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Post by undergroundernie on Oct 3, 2008 22:26:55 GMT
Is it true that some time ago plans were announced by London Transport to infill the cutting that Shoreditch station is sited in, I read on Wiki that this was the case, does any know if there is any truth in this?. Also does anyone have any historical info about the station or images that I can use for my site. cheers.
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metman
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Post by metman on Oct 3, 2008 23:31:00 GMT
The site of the station has been infilled to provide the ramp to clear the GER lines I believe!
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Post by cetacean on Oct 4, 2008 8:53:45 GMT
The station cutting was filled in a couple of years ago. Have a look at this picture (which was taken by me earlier this year) - the cutting used to follow a line from the yellow container in the distance, underneath the white vans (roughly where the platforms were) and underneath the station building (where there used to be a connection to the main line). As you can see, there's no trace of it. (or compare with this image - the barbed wire fence on the right is in roughly the same place as the construction hoarding in the picture above)
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Post by undergroundernie on Oct 4, 2008 10:02:34 GMT
Interesting I know there were also some rumours about linking a line between the station and Liverpool street but this clearly rubbishes those to be honest it seemed a bit ambitious, do you mind at all if I feature your first image? cheers.
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Post by cetacean on Oct 4, 2008 10:21:12 GMT
Sure.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2008 20:35:01 GMT
I wonder what will happen to the station building. It might make a nice house for an enthusiast
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2008 20:37:15 GMT
I have heard it may become a community centre.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2008 22:57:04 GMT
Interesting I know there were also some rumours about linking a line between the station and Liverpool street but this clearly rubbishes those to be honest it seemed a bit ambitious, do you mind at all if I feature your first image? cheers. It used to link to Liverpool Street may years ago! Maybe someone got confused here? Although before the extension to Dalston there was talk of the East london Line going back to Liverpool Street.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2008 11:15:56 GMT
The ELL would not go back to Liverpool St. Surely it would be the curve at Navarino Road so that the NLL can go to Liverpool St.
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Post by cetacean on Oct 8, 2008 11:50:15 GMT
That's the Graham Road curve. It links to one of the most congested parts of the network, and the journey time to Liverpool Street would be pretty awful from most parts of the NLL. On the other hand, the ELL at Shoreditch linked to the side of Liverpool Street that's going to be vacated when Crossrail starts running, so it would have been an option to reuse that capacity.
(I've no idea what the actual proposal was)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2008 12:11:27 GMT
I apologise Cetacean. I was thinking of the wrong side. By the way, is there anything left of the junction between the widened lines and the GE?
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Post by amershamsi on Oct 8, 2008 12:33:10 GMT
you mean the Met and the GE Somersetchris
The widened lines ended at Moorgate and never went any further (annoyingly) - it would have been great that it went round to Cannon Street or something for the ex-Kings Cross trains, thus doing away for the need for a circle line.
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Oct 8, 2008 12:38:49 GMT
There was a connection at Farringdon between the City Widened Lines or CWL and the Inner and Outer Circle, taken out when the Moorgate line was electrified. The Hotel Curve and York Road Curve connections to the then Eastern Region at Kings X Suburban and York Road Platform respectively. However it seems from what I have read that it is proposed to resuscitate the connection?
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Post by cetacean on Oct 8, 2008 14:05:47 GMT
The Hotel Curve and York Road Curve are permanently closed. The new connection has already been built. Two bored tunnels branch off either track immediately north of St Pancras Thameslink and come up here next to the ECML. As you can see, the connection has no track.
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Oct 8, 2008 16:12:13 GMT
I seem to recall that York Road Curve has been used for cabling?
