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Post by stapler on Jan 31, 2017 22:05:48 GMT
The cap for Zones 1-5 is £11.20, regardless of peak or off peak. Ok, so £3.40 then  My original point still stands, regardless! Every little helps! |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Feb 14, 2017 13:49:52 GMT
ASLEF members at the three eastern depots voted 96 to 21 for strikes, drivers will be asked not to book on between 21:00 Tuesday 21st and 20:59 Wednesday 22nd February with RMT members expected to respect the picket line.
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Post by linus on Feb 15, 2017 20:17:12 GMT
The usual predictable totally disproportionate action of an irresponsible, mindless, callous bunch of cowardly louts.
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Post by superteacher on Feb 15, 2017 20:22:23 GMT
The usual predictable totally disproportionate action of an irresponsible, mindless, callous bunch of cowardly louts.
Strike action is always emotive but remember that people rarely strike unless they feel aggrieved. There are forum members who may be amongst those taking action, and will take great exception to what you have said. |
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Post by deansullivan on Feb 15, 2017 20:40:05 GMT
Incidentally, further to deansullivan's point about whether this was a railway replacement service, I checked the direction markers at the top of Old Station Rd yesterday (which are still there)--they clearly state Rail replacement buses. So there was evidently some doubt on that point. Also, I think - but can't be sure - the whiteboard notice referred to replacement buses. It was very unclear as to whether tickets had to be bought from the machines, which were still accessible; but if these buses were "extras" to route 418/397,and not rail replacements as dean says, presumably tickets had to be bought on the bus. In fact route 418 does not accept oyster/contactless, so that might have been a bit of a problem. Or quite possibly, passengers were just waved through (I heard a discussion on this but not its outcome) By the way, the leaving of the direction markers in place --does that imply another strike is on its way? Sorry I missed this - but I will reply a few days late! The signs you see attached to lamp posts are generic and are intended for drivers use. London Buses kindly erected them the day before as the drivers out route learning saw them going up. However given the sensitivities of the matter, the buses are branded as service 'Extras'. The client (LBSL) has made it very clear from the outset that we cannot describe them as Rail Replacement services. And to my knowledge they were not procured on behalf of LUL. But given the special nature of this particular service, I accept that perhaps it would have been better branded as such. But that's a decision for a higher authority. :-) |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2017 21:04:01 GMT
The fairest thing to do is Re-Introduced Strike Refunds (like they once did before 2007 or thereabouts), it will help a lot. There is a massive surplus building up at TFL, as reported in the news from time to time, probably from Stealth Taxes like witholding strike refunds etc.
If the Mainline Train Companies can offer Delay Repay (Regardless of cause), then LUL should also adhere to equally high standards too (C2C Hint).
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Post by superteacher on Feb 15, 2017 21:14:43 GMT
The fairest thing to do is Re-Introduced Strike Refunds (like they once did before 2007 or thereabouts), it will help a lot. There is a massive surplus building up at TFL, as reported in the news from time to time, probably from Stealth Taxes like witholding strike refunds etc. If the Mainline Train Companies can offer Delay Repay (Regardless of cause), then LUL should also adhere to equally high standards too (C2C Hint). Surplus? So why are they trying to make so many savings? |
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Post by Chris M on Feb 16, 2017 0:29:45 GMT
While they may currently have money in the bank, the chances are this is fully earmarked for things like Goblin electrification, Crossrail, Croxley, etc, etc.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Feb 16, 2017 1:18:39 GMT
While they may currently have money in the bank, the chances are this is fully earmarked for things like Goblin electrification, Crossrail, Croxley, etc, etc. Croxley maybe but Crossrail is all paid for by the DfT and Goblin electrification is Network Rail. The big problem is that since 2013 TfL has had a slow reduction in its central government subsidy with zero subsidy from 2018. After that its going to have to get by on what they've got stashed away, fares revenue and the Mayor's Olympic precept. At Leytonstone they installed automatic gates to the staff car park a few years ago but they've not been working for months because there's no money to fix them. |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Feb 16, 2017 1:38:08 GMT
