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Post by kris on Sept 24, 2022 11:49:48 GMT
Hello! Still working on finalising my short spy film set on a Routemaster in 1957. One of the final things we have been working on are faux ads in a 1957 design aesthetic. As you can imagine we’ve done quite a lot of research and visited the LTM Library and our shooting bus location. One thing that I have found nothing on is the corner frame with rounded corners on the wide seat just below the stairs. (the one visible in this photo timebus.co.uk/graphics/vehs/oplat/327-0028-downstairs.jpg ) Would that frame also have contained an advertisement, but just folded in halfs? Or would it contain something different like timetables etc? Any pointers or information would be very welcome! Thanks!
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Post by kris on Jan 25, 2022 12:28:21 GMT
In this short video you hear the bell being activated with one ring shortly after 2 minutes and a double ring by the conductor after the passengers have alighted. A minute or so later you hear the buzzer being used (plus on-screen comment about this) - the buzzer button is upstairs at the back of the bus / near the steps. The bell cord is located above the seats on the left side of the lower deck and it extends the full length of the lower deck seating area. There was also a button on the platform at the back of the bus and (I think) another button on the other side of the bus under the stairs. To see all this for yourself maybe you would wish to visit a living museum which has some real buses? I'm thinking of the London Transport Museum in Covent Garden or the London Bus Museum which is somewhere like Brooklands just outside south-west London. The footage in this video was filmed in a Routemaster bus carrying passengers from the Epping Ongar Railway to Epping station. They also use other types of former London red and green buses. Bus travel is included as part of the entrance fee for the Railway and the train rides. Hope this helps Oh this is brilliant. Exactly what I needed. We do have a working bus to shoot in, but it's mostly used for weddings, so I'm not 100% sure if the bell will still work or not.
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Post by kris on Jan 25, 2022 12:25:34 GMT
Kris: Just to keep the dialogue right; a conductor would say 'inside', or 'on top', not 'downstairs' or 'upstairs'. (I'm guessing from the bells discussion that it's going to be a talkie). Thanks! It is going to be a talky, but I'm not sure yet if there'll be a conductor who'll talk. But that is very interesting information. Thanks!
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Post by kris on Jan 22, 2022 19:27:17 GMT
Some more questions:
How would a bus stop at a specific stop in the late 50’s? Would they ask the driver, or is there a button to push? Would a red light shine somewhere, or is that too much of a stretch?
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Post by kris on Dec 29, 2021 15:54:41 GMT
I’m developing a short film set in a 60’s era Routemaster.
The plot can be described as a spy story set in post-war London, at the rise of the Cold War.
So I was wondering if there are any interesting public stories about espionage happening on public transport. I am aware of several stories happening on bus route 11 during WW2.
Also, what personnel would work on a bus. I take a driver and a conductor? Would the conductor always be at the rear entrance of the bus doing their job? Thanks!
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Post by kris on Nov 16, 2018 20:03:46 GMT
Christ, what's next - buses on the Tube Map?? Surely there's a limit to how much it can be polluted before becoming useless. I wonder how many users use digital over the paper map, where layers can work much better.
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Post by kris on Mar 1, 2017 21:27:46 GMT
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Post by kris on Feb 21, 2017 14:47:11 GMT
Sounds good to me. Then you can call it "London's Underground railways of today and tomorrow", which is an excuse for including the purple line. For me it always has been more of a love-letter of what was, is and will be, then a map that I'll pull out next time I'm out Zone 1. (And as a Pink Floyd fan, having Battersea on there would make me smile).
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Post by kris on Feb 21, 2017 14:44:20 GMT
You could put a note in the key 'opening soon' or 'opening 20xx' for the Lizzie. The intention is clearly to integrate it with the rest, so it does need to be on. The same with the Aldwych branch. It could be shown dotted, like the District line to Olympia. Both could then have an eaplanation added to the key, ie: 'out of use', and 'limited service' or some such, as applicable. Kris
Following on from the above, how about adding some filters, so that visitors could activate/deactivate at will ??
Closed stations (e.g. British Museum, original Uxbridge) Closed lines (e.g. Holborn to Aldwych, Epping to Ongar) - To be opened/constructed lines/stations (e.g. Elizabeth Line / Northern Line to Battersea)
- Non-funded extensions (e.g. Croxley)
I'd *love* to have an interactive version, but unless someone with great programming skills comes along, I'm afraid it'll be just the big map as a vector.
