Blackfriars to close for over two years

Well by chance and a stroke of luck today, I bumped into the fella responsible for the Blackfriars changes!

It would appear that us drivers have misunderstood or misinterpreted what was printed in the traffic circular / posted at the depots...

The changes were not done to increase our speed through the area!!

The starters were changed to approach control to enforce the usual 5 mph limit at station starters, because the short overlaps have not been altered in anyway and are still therefore present, and always will be. The person who calculated the alterations is happy for trains to pass through at 10 mph - and if you get it right, that's exactly what you can do.

The 20 mph PSR on the approaches in each direction (and he knows about the eastbound sign being placed behind the inner home () is there not only to assist drivers in slowing down for the approach controlled sections, but because once the tunnel sheild is fully installed, drivers may well forget they are passing through a closed station.

That was his explanation and it makes sense to me - shame the the notices don't put it across that way

Eh?

Although they retain the short overlap as per their historical status as station starters, they are now classed as running signals - there is absolutely no need for a station supervisor to be present.

All you need is the same authority, obtained in the same way, as with any other 'X' signal.

Why?

Why oh why is there an insistence on a station supervisor being present?

What about the auto phone facility on the Connect hand held then?

And before you say it ain't secure - what will the supervisor or operating official use to communicate with the signaller?

I don't see why not (using the auto phone that is) - providing safety critical protocols are observed (confirmation of whom you are speaking to and repeat back of message so that there are no misunderstandings), it ain't rocket science.

I do appreciate what the rule book says, but a supervisor or operating official will use exactly that procedure - why delay things unnecessarily when, if you do it properly, you can achieve the same outcome in a third of the time?

Here's another angle - I have been given authority by station supervisors in the past [to pass signals remaining at danger] and I've rung the signaller to double check as I've had absolutely no confidence in the ability of the supervisor. Quite frankly, more often than not I trust myself more than those the rule book says I should when it comes to safety critical stuff.

I shouldn't say that but it's true

Fair enough - we'll have to agree to disagree on this one then!

It is a long established principle of british signalling telephony (probably dating from the days of 'call plungers' on the wider british system or the pull ropes installed during the early 20s on the UndergrounD) that SPT communication cannot be routed through an exchange in the transmission between Driver et al to the Signalman. The telephones can be routed into a 'concentrator' in the cabin but in very recent times a dedicated exchange for SPTs (with whatever the electronic equivalent of uniselector/ringing level mulitple redundancy) has been used in a few NR installations. I think for exchange routing there needs to be special derogation from the inspecting body at the time the design specs are initially approved.

That of course would be the most ideal situation.

I must admit when I first wrote that question I was still hunting round for my copy of the line diagrams - but I stand by what I said in that I trust my own ability to carry out safety critical procedures with the correct end result and often find myself having to check the work of others as they leave me with no confidence whatsoever regarding my safety.

some examples:

SS at Stepney Green had to issue me with the paperwork to pass two signals known to have failed (authority to not wait two minutes) - I had to tell him which boxes to fill in, and what to do with the form (ie, I needed it as it was my authority to not wait the two minutes at the signals stated on the form).

SS from Whitechapel had to wrong direction move me back to Stepney Green (separate incident on a different day!!) - he had the form but said he'd fill it out upon completion of the move! He also didn't know where the limit of the move was, what speed I should do or much else about the procedure.

SS at Upney had to authorise me past a failed station starter - he was so unsure of what he was saying I contacted the signaller myself via the SPT. He then disappeared and I had to wait whilst he was summoned to give the required assisted dispatch.

Signaller at Barking (again different day) had to authorise me past a failed signal - he said nothing about the points ahead of me and I had to ring him back to confirm they were indeed scotched & clipped.

I'm sure I could bore you all with more.

There are always good & bad in every grade, and we are all only human - but people such as those above could easily land me in bother, so I've learned that sometimes the best way is to just do it yerself!

It is supposed to be fully installed by Tuesday - it's certainly looking likely from your images...

I wonder how far ahead the contractors are thinking....

I'm thinking that, AFAIK, the plan is that they are going to build over the track/platforms.......so how will those segments come back out?......

;D ;D ;D ;D

Anyone know why the speed limits are reduced to 10mph now ??

The whole signaling thing doesnt seem optimal. I'm sure reducing the speed to 10mph defeats the purpose of something else mentioned about it previously...

Quite why we need a 10mph TSR from two whole train lengths before the signal and another train length after it is unbeliveable overkill. The e/b peak service was backed up from it all the way to Earls Court on Thursday eve.

Clearly someone has their sums wrong on this lot !

and no, no-one had SPADed the starters since Blackfriars closed.

All I can say, is I only went past there once last week and the tsr's were as I state on that date on the e/b. They were not at either end of the platform ramp by a large margin, perhaps they have been moved about.

The dawdling through the road all dissipated upon leaving Blackfriars.

Perhaps they should have left it as it was ! Full speed approach and stop or 5mph at the starter !