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Post by DrOne on Oct 8, 2008 23:23:56 GMT
On the other hand, the ELL at Shoreditch linked to the side of Liverpool Street that's going to be vacated when Crossrail starts running, so it would have been an option to reuse that capacity. (I've no idea what the actual proposal was) I think the most obvious plans for the vacated platforms at Liverpool Street would be linked with the 4 tracking of the WAML from Tottenham-Broxbourne. At the moment I think terminating capacity at Liverpool Street in the peaks is one of the issues preventing this. With Crossrail in place (and the metro service taken underground) the approach tracks to Liv St could be feformed so GEML services use the current metro tracks on the south side, allowing the WA services full use the 4 tracks which make up the middle and northern approaches. If we're talking about the vacated platforms at Paddington then that's another matter...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2008 23:46:59 GMT
I seem to recall that York Road Curve has been used for cabling? That rings a bell - although I believe it might have been the Hotel Curve that was used for pipes/cabling? Whichever one (maybe both) of the connections were used, the utility diversions were part of the advance works before construction of the new ticket halls, around four or five years ago. From what I remember there was a bit of an accident during this phase of the work, where a mains cable was cut causing a major power failure of the public electricity supply!
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Post by cetacean on Oct 9, 2008 0:20:33 GMT
the approach tracks to Liv St could be feformed so GEML services use the current metro tracks on the south side, allowing the WA services full use the 4 tracks which make up the middle and northern approaches. It's not quite that simple - the southern platforms are shorter than the middle platforms, so longer GEML trains will have to still use the middle approaches, and send whatever short trains you can (eg Chingfords) onto the south platforms. Lots of fun flat crossing movements ahoy.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2008 9:46:03 GMT
I though there still a plan to run some Crossrail trains into Liverpool Street after the central section had opened?
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Post by cetacean on Oct 9, 2008 17:36:48 GMT
Yes there'll still be some non-Crossrail trains running all stops Gidea Park-Liverpool Street, but it'll be far fewer than do so today and only happen in the peak hours. That'll mean track capacity and platforms freed up for other services.
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Post by DrOne on Oct 15, 2008 8:40:09 GMT
the approach tracks to Liv St could be feformed so GEML services use the current metro tracks on the south side, allowing the WA services full use the 4 tracks which make up the middle and northern approaches. It's not quite that simple - the southern platforms are shorter than the middle platforms, so longer GEML trains will have to still use the middle approaches, and send whatever short trains you can (eg Chingfords) onto the south platforms. Lots of fun flat crossing movements ahoy. True. While the ideal thing would have been for such work to be included in Crossrail construction, it's probably too much to expect considering the lack of foresight to sort out the approaches to the vacated international platforms at Waterloo. The future of the Hammersmith & City/Circle is another one that really should be neatly sorted out as part of Crossrail.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2008 12:25:23 GMT
Yes there'll still be some non-Crossrail trains running all stops Gidea Park-Liverpool Street, but it'll be far fewer than do so today and only happen in the peak hours. That'll mean track capacity and platforms freed up for other services. Does this mean then, that there'll still be NXEA (or whatever it will be when Crossrail is complete) running, as they do now, local services to Shenfield / beyond, just obviously in fewer numbers?
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Post by peterc on Oct 15, 2008 17:57:46 GMT
I haven't been following Crossrail in as much detail now that I no longer live in Essex but IIRC it will not serve Maryland and a limited number of Liverpool Street locals will be retained. Of course that could have changed, that was early on in the present set of plans.
The ELL link to the Electric Lines was planned as part of the original Liverpool Street redevelopment plan which assumed that additional platforms would be built. Because BR were not permitted to demolish the central wall dividing the two halves of the station the additional platform was never built so the ELL was never reconnected.
I remember when first commuting to the City in the 1960s being totally confused by the sight of an Underground train in the platform at Shoreditch while waiting at a signal.
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Post by DrOne on Oct 17, 2008 12:00:26 GMT
Yes there'll still be some non-Crossrail trains running all stops Gidea Park-Liverpool Street, but it'll be far fewer than do so today and only happen in the peak hours. That'll mean track capacity and platforms freed up for other services. Does this mean then, that there'll still be NXEA (or whatever it will be when Crossrail is complete) running, as they do now, local services to Shenfield / beyond, just obviously in fewer numbers? As Cetacean said, they will only need the extras in the peaks. Without harping on too much, this in itself shows that capacity on each section isn't being properly addressed.
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