This weekends engineering works

Now that is what I thought, which is why i had to look twice.

It was def a D Stock pulling into the bay platform at Barking at around 6.45 last night.

Pure guess, but as West Ham were at home perhaps it was a football train?

There was indeed one D stock running Whitechapel - Barking short trips. I don't have a timetable, so I don't know if this was an ad-hoc extra or scheduled.

I saw this train several times yesterday, both afternoon and well into the evening.

There was a second D stock I noted with a driver in the cab in Barking Sidings and this was suitably timed for the football, so I assume that one was indeed a football extra.

Both trains seem to be sourced from Barking sidings (one train usually overnights there and one road is usualy spare which probably took a curtailed (Timetable variation) Upminster train on the Fri night.

I experienced a similar thing a few months' ago during one of these never-ending District Line shutdowns. The last EB from Aldgate East (off the WB) was formed by a D Stock even though the DR was officially suspended west of Whitechapel (again...).

The service pattern seemed to be different from previous weekends. As well as Richmond - Embankment, Wimbledon Park - High St, Ealing - High St, there were also Olympia - Embankments.

My thoughts exactly, what the hell C2C were playing at I have no idea, I couldn't even get on the first one to arrive at Upminster, it was totally rammed. Surely not rocket science, that carrying all those extras you need to put 8 car sets out !!!


Ooo, thats unusual ! We do like unusual patterns like that. Glad it was keeping Upfast and co on their toes ;D ;D

It wasn't just C2C who dropped the ball over the weekend, it would appear.

The station staff at Mile End claimed there had been no attempt to increase the frequency of the H&C service despite there being no other way of getting from Mile End, Whitechapel or Aldgate East to the west end of London. Whether this was true or not I don't know but certainly there were absolutely colossal gaps in the H&C service (16 minutes westbound, 11 minutes eastbound when I was at Mile End on Saturday 2.30pm) and a platform absolutely rammed with people.

There was also no mention of the knock-on effects on other lines. The District was described as providing a "good service" west of Embankment when it was clearly providing nothing of the sort. Huge service gaps and an advertised 6-10 minute interval is not a normal service.

I don't mind the engineering work but the absurd fingers-in-ears pretence by TfL that there is no disruption beyond what is suspended or closed is becoming a bore.

The H&C was timetabled to provide a substantially increased service to Barking; sat every 8 mins in place of every 16. Sunday every 8 mins in place of no trains at all ! (Plus can now confirm two extra untimetabled District trains ran all day Whitechapel - Barking and two more Embankment - Olympia) There may well have been blips in the service of course, not remotely helped by the FA continuing to schedule West Ham home games after they have been notified of shutdowns before setting fixtures.

Be it adequate or not if the timetabled service is operating, then that is a "good service" and MORE than the timetabled service was operating !

The matter of overspill to other lines has been substantailly enhanced given that rail replacement buses are not provided for zone 1 or where other suitable routes are deemed to be readily available.

Thank you for the explanation but you have laid bare the sort of Alice-in-Wonderland approach that leaves customers (and staff) frustrated.

The timetable did not work as described, for whatever reason, leaving staff at the affected stations exasperated.

I do not know which is more extraordinary: the notion that a service can be 'good' regardless or whether it is adequate or the idea that big events should be scheduled around the needs of public transport planners whose job is to provide access to these events in the first place. Will we be able to reschedule the Olympics?

Fine by me

Many of you will remember recently engineering work between ECT - Embankment and also between HSK and ERD.. still even though Chelsea FC were aware of this they still decided to organise a home game on the Saturday.. the result = chaos !! And everyone makes out its LULs fault for doing the works when football are on, when really Chelsea did the football when the works were on ! (They should have closed Fulham Bdy stn that day)

Public transport is a public service. It is funded through taxation by individuals and businesses (including football clubs and their supporters) to provide a service were there is demand. The idea that it is entitled to anything, let alone to take precedence over the people that pay for it and use, it is utterly proposterous and arrogant in the extreme.

There is a common sense approach where a football club could take into account the needs of a public rail operator, but given that engineering work is shutting the line down on every other weekend I wonder what WHFC is supposed to do? Hold the match at a time when no fans can make it anyway?

The information your provide about trains per hour is interesting and very useful (thank you) and I hope it will be used by TfL - in conjunction with the feedback from users like me and from station staff - to improve alternative arrangements in the future.

Engineering works aside, it's not like Upton Park station was closed, it had a 7 1/2 min H&C instead of a 5 min District, the gaps reffered to by Deals19 suggests there must have been operating problems elsewhere, thats life they happen, may have been TfL's fault may have been customer related, the yobbish element of football create them too !

The fact of the matter is, at the best of times, football at West Ham causes massive disruption to all transport in the area, be it Underground, buses or roads. The infrastructure can not cope with the sudden hit of people all arriving and departing simmultaneously. Midweek games often result in trains queuing back to Mile End and delay our "bread and butter" top fare paying peak commuters, not to mention generate disruption which sees many trains turned short at Dagenham East (to the detriment of passenger travelling east there of) and late breaks that feel an effect much later in the day.
Weekend games are disruptive though marginally less so, but purely because slightly fewer trains operate.

I'd accept to some extent this is LUL's problem in how it deals with these crowds. However scheduling additional trains to operate for these very small windows is limited by track capacity and is costly, as you can't magic up extra staff and trains at all sorts of odd times. They have to be scheduled every saturday or evening or whatever and then are wasted if they are unusued.
Two such trains are scheduled daily (which were the trains used during the shutdown, but uniquely spare staff available enabled their operation all day and evening).

The principle limiting factor however is access to and egress from Upton park platforms, for safety reasons trains are not permitted to depart until platforms are clear, or are held to prevent overcrowding upon the return. Running more trains just exacerbates the problem as more trains are then blocking back.

In the end it will doubtless be seen that the only viable solution will be to close Upton Park station at match times and force the use of Plaistow and East Ham thus reducing the dwell problem by half. This is what happens on the Piccadilly Line for Arsenal games.

Problems will presumably dissipate if West Ham move to the suggested new ground at West Ham as that station design and multiple platforms would handle large crowds much better.

The ratio of EB Central Line and Hammersmith & City Line trains at Mile End tonight was 7-to-1, which was really great for those trying to get east of there by the District Line route.

Whilst I agree with the sentiments in favour of WHUFC, it's worth bearing in mind the a few points.

Firstly, West Ham don't set the dates - the FA does.
Secondly, this weekend's shutdown has been planned since Summer 2007 - well before this year's football fixtures have been set. It isn't like TfL have sprung these dates on anyone at the beginning of the football season.