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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 13:27:11 GMT
This must have been one of the last uses of the 1950s/60s "Mk3" two-flighted arrow because the Victoria Line itself was signed with the current (boring) modern "Mk4" version.
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Post by ruislip on Aug 19, 2008 14:10:27 GMT
This must have been one of the last uses of the 1950s/60s "Mk3" two-flighted arrow because the Victoria Line itself was signed with the current (boring) modern "Mk4" version. Are these the so-called "Mexican arrows?" |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 15:44:16 GMT
The LT direction arrow timeline is pretty easy to determine.
Mk1 - Four flights or feathers, black; no roundel (1920s/30s)
Mk2 - Three flights or feathers, black; and lined red roundel (1930s/40s)
Mk3 - Two flights or feathers, blue; and un-lined red roundel (1950s/60s)
Mk4a - No flight or roundel, black (1960s/70s)
Mk4b - No flight or roundel, blue (1980s-to date, current TFL standard)
Of course the "Mk" is my own description. Examples of all still remain but the first 3 are increasingly rare, alas.
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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 15:55:13 GMT
There was also the signalling arrow, used on shunt signal ID plates and train describers (e.g. Earl's Court)
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2008 18:35:08 GMT
This must have been one of the last uses of the 1950s/60s "Mk3" two-flighted arrow because the Victoria Line itself was signed with the current (boring) modern "Mk4" version. Lower case lettering for non-interchange station names on paper maps started in 1960, so presumably these enamel signs are post-1960. Note also that "British Railways" on the original sign has been shortened to "British Rail" on the later plate on the left hand sign. |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 18:47:57 GMT
But they went back to full upper case for the Victoria Line line diagrams before returning to lower case (yuk) for almost everything c1990.
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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 18:50:57 GMT
But they went back to full upper case for the Victoria Line line diagrams before returning to lower case (yuk) for almost everything in the late-80s. The history of LT/LU line diagrams would be worth a study of its own. Not only the design principles used but even how the colours have been altered (e.g. some very odd shades of the H&C hue c1989). |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 19, 2008 20:44:56 GMT
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Post by ruislip on Aug 20, 2008 3:03:09 GMT
And a fine surviving example of the H&C still labelled as "Metropolitan". |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 22, 2008 14:04:56 GMT
In the past, where there was a signal box, platforms were numbered in relation to it with the nearest platform being numbered 1. Woodford follows this convention as the bay road is plat 1. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2008 9:00:33 GMT
According to the CULG layout diagrams (and I do not know how reliable this information is) all stations on the Northern Line have platform 1 for northbound and platform 2 as southbound, except: Golders Green: 1 and 2 North, 3 and 4 bidirectional, 5 South Platforms 3 and 4 sandwich a bi-directional line, but are normally used 3 north and 4 south. Platform 1 is generally reserved for staff use only. It was, however, used during the works which closed platforms 2 and 3 recently. I don't think I have ever been on platform 1. |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 26, 2008 9:54:55 GMT
According to the CULG layout diagrams (and I do not know how reliable this information is) all stations on the Northern Line have platform 1 for northbound and platform 2 as southbound, except: Golders Green: 1 and 2 North, 3 and 4 bidirectional, 5 South Platforms 3 and 4 sandwich a bi-directional line, but are normally used 3 north and 4 south. Platform 1 is generally reserved for staff use only. It was, however, used during the works which closed platforms 2 and 3 recently. I don't think I have ever been on platform 1. And presumably Morden is different too? |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 26, 2008 10:37:37 GMT
The District Line tends to follow the convention of plat 1(WB) and plat 2(EB), except of course where there are other lines involved (e.g. Mile End, Barking, Upminster). One exception is Earl's Court where plat 1(&2) is EB.
The LU intranet "Junction Diagrams" (not the Traffic Controller diagrams which are a different thing) show that at one point the Wimbledon branch (both BR & LT) was numbered plat 1(EB) and plat 2(WB).
I wondered if this reflected main line practice with plat 1 being the 'UP' road towards London? All these stations were re-signed after LU took over in 1994 and I think the numbering direction may have been reversed to follow the rest of the line's convention (confirmation please). Unfortunately these "Junction Diagrams" are not dated. They also show Plaistow numbered as plat 3(WB), 2(EB) & 1(Bay) which I'm not sure is still correct, plus lists the Barking EB plat (north side) as "un-numbered".
Incidentally one of the signs at Parsons Green referred to "Southbound" trains to Wimbledon and has now been carefully amended using a plastic sticker.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Aug 26, 2008 10:52:15 GMT
Incidentally one of the signs at Parsons Green referred to "Southbound" trains to Wimbledon and has now been carefully amended using a plastic sticker. The same is true at West Brompton, this is the quiz picture from 16 May 2007 -  (click for a larger version) |
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Post by 21146 on Aug 26, 2008 11:00:28 GMT
That confirms both the reversal of numbers and that the "SB" was not confined to one location. Time for a closer look at the rest maybe.
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Post by 21146 on Aug 27, 2008 13:07:08 GMT
They then had to alter the Fleet Line name to Jubilee Line at Charing Cross in 1979, then delete it again and transfer the interchange to Waterloo in 1999 (though it had not been done when this photo was taken). [...] With Tube Lines' recent refurbishment of Hendon Central this sign may be history by now... I took this photo on the 2nd of April 2007. I've not visited the station since so I can't say whether the sign still exists for certain, but it seems that these signs are not replaced unless there is a very good reason to. The ones at Holland Park which predate the opening of the Jubilee Line, for example, have survived refurbishment (I'll upload the photo later). Checking yesterday it seems almost all those mid-1970s line diagrams have gone from the Golders - Edgware section of the Northern except for at Edgware itself. The latter is really too dark for photos in most areas at the moment due to refurbishment work and when they take the scaffolding away I fear these signs will follow it. Whether there was a "good reason" to replace them all is a moot point as I don't they included "Overground" so are already out-of-date, just as their predecessors were. The difference being the old ones were updated with riveted plates whereas now they use stickers, which last about a week. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2009 17:52:46 GMT
Since being refurbished, Ruislip Gardens has new signage, and now conforms with the 'usual' practice. The westbound platform to West Ruislip is now No.1 and eastbound No.2. Noted 5/2/09.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Feb 5, 2009 19:21:55 GMT
Interesting that change. I'm sure Ive read a passage in a past appendix to the rule book which describes one of the district stations between turnham green and hammersmith as just being 'west' and 'east' instead of numbers; which is odd because only one has just 2 platforms to choose from, and I'm fairly sure it wasnt that one.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Feb 5, 2009 19:22:41 GMT
Also, 21146, what are the privacy settings on your flikr account? Keeps asking me to sign up or log in  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2009 15:18:33 GMT
Is Mill Hill East classified as a NB or SB platform? Assuming it has number 1, and all departs are sb, that should be wrong..
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Post by Chris M on Feb 17, 2009 15:47:02 GMT
If the second platform had been built the current platform would be the southbound one.
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Post by metman on Feb 17, 2009 17:57:06 GMT
As there is no Northbound option at MHE, it should be [Platform 1 Southbound] As Chris says, if the line had been modified, it would have been the southbound platform.
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