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Post by kris on Feb 21, 2017 13:27:19 GMT
I haven't forgotten about this project at all, but stuck with a bit move. So, how about the planned Tube Extensions? I feel they could be added as well?
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Post by kris on Jan 18, 2017 23:28:28 GMT
Thanks for splitting! I was starting to feel bad about hijacking that thread!
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Post by kris on Jan 18, 2017 12:28:30 GMT
Thanks!
What do you guys think about making the zones very gradually darker? Like the further the zone, the darker it is.
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Post by kris on Jan 17, 2017 10:35:20 GMT
I love extreme nitpicking! I’m an absolute perfectionist. In fact, I repositioned *every* label based on a triangle, so all spacing should be uniform now. That alone took 2 hours, so painstaking details are something that I don’t mind. 1. Fixed 2. I think it’s because it’s a web-export at a certain size. I believe it should look fine in the finished PDF 3. Fixed 4. Optical illusion, in fact, the H&C is 0.001 point thicker 5. Done 6. I kept it at a 45° angle, but it lost the kink 7. Done 8. Done 9. Done 10. Done 11. Very odd all these minor shifts, not sure how they started. But fixed. 12. Very possible. Done 13. Done 14. I know, I just kept that in because I liked the look of the kink and to fill out the map a little bit. 15. Done 16. Done 17. Not very easy, what do you think? 18. Done 19. Done. It wasn’t an optical illusion. Something did go wrong with the earlier aligning. I now grouped the swatches with its labels and re-aligned all. 20. Aaaaanddd .. done! upload.krisvandesande.be/files/170117/9313198.jpeg
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Post by kris on Jan 16, 2017 19:47:19 GMT
Yet more excellent work kris . A few questions spring to mind: - Why does the dangleway have an icon on the map, when your key notes that it's a cable car? Personally I'd like to see it go completely, but keep the icons at the interchanges (as you have for river and coach services).
- What rule have you used when placing the Network Rail arrows? Some stations have it after the name with no space, others have a space. Others it's above, or below.
- Why isn't there a credit to yourself for drawing it (perhaps with a note of thanks to the membership of this forum)?
- What rule have you applied for the justification of station names that are on two lines? Some are left justified, others are centred.
Finally, there appears to be an "Airprox" incident in progress at City Airport. 1. It's a cute icon that already existed, so I never changed that. Just like: 2. data that already existed on the current TFL map. They don't seem to have a fixed design language for this as far as I can tell. A wrong that I will have to correct, but I do have to find the best way. 3. Because it's meant to be a print for myself, I didn't want a credit on the file itself. However, I'm going to create a mini-website where the file can be downloaded for print, with its conditions, and linking to this fine community for sure. 4. Depending on the proximity to the station line or circle. If it's on the left of the icon, it's aligned right, on top or bottom it's centred, and if it's on the right it's aligned right. 5. Air Control has been notified, and the plane has been detached from the label.
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Post by kris on Jan 16, 2017 19:37:04 GMT
The images aren't working working here unfortunately.
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Post by kris on Jan 16, 2017 19:21:25 GMT
It's been a while, but here is a big update to the map. I reverted the white text in the legend, since it's really an Art print, and I can do without that little bit of accuracy. upload.krisvandesande.be/files/160117/5247810.jpegI used the Station Management Overview map for the correct label colour, but I might change the odd ones later on for aesthetic reasons. (Aldgate, South Kensington etc for example).
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 17:43:36 GMT
It's me again! Sorry. The W&C is also has blue text for the line banner. Also some of the zones have random bits caused by the removal of LO. Not a huge problem but a blob near Wimbledon sticks out. Keep up the good work ! EDIT: and the NR symbol at Shepherds Bush is out of alignment!
EDIT II: and at Tottenham Hale. The text at Heathrow T5 is a bit close to the line. The zone boundaries can be redrawn to be smoother now they don't have to accommodate trams or the Overground, e.g. zones 7 and 8 don't need to exist near Epping, and zone 4 (actually the tram special zone) doesn't need to approach Wimbledon. Both fixed :-)
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 16:56:02 GMT
That's right, so it just looks like the symbol at Walthamstow Central can be removed then, as it is Overground only. Begone it be!