The usual predictable totally disproportionate action of an irresponsible, mindless, callous bunch of cowardly louts. Yeah, we're all losing a day's pay for no personal gain to ourselves, supporting colleagues who followed the transfer procedure, were offered a transfer by management to the depots they wanted, were told that Night Tube would be introduced without any detrimental effect to existing drivers and have now been moved off the Central Line. Oh we're such a bunch of callous, cowardly louts!!! Would you stand up for a colleague or would you just shrug and let management get on with it because it didn't affect you? I've been working here for 19 years, 1 month and 11 days, every dispute and every strike I've witnessed has been a result of management or political failure, even in the case of the Northern Line driver who failed a breath test they managed to leave an unsupervised trainee to carry out the first test in complete disregard for procedure. London Underground management are unfit for purpose, every time there's a problem the public and the media give them a free pass, blaming the unions. Management dread the day that unions would be banned as they'd actually have to take responsibility for the mess they create, we're a useful bogey man! Still Mike Brown messes up the Sub Surface Line signalling and Fit for the Future - Stations, he gets promoted to TfL Commissioner. Incompetence is rewarded |
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DWS
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Post by DWS on Feb 16, 2017 19:15:30 GMT
The usual predictable totally disproportionate action of an irresponsible, mindless, callous bunch of cowardly louts. Yeah, we're all losing a day's pay for no personal gain to ourselves, supporting colleagues who followed the transfer procedure, were offered a transfer by management to the depots they wanted, were told that Night Tube would be introduced without any detrimental effect to existing drivers and have now been moved off the Central Line. Oh we're such a bunch of callous, cowardly louts!!! Would you stand up for a colleague or would you just shrug and let management get on with it because it didn't affect you? I've been working here for 19 years, 1 month and 11 days, every dispute and every strike I've witnessed has been a result of management or political failure, even in the case of the Northern Line driver who failed a breath test they managed to leave an unsupervised trainee to carry out the first test in complete disregard for procedure. London Underground management are unfit for purpose, every time there's a problem the public and the media give them a free pass, blaming the unions. Management dread the day that unions would be banned as they'd actually have to take responsibility for the mess they create, we're a useful bogey man! Still Mike Brown messes up the Sub Surface Line signalling and Fit for the Future - Stations, he gets promoted to TfL Commissioner. Incompetence is rewarded Well said Mr Shrugged . I am glad to have retired from LUL, the management have been not fit for the task, thats why they keep leaving after a few years in the top posts. |
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Post by John Tuthill on Feb 16, 2017 20:00:55 GMT
The usual predictable totally disproportionate action of an irresponsible, mindless, callous bunch of cowardly louts. Yeah, we're all losing a day's pay for no personal gain to ourselves, supporting colleagues who followed the transfer procedure, were offered a transfer by management to the depots they wanted, were told that Night Tube would be introduced without any detrimental effect to existing drivers and have now been moved off the Central Line. Oh we're such a bunch of callous, cowardly louts!!! Would you stand up for a colleague or would you just shrug and let management get on with it because it didn't affect you? I've been working here for 19 years, 1 month and 11 days, every dispute and every strike I've witnessed has been a result of management or political failure, even in the case of the Northern Line driver who failed a breath test they managed to leave an unsupervised trainee to carry out the first test in complete disregard for procedure. London Underground management are unfit for purpose, every time there's a problem the public and the media give them a free pass, blaming the unions. Management dread the day that unions would be banned as they'd actually have to take responsibility for the mess they create, we're a useful bogey man! Still Mike Brown messes up the Sub Surface Line signalling and Fit for the Future - Stations, he gets promoted to TfL Commissioner. Incompetence is rewarded Nothing new about that. When I started work with the old GPO, after a few years there were people in positions of authority, and you asked your seniors "How did he get the job?" The cynical response was usually on the lines of "If he's 'upstairs' he can't do any damage." The implication being that as the old Strowger equipment was all electro-mechanical precise adjustment was vital. superteacher: Post edited to fix quotes, and colour of highlighted section changed to blue. Green is reserved for mod comments, such as this one.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2017 20:47:02 GMT
That's the price you pay for having too many unsuitable Graduate Management Trainees on the Underground, particularly if the degree is in media studies or performing arts etc, the lack of soft people skills shows badly in LUL, and returning to the traditional proven way of promoting from within will help the situation somewhat.
