1960 Stock Headlights

I can't really answer the question as to whether they were from D Stock or 1983 Tube Stock, although indeed they do look as though they might. However, photos and notes from my files show me the following, which I hope will shed some light (!) on the subject -

The Track Recording Train had two light clusters per motor car end from conversion in 1987, so IF they are from 1983 or D Stock, they would probably have come from 'spares', I assume.

Only two other 1960 Tube Stock units had them. Unit 3906-4927-3907 did NOT have them when the unit was painted red in May 1990. They were fitted (according to my notes) in "early-1991".

The second unit was 3908-4921-3909 which was given its new headlight cluster immediately before repainting in red in April 1991. I have a photo of it in unpainted aluminium WITH the headlight mod done.

I agree with you re the 1959/62 headlight mods. But the 1956 headlight mods were an "abortion".

Thanks for the information on this - I think I probably prefer the original circular lights as well! To me, the square-based ones look a bit too 'modern' for this type of train!

What happened to the 1956 Stock headlights?

I think that what they did to the 56TS headlights was still better than what they did on the 1960 stock. I also agree that the 59/62TS mod was better. Were headlight mods done to any other types of stock?

And the 38ts that were used in engineers trains. None of them identical from what I can tell either.

A stock didn't look much different with their original lights. I don't know when they got their new lights, but it was before they were refurbished. There are photos of A stock in original condition on the LT Museum website:
www.ltmcollection.org/photos/photo/photo.html?_IXSR_=DJ9uM1nPxsy&_IXMAXHITS_=1&IXinv=2003/5402&IXsummary=results/results&IXsearch=A60%20stock&_IXFIRST_=1

The only real visible differences on A Stock at OPO conversion (1994-1998) were the new headlights (on outer DMs of single ended units and both DMS double-ended units) and the section beneath the driver's cab window which was added for the cab interior door controls, making the front-end appearance non-symmetrical.

The high intensity headlights on inner end single ended units were fitted at OPO conversion. Until then they retained their twin headlights.

Are you sure it was refurbished, and not just painted in an experimental livery? But, the A stock got their new lights before that.

The 59/62 looked exactly the same with marker lights, only that they were of lower intensity. There were no changes to the outer bodywork of the cars, merely the internal fittings were replaced by the HI units.

That's been very helpful - I assumed that 'marker lights' were the lights which depicted a train's destination (for example, the type seen on the 1938 Stock) but obviously now I know that this isn't always the case! Thanks for the information!

I think it was only on the inner ends of the cars only.

I thought the 59s got them as well. I remember as a child in the early 90s at Edgware the boxes on the inner end cabs and wondering what they were?

www.railfaneurope.net/pix/gb/metro/London_Underground/emu-tube/Piccadilly/Piccadilly_Line_171.jpg

This old 59 car has the alarm gear. The outcome of the Kings Cross fire report forced LU to modify all stock, even that soon for disposal.

There are a few ex-59ts drivers on here, I'm sure they can clear it up.

All 1956 and 1959 Tube Stock had "the boxes" at the middle positions only and not at the outer ends.

Most of the 1962 Tube Stock was similar. However, 36 units were designated as double-enders (for the shuttle services and flexibility) and had "the boxes" at each cab end. These were:

1400, 1406, 1410, 1420, 1430, 1440, 1450, 1456, 1460,
1470, 1480, 1490, 1500, 1506, 1510, 1520, 1530, 1540,
1550, 1556, 1560, 1570, 1576, 1580, 1590, 1600, 1606,
1610, 1620, 1630, 1640, 1650, 1660, 1670, 1680, 1690.

Those ending in '6' were double-ended de-icers.

That still is a problem on the A stock, but something could be done about that by not using the Croxley - Rickmansworth side of the triangle. On the Northern, you have to use the Kennington loop, so they could have uncoupled units less often (of course it doesn't matter now, as the Northern now uses 95TS).
It would make sense for the last A stock units in service to be double ended ones, as there would be less spare units around.