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 16:39:04 GMT
Here is the version as of this afternoon: upload.krisvandesande.be/files/040117/6285442.jpeg- H&C / Circle bend is now wider, to keep with the 45° angle, and bring it closer to the finished Crossrail map. - The Crossrail is now aligned with the grid and has more space from the Central Line. - The Bakerloo line goes lower at Paddington, creating more visual rest. - Edgeware Road station is *MUCH* cleaner now - Double Interchange Blob for Paddington instead of Quadrupple - All double text labels are now 1 text field instead of 2, making the tiny variations in spacing a thing of the past. - Liverpool street junction with Crossrail is now also labeled. @class411: As soon as it's 100% finished, I'll send you a special version with a more muted Dangleware. Or I'll take it out. As others have said, the map looks really good - not really anything I could say needs changing. One thing I did notice, is that at some Overground interchange stations, you have added the National Rail symbol and you haven't at others. (for example, Walthamstow Central has one, Gunnersbury and Willesden Jct don't. I copied them from the TFL map, where Gunnersby doesn't have a rail icon, only an interchange icon, which I assumed it was interchange to the Overground.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 16:25:44 GMT
What program are you using to do it? Illustrator? Perhaps move the CX branch across a pixel or two so it aligns with the grid? Illustrator yep. Do you think it should be *on* the line? I placed it against it, just like the H&C and the Crossrail.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 16:11:41 GMT
Here is the version as of this afternoon: upload.krisvandesande.be/files/040117/6285442.jpeg- H&C / Circle bend is now wider, to keep with the 45° angle, and bring it closer to the finished Crossrail map. - The Crossrail is now aligned with the grid and has more space from the Central Line. - The Bakerloo line goes lower at Paddington, creating more visual rest. - Edgeware Road station is *MUCH* cleaner now - Double Interchange Blob for Paddington instead of Quadrupple - All double text labels are now 1 text field instead of 2, making the tiny variations in spacing a thing of the past. - Liverpool street junction with Crossrail is now also labeled. @class411: As soon as it's 100% finished, I'll send you a special version with a more muted Dangleware. Or I'll take it out.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 14:39:52 GMT
What's the latest version showing any of today's changes - I can't seem to see the latest link. Edit: Edgware looks okay - perhaps because the name is a few pixels further away from the line than MHE is. Perhaps that's what's needed there. Crossrail: Perhaps move the middle section up to go on the grid line like everywhere else. It would also make it further from Oxford Circus showing a clearer non-change there. Edit 2: Can the name Baker Street be moved up to align with the other stations left and right? I'll work on that once I cleaned out the Paddington area. The name alignments are also fixed now, just like the Edgeware road was a tad too low.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 14:28:27 GMT
Oxford Circus label would look tidier on two lines, to avoid it crashing into the next station east (whose cumbersomely long name is a real nuisance in such a congested area, as well as being ambiguous - I always think of it as Centre Point). Brave and bold to colour the names/labels! love it! One version of the Beck map did that, but duplicated the labels where there were two lines. Very untidy Going by the "owning" line seems a better solution, and is actually potentially useful, although it does look odd in places. You also have to deal with stations which are not operated by LUL, such as Richmond. True. And there are some odd-ones, like Aldgate is District despite no line there, and the colours for Circle/H&C are combined into yellow. Sometimes I chose a different color because it just looks better and more uniform. That's the same as the current tube map now. . Maybe so, but it's still confusing and without the Overground you have the space to make it clearer How do you suggest we draw that with the Crossrail there exactly? Why isn't there a connection at Hammersmith by the way? It seems silly there isn't one there. I mean, there are 4 lines converging there. Why isn't there a tunnel or something? Historically, because that would have required co-operation between the metropolitan and the District - unthinkable until 1933! In any case, it would be difficult to engineer, because the District station is in a cutting and has two island platforms, whilst the Met is at street level. Any connection would either have to have three changes of level (to get under the road and over the eastbound District) or go really deep. In fact, there used to be a tunnel under the street, and very unsavoury it was too. Crossing the Broadway on the level is actually more convenient. Remember also that until 1906 there was no need for a pedestrian connection as there were direct rains from the Paddington direction towards Turnham Green and Richmond. Very enlightening! Thanks! I guess it's one of those little nuggets that make it such an interesting system.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 14:23:44 GMT
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 13:55:50 GMT
oh my! you responded fast, didn't think you'd take it all on board. Heh, as I said, it's a slow wednesday, and it's good to take my mind of the stress of an impending move. Absolutely. Like this? True, But I really like the design of the blobs. The placement of the NR icons really does give me a headache. There isn't any consistency on alignment it seems. Hah, okay! The only problem with that is there is a bit of work with the connecting dots. Because each line itself is a separate layer.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 13:44:15 GMT
Kris, I'd echo what everyone else says - what you've done is immense. As you've asked for minor comments I've put a few below but obviously in a constructive way and not something I'd ever have looked at unless invited. Please do! I love all this feedback. (And all these edits to stations really do improve my knowledge of the map. hehe). Done they can and they should. Done It was like that on the TFL map. Spaced them out a bit. Done. What do you think about Edgeware? Funny, since the grid was added afterwards. But yep, added that. Do you think Woodford/Hainault - South Woodford/Fairlop - Snaresbrook/Barkingside should align as well? I moved the Jub a bit down so the curve looks better. Absolutely! Thank you! The circle line text should be blue in the key (see wikipedia page). I'd like to echo the comments above; you've done a very good job with this! thank you .. I added that for now .. I'm just not sure it looks 'right', despite it being official. We'll see if it makes it to the print version.