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Post by crusty54 on Feb 16, 2017 20:50:15 GMT
That's the price you pay for having too many unsuitable Graduate Management Trainees on the Underground, particularly if the degree is in media studies or performing arts etc, the lack of soft people skills shows badly in LUL, and returning to the traditional proven way of promoting from within will help the situation somewhat. The problems started when they went for MBAs. The Underground is much more than a business and it needs to be recognised. |
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Post by John Tuthill on Feb 16, 2017 20:56:05 GMT
Yeah, we're all losing a day's pay for no personal gain to ourselves, supporting colleagues who followed the transfer procedure, were offered a transfer by management to the depots they wanted, were told that Night Tube would be introduced without any detrimental effect to existing drivers and have now been moved off the Central Line. Oh we're such a bunch of callous, cowardly louts!!! Would you stand up for a colleague or would you just shrug and let management get on with it because it didn't affect you? I've been working here for 19 years, 1 month and 11 days, every dispute and every strike I've witnessed has been a result of management or political failure, even in the case of the Northern Line driver who failed a breath test they managed to leave an unsupervised trainee to carry out the first test in complete disregard for procedure. London Underground management are unfit for purpose, every time there's a problem the public and the media give them a free pass, blaming the unions. Management dread the day that unions would be banned as they'd actually have to take responsibility for the mess they create, we're a useful bogey man! Still Mike Brown messes up the Sub Surface Line signalling and Fit for the Future - Stations, he gets promoted to TfL Commissioner. Incompetence is rewarded Nothing new about that. When I started work with the old GPO, after a few years there were people in positions of authority, and you asked your seniors "How did he get the job?" The cynical response was usually on the lines of "If he's 'upstairs' he can't do any damage." The implication being that as the old Strowger equipment was all electro-mechanical precise adjustment was vital. superteacher: Post edited to fix quotes, and colour of highlighted section changed to blue. Green is reserved for mod comments, such as this one.
Thank you |
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Feb 16, 2017 21:46:00 GMT
That's the price you pay for having too many unsuitable Graduate Management Trainees on the Underground, particularly if the degree is in media studies or performing arts etc, the lack of soft people skills shows badly in LUL, and returning to the traditional proven way of promoting from within will help the situation somewhat. I didn't know we recruited graduate trainees to be purely managers, nor that media studies or performing arts were suitable courses. I'm also certain that 100% internal promotion is not a reliable way of building a suitable management structure, and can think of plenty of internally promoted managers who have very poor people skills. |
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Post by North End on Feb 16, 2017 23:05:15 GMT
That's the price you pay for having too many unsuitable Graduate Management Trainees on the Underground, particularly if the degree is in media studies or performing arts etc, the lack of soft people skills shows badly in LUL, and returning to the traditional proven way of promoting from within will help the situation somewhat. Run out of shoulders to rest the chips on? Not sure how you arrive at the idea of recruiting from within and coming through ranks being traditionally proven. Come to my location and ask who are the worst managers, and I guarantee you may find the responses surprising. The reality is there are some pretty awful 'through the ranks' managers on the Underground, perhaps there because of who they knew at the time, or because they kept putting applications in and eventually hit lucky. Suitability for a role has more to do with the individual and their aptitude, personality and attitude, and nothing whatsoever to do with their background. At least most of the graduates we have can string a sentence together in writing, which is more than some 'time served' individuals. superteacher: abbreviation "SFA" changed to "nothing whatsoever" so as not to confuse those unfamiliar with colloquialisms. |
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Post by Chris M on Feb 17, 2017 1:00:33 GMT
Management is a skill that is (in most roles) unrelated to the skills required to do the job of the people being managed. Some people in the lower ranks have the capability to be good managers, some do not. Whether someone will or wont is not necessarily related to how good at their current job they are.
