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Post by ted672 on Mar 28, 2024 11:51:37 GMT
This saga, allowing for Covid, seems typical of how LU has muddled through over recent decades. A fully financed, total infrastructure and rolling stock upgrade is what's needed, but as long as the system remains under political control, that'll never happen. It's frustrating as an observer, it must be horrendous for those trying to keep things running.
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Post by A60stock on Mar 28, 2024 12:14:36 GMT
Are we saying that we will have trains which are non DDA compliant right until 2029? Or will the interiors be done in the short run with just the re tractioning work taking much longer?
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Post by superteacher on Mar 28, 2024 12:19:12 GMT
Considering the train has been stripped and you're trying to put modern equipment into a train from the 90s you're bound to run into problems. For example the traction problems and most recent radio problems. There was a memo around to staff a few weeks ago saying CLIP production had been suspended! But I believe number 2 is just delayed from August to December which is expected. Most likely the CLIP team have run into some problems on their end or as you said it could be financial problems. But fingers crossed number 1 gets its faults ironed out ready for 'proper' passenger service. Right now it's just operating once a day between Ruislip Gardens and Grange Hill. Yesterday it did the trip to Hainault depot and then back down to Ruislip depot! I think I'm right in saying that this is the most extensive refurb / rebuild of any underground stock to date. Perhaps it will be like "Trigger's Broom" from Only Fools and Horses!
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Post by xtmw on Mar 28, 2024 12:48:29 GMT
Yes, it is the most extensive refurb. The D stock was one of the most notable refurbs (PIS systems, CCTV etc) but the 92 is the most extensive refurb on LU yet!
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Post by Dstock7080 on Mar 28, 2024 12:55:40 GMT
Are we saying that we will have trains which are non DDA compliant right until 2029? Or will the interiors be done in the short run with just the re tractioning work taking much longer? All trains that go through CLIP will be to the finished standard, CCTV, DTS modification, LED lights, new AC motors, wheelchair spaces, PIS screens etc.
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Post by A60stock on Mar 28, 2024 13:24:59 GMT
Are we saying that we will have trains which are non DDA compliant right until 2029? Or will the interiors be done in the short run with just the re tractioning work taking much longer? All trains that go through CLIP will be to the finished standard, CCTV, DTS modification, LED lights, new AC motors, wheelchair spaces, PIS screens etc. So I take that as a yes, as long as the interiors are not done, they will not be up to DDA requirements, which could be as late as 2029...... Remarkable how tfl have gotten away with the a deadline which originally came out in 2010 and was supposed to be completed by 2020. Have they got an exemption until 2029 now?
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Post by goldenarrow on Mar 28, 2024 13:47:10 GMT
The Rail Vehicle Accessibility (Non-Interoperable Rail System)(Central Line 92 Tube Stock) Exemption Order 2019, effective from 1 January 2020, runs until 1 January 2025 and will now inevitably have to be extended again. Whilst questions are rightly being asked of TfL, the Department for Transport is hardly just a bystander in this matter which in LU's wider context has been brewing in one form or another for over a decade.
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Post by A60stock on Mar 28, 2024 13:53:47 GMT
I would have thought a solution would have been to just get the interiors done rather than go head to head with the Dft
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Post by pgb on Mar 28, 2024 16:07:06 GMT
CLIP train #1 is in service running through the pipe but with technicians onboard due to radio problems. I/OPs are now driving them instead of test train operators.
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Post by goldenarrow on Mar 28, 2024 17:19:22 GMT
Posts relating to the current/future state of signalling on the Central line have been moved to dedicated thread in Signalling and Track here
Hat tip:gefw
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Post by miff on Mar 28, 2024 17:37:59 GMT
I would have thought a solution would have been to just get the interiors done rather than go head to head with the Dft There's no need to go 'head to head' with the DfT since it's DfT (Secretary of State for Transport) who issues the exemptions. Consultation on extending the exemption for '72 Stock is already in progress and I imagine the '92 will follow.
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Post by taylor on Mar 28, 2024 18:08:28 GMT
Somewhere (on here?) I'd read that the (erstwhile defective) seat-dividers / arm-rests were to be reinstated on the next major refurb. Well that didn't happen; so it looks like the man-spreader-lobby may have had their way! Also did the gloriously large 92TS windows have to so reduced to fit in the info-displays? Looks like the trend to the Viennese 2024TS aka. 'revival-padded-cell' appearance is gaining traction. That's sad, as views of the above ground sections of the line, e.g. Roding Valley really benefited from the large windows. I'm also wondering if the interstice between the back of the info-panel and the remaining but obscured upper part of the window will in the future be properly cleaned. Time will tell.
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metman
Global Moderator
5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
Posts: 7,400
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Post by metman on Mar 29, 2024 11:33:27 GMT
I can understand where you are coming from with the window sizes, especially on the 2024 tube stock but the large windows on the 1992 tube stock certainly contributed to overheating in summer so this feature may improve this issue slightly.
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Post by stapler on Mar 29, 2024 13:09:12 GMT
I can understand where you are coming from with the window sizes, especially on the 2024 tube stock but the large windows on the 1992 tube stock certainly contributed to overheating in summer so this feature may improve this issue slightly. The large, curved windows were an irresistible canvas for morons with diamond cutters. But I agree they were good for sightseeing..
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Post by Chris L on Mar 29, 2024 16:46:36 GMT
I can understand where you are coming from with the window sizes, especially on the 2024 tube stock but the large windows on the 1992 tube stock certainly contributed to overheating in summer so this feature may improve this issue slightly. The large, curved windows were an irresistible canvas for morons with diamond cutters. But I agree they were good for sightseeing.. Maybe the curve were a good idea in theory but you can't see through it because of the distortion. I think they also play a part in the way the body shells twist.
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gefw
Gone - but still interested
Posts: 93
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Post by gefw on Mar 29, 2024 19:11:15 GMT
Considering the train has been stripped and you're trying to put modern equipment into a train from the 90s you're bound to run into problems. For example the traction problems and most recent radio problems. There was a memo around to staff a few weeks ago saying CLIP production had been suspended! But I believe number 2 is just delayed from August to December which is expected. Most likely the CLIP team have run into some problems on their end or as you said it could be financial problems. But fingers crossed number 1 gets its faults ironed out ready for 'proper' passenger service. Right now it's just operating once a day between Ruislip Gardens and Grange Hill. Yesterday it did the trip to Hainault depot and then back down to Ruislip depot! It is understandable that fitment of the replacement wiring into further trains is suspended (as the Radio equipment is likely to be an established product and it is probably an interface/power/earthing/EMC interference issue related to the wiring). Lets hope its high enough priority to get the right Engineering resource on the case (Modern screening/earthing/layout for EMC has moved on a lot since the 92 was designed with lots of earths and multiple power reference (0v) lines and uncertainty as to how to connect screens)
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