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 13:18:31 GMT
Kris, this is awesome.. great work. it's one of the cleanest/nicest looking alternative maps that I've seen people do. (i'm the chap from Londonist btw who made the video interview with the guy at TfL who actually does design the tube map!) you asked for people to nit-pick, and i am happy to do so below, but purely to be constructive, not to be negative. we're at a stage now where London is so complicated it's impossible to make something that everyone is going to be happy with, all we can do it get close. IMHO it's time TfL ditched the tube map (and called it the 'TfL Map' which is what it really is - 40% of the current tube map is not even tube). and just go with large paper maps. the days of the pocket maps and surely numbered. Anyway... Thank you *so* much! All of you actually, because I love all this knowledge combined. I have a deel love for this system, but my knowledge is just starting. Good thing I have a lot of off-time this month to tinker with this design. It's all constructive to be sure! Done! I didn't know the 'E' word was sensitive around here. Sorry! Very well spotted! It's funny how they picked Piccadily for the 'main' label colour, yet have the intersections black. I chose purely on gut feeling, however today I did get my hands on a nice map which has the 'ownership' of stations, so I updated accordingly. Euston is Black now. Stockwell is still blue on that mapas well. Yeah, you don't 'connect' to a same line. I used the Large TFL Print Map as reference. Off it goes. Or at least hidden this time. Weird that they are not listed on the TFL map. But I'll add them, and the interchange blobs as well. I just spotted that as well while doing the North Curve. That does need a bit of extra work, but it's not a bad idea at all. That entire area could use with a tad of a re-draw. It's on the list! That's the same as the current tube map now. Done For this print, it's gone though. Sorry True, but I like it. But it can be taken off from the PDF. It'll be editable. Seems I missed that! fixed Probably because the older step-free access icons. Fixing it. Done! It is confusing isn't it? Moving the line higher. It was like that on the TFL map. Much more logical indeed without the 4th blob. Done Done. Why isn't there a connection at Hammersmith by the way? It seems silly there isn't one there. I mean, there are 4 lines converging there. Why isn't there a tunnel or something? Thanks for that massive batch of feedback! Here is a map (double the resolution) as it stands right now, with the Paddington area still left to 'clean up'. upload.krisvandesande.be/files/040117/5895610.jpeg
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 10:42:33 GMT
One very minor niggle: Bakerloo line - Willesden Junction and Queens Park have their circles (and associated text) very slightly offset to the right. When it's finished, could we have the PDF (or a very high resolution png/tiff/jpg) as I'd like to get a very large print for my office wall. I have large prints of around a dozen diagrams going back to the original, but this is the first I've actually though would make a good permanent display. With the others it was a matter of not being able to pick any one, but this has a stand-out 'USP'. I'll fix it! And yes, there will be a vector PDF available for printing!
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Post by kris on Jan 4, 2017 0:14:51 GMT
Why have you chosen to get rid of the Overground, but keep the dangleway? It was a nice splash of colour IMO. And just a tiny bit, not like the massive overground. Personal preference I guess.
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Post by kris on Jan 3, 2017 23:30:49 GMT
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