Last party on the Circle Line

Bearing in mind we can all get on a train already totally smashed, determined to punch a train operator in the face without having to take a can or bottle with us, this has to be one of the most pointless pieces of legislation enacted. At least if the perpetrators have the cans and/or bottles with them it's fairly obvious to LUL staff and other passengers that inebriation may have taken place and they can steer clear or keep an eye on them wherever possible.

"Drunk and disorderly" covered all that surely?

The main problem as I see it is littering with empties when they can't be bothered to take them away to dispose of. Littering is still an offence isn't it although there'll still be soft drink containers, papers, partly eaten burgers and dirty nappies (oh yes). Without doubling the staff available and BTP as well I can't see how you can possibly control this.

It's a bit like the phone-in-the-car thing. Why bother singling it out when it was already covered by driving without due care and attention. I notice they didn't make "applying lipstick via the rear view mirror" a separate offence.....

Anyway, I'd just like to put on record my complete support for all of you on LUL having to cope with this rising tide of complete tossers who have little or no regard for public or other peoples property, feelings or well being. A difficult job under difficult circumstances.

Richard

What an embarrasment to the teaching profession. Yes, I was there, but only in the capacity of being curious, and the hardest stuff I drank was Lucozade!

All this rubbish about "it's a free country!" In my opinion, it's too free in some ways, and the product of this are the moronic twats who turned out on Saturday night! I'd like to round up all the rubbish they left on Saturday night, and sprinkle it acorss their front gardens.

My first journey by booze-free bus was on a 97 yesterday. And as I sat down my foot crunched on a squashed Special Brew can. And this was the seat nearest the driver on the lower deck. So he was obviously well-interested.

But most litter on public transport is caused by the free papers, but until LU gets out of the lucrative "Metro" contract I can't see this being flagged up as a problem anytime soon. The inside of many cars look like a waste paper dump after the AM peak now.

To be honest I thought this party looked quite good! **prepares to be shot down by arrows fired from all angles!!** Out of the 'thousands' that turned up only 17 arrests were made, and if we look at what happens when crowds get together at football matches (especially rangers fans) we get mobs, violence and much worse damage to property. I daresay the atmosphere was much friendlier than a normal night on the tube and very few other events will bring so many Londoner's together. Yes there was mess and it will take some clearing up, but it's a light hearted night in an uptight world and i'd have loved to have been a part of it.

I think a lot of normal people that I saw felt threatened and intimidated by what went on. At Baker Steet, there was certainly an uneasy atmosphere, which was far from friendly.

No Chris - what I saw was downright dangerous. I mentioned the person on the roof of the C stock in my earlier post, but there were people standing on the couplers between the interconnecting doors while the train was moving. Someone could easily have died. And it may have been a minority of people that caused trouble, but the simple fact is that if some irresponsible idiots hadn't posted the party on the web, that minority would not have been there in the first place.

Lu should have acted and suspended the service - any fool could see what was coming. Would the revellers have then jumped on the Central for a trip to Epping or Hainault - I don't think so.

Some silly cow wrote in one of the give away papers "I was there, it was friendly and good natured" by her reckoning WW2 was a minor tiff.

Last train to Epping, then a lock in - in Loughton sidings for the night!

Incidentally, how does LU want a passenger witnesses someone swigging from a can of special brew on a tube to react when no staff are available in the same car...

• ask the drinker to stop and run away when told of go forth & multiply/threatened
  
• ask the drinker to stop and press the emergency alert button when told to go forth & multiply/threatened
  
• do nothing in the first place

Sorry, but has to be asked just to confirm that Joris Bohnson has carefully thought this through with LU before implementing the first thing that came into his head... how much trouble is caused by those drinking alcohol on LU as opposed to those already pi$$ed

I'm not saying that there isn't logic to the alcohol ban, but how does he expect this to be policed other than asking others to do it for him... with him taking the credit if successful or blaming others if not!

People have a choice - pull the alarm and delay the whole train or turn a blind eye and get to where they're going. In the past i've unknowingly run trains with the windows put in but never knew til the terminus because people know that telling you means it goes out of service.

If I get pulled down for someone drinking then i'll take action. However it's more than likely that the rest of the time i'll be concentrating so hard on the road ahead and my PTI that I won't notice people getting on with beers......

GOOD NEWS:

www.thelondonpaper.com/cs/Satellite/london/news/article/1157152229193?packedargs=suffix%3DArticleController

Plans are afoot for a repeat performance THIS Saturday.

Great given that there are 80,000 Foo Fighters at Wembley as well.

A station colleague has already asked - and was denied - extra staff for the night.

I'm back at work on Friday and will be speaking to the H&S rep regarding refusal to work

Considering some people would rather sit on a train that's on fire than risk delaying their journey, I think the number of PEAs for this will be very low!

In answer to Chris W, I would say that you should always use the PEA if someone threatens you in any way.

Random thoughts:

Perhaps Facebook should be taken to court for allowing illegal acts to be planned on their website. Ebay is being prosecuted for allowing fake goods to be sold on theirs.

In any case, it is a sad reflection on society that an attempt to reduce anti-social behaviour by a minority is ridiculed by a larger number of people acting illegally.

Perhaps there should be a website which organises law-abiding people to demonstrate against drinking or being drunk on public transport.

We are riddled with un-enforceable laws - not interfering with train doors is my favourite, being intoxicated on a train is another. They are really only there to make sure the company doesn't get sued if someone hurts themselves falling over when drunk etc.

But this has all been done before, but without all the drama/injuries etc. The Space Hijackers have done a few which have mostly gone without comment/delays/police action and so on, mainly because they took responsibility for their actions and made people feel welcomed to the group (they even have rules).

The only other issue I would like to raise is that open alcohol containers/drinking on public transport is still not illegal. It hasn't been added to the conditions of carriage or railway bylaws yet so any move to evict people from trains busses etc. falls into the realm of TfL policy rather than law. Staff can ask people to stop but there's no legal reason for them to comply, it's then if the person fails to leave at a member of staff's request they've broken the law due to trespass, which is a civil not a criminal matter, so BTP can be called to assist but whoever still can't be taken down the cells.

Essentially Boris' made a f'ing hash of it and made all your lives much more difficult until next year when it's a proper law for proper people. Not that drinking on the train is the issue anyway, surely the issue is morons getting wrecked down at weatherspoons (or another cheap nasty venue) then getting on the train?

EDIT: I am possibly wrong but I can't figure the terminology, does it mean you can't be drinking if you're already drunk, and does that make sense?
www.tfl.gov.uk/termsandconditions/5004.aspx

4. Intoxication and possession of intoxicating liquor
No person in a state of intoxication shall enter or remain on the railway.
Where reasonable notice is, or has been given prohibiting intoxicating liquor on any train service, no person shall have any intoxicating liquor with him on it, or attempt to enter such train with intoxicating liquor with him.
Where an authorised person reasonably believes that any person is in a state of intoxication or has with him intoxicating liquor contrary to this Byelaw, the authorised person may:
(i) require him to leave the railway; and
(ii) prevent him entering or remaining on the railway until the authorised person is satisfied that he has no intoxicating liquor with him.

As I understand it, only if the drinks containers are open.....

**EDIT**

The terms of carriage state:

• on our buses, in our bus stations, on Underground trains and in Underground stations, you must
not consume alcohol or be in possession of an open container of alcohol.