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Post by q8 on May 4, 2005 7:03:12 GMT
 Anyone know the SHORTEST platforms on the tube headwall to headwall? Both SSL and tube. I have had a scout round but can't find any info. My own guess is Gloucester Road SSL and somewhere on the Northern line tube. 
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Post by trainopd78 on May 4, 2005 12:30:55 GMT
Anyone know the SHORTEST platforms on the tube headwall to headwall? Both SSL and tube. I have had a scout round but can't find any info. My own guess is Gloucester Road SSL and somewhere on the Northern line tube. I would say Bayswater on SSL as they can only just acommodate a C stock. Waterloo and City platforms have to be contenders on tube lines. Proper tube i.e. LER, Charing Cross n/b was always short. |
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2005 17:27:10 GMT
Surely on SSL the shortest would be on the East London line, e.g. Wapping or Rotherhithe.
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Post by setttt on May 4, 2005 19:24:39 GMT
It's a long-shot, but what about P5 at Acton Town?
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Post by q8 on May 5, 2005 7:57:01 GMT
 In my post I should have been more specific. I meant platforms on the SSL that are in regular use and discounting short lines like ELL and Olympia. I.E District, H&C and Met. If the suggestion that Baywater is the shortest (which I beleive correct) and Mr Citysigs proposal that all the new SSL stock be of 6 car length then a lot of the expense of lengthening platforms in the past was wasted.. This only strengthens my view that all routes that operate "C" stock should be made into a separate line with the following services. Wimbledon/Aldgate (via KX) Hammersmith/Aldgate Circle (reduced frequency =15 mins) Then extend the Uxbridge service to Barking The Watford service to Plaistow and the Amersham service to Whitechapel.
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Post by citysig on May 5, 2005 8:09:29 GMT
I.E District, H&C and Met. If the suggestion that Baywater is the shortest (which I beleive correct) and Mr Citysigs proposal that all the new SSL stock be of 6 car length then a lot of the expense of lengthening platforms in the past was wasted.. Regardless of Bayswater, many other platforms on SSL only just fit C-stock - even though originally they may have been long enough for 8 cars of A-stock. Great Portland Street, Euston Square and Barbican are just a few of the platforms that are long enough for 7 cars. Edgware Road was a tight fit for 8 cars, but since resignalling, 6 is the maximum. Baker Street platforms 5 & 6 are only just big enough for 6 cars. King's Cross, Farringdon, Moorgate and Liverpool Street are the only "top side of circle" platforms that would be "wasted" by only using 6-car trains. Hardly a case for ordering 8 car trains. |
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2005 13:43:02 GMT
Then extend the Uxbridge service to Barking The Watford service to Plaistow and the Amersham service to Whitechapel. Would sir also ensure that an adequate supply of bismuth, antacid and aspirin would be made available for sir's colleagues, the signallers and WTT planners, to ensure that sir's journey 'on the front' would remain trouble-free?   |
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Post by chris on May 5, 2005 15:06:02 GMT
I figure the shortest platforms must be on the East London Line
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Post by q8 on May 5, 2005 15:27:39 GMT
Great Portland Street, Euston Square and Barbican are just a few of the platforms that are long enough for 7 cars. Edgware Road was a tight fit for 8 cars, but since resignalling, 6 is the maximum. Baker Street platforms 5 & 6 are only just big enough for 6 cars. King's Cross, Farringdon, Moorgate and Liverpool Street are the only "top side of circle" platforms that would be "wasted" by only using 6-car trains. Hardly a case for ordering 8 car trains. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Bleedin' worlds goin' mad mate. Manage a railway I don't think they could manage a fart! |
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Post by q8 on May 5, 2005 15:28:55 GMT
Would sir also ensure that an adequate supply of bismuth, antacid and aspirin would be made available for sir's colleagues, the signallers and WTT planners, to ensure that sir's journey 'on the front' would remain trouble-free? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Would Sir like to elucidate?  |
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2005 17:51:54 GMT
Would Sir like to elucidate? The Aldgate triangle is the busiest triangular flat junction in the world. citysig has already stated that its operation is so fragile that without constant supervision, the whole area would be one permanent b**ls-up - running more services through it would be very difficult. Uxbridge-Barking via the Jack Wood line was tried before the war; the constant delays and disruptions due to the high number of services along the north Circle meant that it didn't last long and was eventually withdrawn. |
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Post by chris on May 5, 2005 20:05:13 GMT
What would a train do if it's too long for the platform? When it happens on the mainline, the gaurd simply only allows carriages in the station to open their doors, and passangers in rear carriages move up the train. On the underground, all doors get opened by the driver and passengers can't got between cars. And another thing, why are there door open buttons near the doors when the driver does the hard work?
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Post by setttt on May 5, 2005 20:14:37 GMT
What would a train do if it's too long for the platform? The end doors of the rear car can be 'cut out' so that they don't open. A stocks do it on the north part of the circle somewhere and I believe there are a lot of places on the northern line as well |
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Post by chris on May 5, 2005 20:20:31 GMT
The end doors of the rear car can be 'cut out' so that they don't open. A stocks do it on the north part of the circle somewhere and I believe there are a lot of places on the northern line as well And if your stuck in one of the rear cars? |
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Post by setttt on May 5, 2005 20:26:26 GMT
I believe this only happens on the met as mentioned, and when it does, the driver makes an announcement at the previous stop telling customers to move to the next car if needs be(on the northern I think it's just the rear-most set of doors in most places).