A good manager does need to understand what the people they are managing do (and what the people they manage do, etc.) but this does not necessarily mean that they need to have done the job those people do.
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Post by North End on Feb 17, 2017 1:59:55 GMT
Management is a skill that is (in most roles) unrelated to the skills required to do the job of the people being managed. Some people in the lower ranks have the capability to be good managers, some do not. Whether someone will or wont is not necessarily related to how good at their current job they are. A good manager does need to understand what the people they are managing do (and what the people they manage do, etc.) but this does not necessarily mean that they need to have done the job those people do. On the railway the manager does need some degree of knowledge in order to do the job effectively. Otherwise one gets rubbish like a driver being stood down for days whilst a manager tries to do them for a SPAD on a repeater signal, to give an example of a true story. Again much comes down to attitude - an inexperienced person could take the time and put the effort in to understand something correctly, whilst a clueless old timer may arrogantly think they know when in reality they don't. |
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Post by Chris M on Feb 17, 2017 12:34:02 GMT
Absolutely. Knowledge is required, but doing the job is not the only way to gain that knowledge. Regardless of how you acquire the knowledge in the first place you need to keep it up to date as things change - how many managers on the SSR who are former train operators ever drove an S stock in passenger service for example? This is something that some old-timers fail to do.
The attitude you bring to the job is completely independent of what you did prior to getting the job.
I've never worked for TfL, but from reading this forum I know that most people who do have experienced good managers and bad managers. I very strongly suspect that there is a strong correlation between those managers who ask questions and listen to the answers and those managers who are regarded as "good".
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Post by aslefshrugged on Feb 20, 2017 10:34:28 GMT
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Post by stapler on Feb 22, 2017 13:24:17 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2017 13:46:02 GMT
Both of those links don't work unfortunately.
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Post by stapler on Feb 22, 2017 14:07:11 GMT
Both of those links don't work unfortunately. That's odd -- have just tested them.... Mods can sometimes assist.... |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2017 15:41:24 GMT
I think they're set as private, so only you can see them.
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Post by stapler on Feb 22, 2017 16:20:23 GMT
I think they're set as private, so only you can see them. Sorry, try 1drv.ms/f/s!AjXUdwhmpFc6ghYmrvR_C12RzwHx instead! |
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Feb 22, 2017 17:14:01 GMT
I think they're set as private, so only you can see them. Sorry, try 1drv.ms/f/s!AjXUdwhmpFc6ghYmrvR_C12RzwHx instead!
Link 1: Bus
And your map.....Link 2: Map
Everybody, do take care when making sections of private cloud drives public just in case you reveal more than you might initially suspect! |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2017 17:14:46 GMT
Sorry, try 1drv.ms/f/s!AjXUdwhmpFc6ghYmrvR_C12RzwHx instead!
Yep, that works, however you need to copy and paste the link, or click here. I wouldn't mind having that RM as a replacement for my train  |
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Feb 22, 2017 17:17:58 GMT
Sorry, try 1drv.ms/f/s!AjXUdwhmpFc6ghYmrvR_C12RzwHx instead!
Yep, that works, however you need to copy and paste the link, or click here. I wouldn't mind having that RM as a replacement for my train See my post above yours for the correct links @kingsiwel. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2017 17:40:35 GMT
See my post above yours for the correct links @kingsiwel . We posted at the same time  |
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My original point still stands, regardless! 
