PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Jan 24, 2008 20:57:24 GMT
Interesting thread that has got me thinking....
Two questions: 1) What is the procedure for enabling/testing the tripcock when you either take a train into service or change ends?
2) What happens in the case of a planned wrong road movement for engineering work? For example during the construction of the Victoria line at Highbury in c1965, the Northern City ran as two single line shuttles in the evenings with 'one engine in steam' on each: Moorgate - Essex Road, Essex Road - Drayton Pk with cross platform interchange at Essex Rd. Also, elsewhere on this site, there are pictures of wrong road working at Bow Rd. What would be the arrangements for tripcocks and signalling generally for such moves?
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Jan 16, 2008 0:26:07 GMT
I believe the Chelsea/Tottenham fixture was tonight (it appears in this weeks TC as such) and I believe it was changed due to another fixture Spurs have over the next couple of days. You are always going to have this problem with cup games (and especially, cup replays) as opposed to league games. The league fixtures are sorted out well before the start of the season, in consultation with police and other interested parties and some effort is made not to have too many home games too close to each other, etc. At that stage, transport operators would be consulted for major engineering works, etc. However, the problem with a cup competition, of course, is that a) each round is drawn after the last round, and b) there are considerable pressures to get the cup games played on the correct weekend, otherwise the whole competition grinds to a halt - and this is particularly so for replays. If you then compound that with replays being called off due to flooding at short notice (as has actually happened in both the FA and Scottish cups this week) so it is impossible to do much contingency planning. So transport operators the world over have this problem. The detail required in planning the logistics for a game is quite staggering. I live near a significant rugby stadium which had a short notice cup game arranged. Unfortunately, nobody relayed this to the section of the police responsible for putting out traffic cones to restrict parking. Result, people parked where they liked, away supporters coaches got stuck, the local area went into gridlock, the local bus service was decimated and kick off was significantly delayed whilst all the fans tried to get through the resulting chaos. So my very best sympathies to anybody on the District, or any other transport operator, who has received abuse because of similar situations.
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 16, 2008 3:26:59 GMT
So that's it then......... I thoroughly enjoyed this evening and it was great to meet so many people off the forum. The special posters in the windows and informative PAs were really nice touches. Many thanks to DD, Aspect, COLIN and everyone else involved for the prior organisation and for sharing a super evening with the rest of us.
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 15, 2008 13:23:04 GMT
EDIT: I've now posted a reply on his blog thanking him for the plug and taking the geek comment on the chin ! Fair enough, we will be geeks all night thenI shall now stop posting and head for Upminster.......
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 15, 2008 11:34:10 GMT
The point is that we only know about this working at all because of the credibility that this forum has with LU management and the fact that DD has been asked by management to publicise the event this way. So the credibility of this forum is very important and we all benefit very considerably from it.
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 15, 2008 11:12:38 GMT
Yes, that article has a somewhat disparaging and uncredited hyperlink back to this forum further up this very thread where it says near the bottom: "Be warned also that the train is likely to be full of last-train-riding transport geeks with cameras, ". I hope the Admins feel able to deal with this as they deem appropriate.
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 14, 2008 1:44:38 GMT
More seriously I hope the weather doesn't stay as pleasant as it has been last few days as it is utterly hopeless for photos. As a warning in the afternoon both Barking WB and West Ham WB are hopeless for photos if the sun is out as the canopies and NR overhead throws black shadows across the sides and fronts of trains. I can quite categorically state that the weather has no bearing whatsoever on the photographic possibilities of Tower Hill Eastbound ;D ;D ;D However, with only four days left, this will have to do. I was very fortunate to see it as I wasn't actually pursuing D Stock that day and was engaged on a 'normal' activity, and also that the bay road was empty at the time. Please excuse horrible photo taken on my phone. 12-02-2008 at 17:49 7534 EB at Tower Hill Was anyone on this forum driving? Might there be any chance of it getting a little TLC before Friday in terms of cleaning the grime off the cab front and fixing the broken tail light? I can't believe that next week this will all be history......
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Feb 11, 2008 11:35:34 GMT
For the benefit of those of us who don't frequent the District on a daily basis and are coming down specially, could someone provide some info re logistics. Clearly the train is in service and according to the duty details posted by 21146 (many thanks) seems to have quite tight turnarounds. I guess most normal District passengers don't stay on the same train for 8.5 hours So specifcally - where is the best location for a 'PNR'
- where is the best location to get a nice greasy kebab
without missing too much of the action? Also, would I be right in thinking that by the time we get finished, there will be no tubes into central London and that the N207 night bus will do from outside Ealing Common station? Any help greatly appreciated. Really looking forward to it and hopefully to meeting some folks from here. Many thanks once again to Dave and his colleagues for making the effort to put this on and for keeping us all informed of developments. Those of us who are not professional railway employees are truly privilledged to have the insights provided by this forum.
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Jan 13, 2008 21:59:47 GMT
Yes please, count me in, depending on the final date.
Thanks Dave, and colleagues, for sticking your necks out for our benefit and going the extra mile to make this a special and memorable event.
It would be really good if people could think ahead a little and refrain from planning on removing bits, flash photography, trespassing, any other anti-social behaviour or doing anything else that is contrary to the rules or that could get genuine enthusiasts a bad reputation. Otherwise, events like this will not be sanctioned in the future, because they will be too much trouble. So bang will go your 67TS, A Stock and C Stock farewells.
Wouldn't it be good if management could look back at the last unrefurb D Stock trip and remember the event as passing off with exemplary behaviour from all involved?
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Jan 18, 2008 12:13:30 GMT
Just to clarify the last couple of posts. The defective train was at East Ham. The two trains involved in the collision were in the vicinity of Bromley and were not in themselves defective before the incident, but became immobilised by the discharging of TC. The juice was off for a long period and therefore they lost all air also. So an assisting train procedure would not have been either appropriate, or possible due to lack of TC. Sorry, this might not be clear in my précis, but is clear in the full .pdf report at www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/MoT_Bromley1955.pdfSo given these circumstances that an assisting train is not an option, how would the incident be handled now?
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PGtrips
Ahh... don't you just love PG?
Posts: 113
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Post by PGtrips on Jan 18, 2008 1:40:02 GMT
There is a very interesting accident report on the excellent Railways Archive site into the collision between two trains of R Stock at Bromley EB in 1955. I would be very interested to know of how a similar incident might be handled differently today. www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docSummary.php?docID=466The gist of it is that there was a prolonged shut down of some 2½ hours due to a defective train at East Ham. This resulted in loss of air pressure and hence, Westinghouse. The report states that it was not possible to detrain the passengers with the train in situ, so eventually authorisation was given for it to be allowed to run by gravity down the bank into Bromley station under control of the 3 handbrakes available. The guard had control of 2 of them at either end of a packed car, and failed to apply them with sufficient ‘vigour’ in the words of the inspecting officer. The report gives a fascinating glimpse into how times have changed and is notable for what the inspecting officer does NOT pass comment on. Fortunately, there was not much damage and injuries were not severe. However, I think it would be very interesting if members who know the area concerned could comment on: - How would a similar incident be handled today?
- What are the particular geographical features of just west of Bromley on the EB road that made it not possible to detrain the passengers?
- Would a similar procedure of allowing a train to roll controlled by means of the handbrake only be permitted today?
What is also quite amazing is the primitive methods of communication available and complete lack of communication with passengers. There are numerous other questions raised by the report as to how the incident might have been handled differently. NB I have posted this here, rather than in the historical thread, as I am particularly interested in how current practice would be applied to a similar incident.
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