that, they'll have a much more accurate idea of how much it will cost them to do the scrapping/dismantling/disposing and how much they can get for anything they can sell on. That will then determine what price they quote for the work (if they choose to quote at all).
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
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Post by roythebus on Oct 11, 2010 7:42:35 GMT
Aluminium is quite difficult to cut. Having broken up a couple of Routemaster buses in the last 10 years, I don't envy the scrap man's job.
You can't really cut ali with the traditional oxy-acetylene, (gas axe), we tried a butane gas cutter, more effective, in the end we used a chain saw!! the metal was disposed of by the local itenerant scrap metal recycling operative (pykie).
When they scrapped th RTs, they were attacked by men with axes who peeled off the beading and panels from what was left of the timber frame, which was then burnt. RMs are considerable stronger, and had they been around in WW2, I doubt that we'd have needed tanks to beat the enemy; RMs are mor e robust.
No doubt the professionals have a better method.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 16:49:11 GMT
Lets go down with the handcuffs and placards and lay infront of the roads... I see a mass-scale protest brewing... As long as you keep it outside on the roads. Whilst not condoning any such action, I would rather the disruption was kept outside rather than delaying the service ;D Of course not! We need to find something wrong with the S Stock as well... |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 18:46:36 GMT
No doubt the professionals have a better method. This is how they deal with a B-52. Been in service even longer than an A60!  |
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Post by antharro on Oct 11, 2010 20:01:05 GMT
Is the process of scrapping really that physically complex? I mean its not like everything is fastidiously disassembled. To quote myself from a thread in Trains Technical: There are now a lot of regulations surrounding the scrap metal industry and what can and must be removed for specialist recycling, so it wouldn't surprise me if a surprising amount of manual removal is required before the heavy machinery gets involved. And a pair of hydraulic metal cutters (shears) will get through pretty much anything, so an A-stock or 67ts won't pose much of a problem! |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2010 23:39:04 GMT
No doubt the professionals have a better method. This is how they deal with a B-52. Been in service even longer than an A60! Ah but the will the Russians have their satellites focused on Underground stock being scrapped. Maybe they will think an A60 is a WMD! ;D |
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mrfs42
71E25683904T 172E6538094T
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Post by mrfs42 on Oct 12, 2010 0:22:00 GMT
Maybe they will think an A60 is a WMD! ;D Has one ever made it through Hanger Lane....  WM? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2010 6:14:37 GMT
I know that was a rheotical question but i've been around at Rayners Lane cabin when an A stock has been transferred from Ealing Common depot
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2010 9:21:00 GMT
An A Stock has been to Ealing Common recently - photo in the October 2010 Underground News of it passing through Sudbury Town eastbound.
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Post by tubeprune on Oct 12, 2010 14:22:10 GMT
They've all been through Ealing Common. They used to go that way to get to Acton Works for overhaul.
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Oct 12, 2010 14:30:40 GMT
They've all been through Ealing Common. They used to go that way to get to Acton Works for overhaul. *slaps forehead* Of course they have! Forgot about that. |
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Post by JR 15secs on Oct 12, 2010 14:40:25 GMT
Some years ago the ELL stock move went to Neasden via the south side of Circle and Acton Town, I understand there were quite a few platforms contacted.
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Post by deadmans on Oct 12, 2010 17:55:20 GMT
An A Stock has been to Ealing Common recently - photo in the October 2010 Underground News of it passing through Sudbury Town eastbound. Indeed it was collecting or returning test weighs for the s stock. |
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WM?