If anyone knows better by all means correct me on this...
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 5, 2005 20:27:54 GMT
The front two doors or the two rear doors can be cut out. This means two out of the four doors on a D stock car, and one set of double doors out of four sets on all other stock cars.
Therefore customers would not be 'trapped', as there are still at least two doorways available on the car in question.
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Post by citysig on May 5, 2005 20:28:56 GMT
It's just the last set of doors on the rear car that can be cut out. There are numerous places around the combine which require this. The north side of the Circle has Great Portland Street, Euston Square and Barbican. A-stocks cut out the last set of doors at these stations, even though at a couple of them there is a platform on which to alight onto - albeit only a few inches wide.
When travelling in the last car you will need to use the other doors to alight onto a nice firm platform.
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2005 23:16:07 GMT
On a C stock three pairs of doors are cut out, so only one pair opens. Very useful on the first car if you slightly over-run. |
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Post by q8 on May 6, 2005 2:13:10 GMT
 Bleedin potty ain't it. They make nice new trains for various lines and then they are too long to fit the SHORTEST platforms. Where's me headache pills?
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Post by q8 on May 6, 2005 2:16:10 GMT
Uxbridge-Barking via the Jack Wood line was tried before the war; the constant delays and disruptions due to the high number of services along the north Circle meant that it didn't last long and was eventually withdrawn.
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Correction young man the UXB - BKG service was only taken off because of the war.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2005 6:48:37 GMT
Correction young man the UXB - BKG service was only taken off because of the war. Really? I always thought it was taken off for other reasons. |
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Post by Admin Team on May 6, 2005 7:36:02 GMT
Bleedin potty ain't it. They make nice new trains for various lines and then they are too long to fit the SHORTEST platforms. Where's me headache pills? I *think* there's a misinterpretation here. The intention is that there will be one generic design for the SSL's, but that the trains will be formed differently according to their intended routes. Circle/H&C will have six cars, District will have seven, Met will have eight. |
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Post by q8 on May 6, 2005 8:05:56 GMT
Really? I always thought it was taken off for other reasons.
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Not according to an old publication that I have . I'll try to find it/scan it/post it.
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Post by q8 on May 6, 2005 8:07:16 GMT
Circle/H&C will have six cars, District will have seven, Met will have eight. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Oh I see. With or without middle cabs? |
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Post by Harsig on May 6, 2005 9:18:29 GMT
Really? I always thought it was taken off for other reasons. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Not according to an old publication that I have . I'll try to find it/scan it/post it. According to my information the Uxbridge Barking service was introduced from 17th July 1939 and lasted until 1941. The document I've taken this from cites unreliabilty of the service as the reason it was withdrawn . In fact it also implies that the only reason that it managed to last for two years was that for significant periods the through service was unable to operate due to bomb damage to the line in the city. This prevented the operational impracticalities of the service from becoming apparent as soon as they might otherwise have done. A former colleague who, while not being sufficiently senior to remember the service himself, but who, early in his career, worked with those who did, told me that they always said that when the trains went east you'd never know when they'd come back, which of course is not totally disimilar to the situation that still afflicts the Hammersmith-Barking service that replaced the Uxbridge-Barking service on the east end of the district in 1941. |
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Post by Admin Team on May 6, 2005 13:47:13 GMT
Circle/H&C will have six cars, District will have seven, Met will have eight. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Oh I see. With or without middle cabs? This is unclear, from what I've seen at least. Obviously the additional cars will be trailers, but as for the 'middle' of the trains - whether there will be such things, whether they'll be 'UNDM's as we think of them or full cabs I don't know. Of course, as soon as there is something on the topic I'll be interested to see it |
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2005 14:13:40 GMT
Bank on the W&C line has the shortest tube platforms a 4 car 92 stock just fits in.
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Post by setttt on May 6, 2005 14:58:43 GMT
Obviously the additional cars will be trailers, but as for the 'middle' of the trains - whether there will be such things, whether they'll be 'UNDM's as we think of them or full cabs I don't know. Surely UNDMs would be useless when shunting? Baring in mind that units will be articulated (and as a result, semi-permanently coupled together?) a shunting cabinet presumably isn't an option. If they make each unit into a three or four car set (with proper DMs at both ends), all the flexibility needed is handed to you on a plate  |
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Post by DWS on May 6, 2005 18:13:25 GMT
Surely UNDMs would be useless when shunting? Baring in mind that units will be articulated (and as a result, semi-permanently coupled together?) a shunting cabinet presumably isn't an option. If they make each unit into a three or four car set (with proper DMs at both ends), all the flexibility needed is handed to you on a plate There has been no mention of articulated units by Metronet. As units are only shunted in Depots, the shunting cabinet in an UNDM it all thats needed. |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on May 6, 2005 18:13:50 GMT
On a C stock three pairs of doors are cut out, so only one pair opens. Very useful on the first car if you slightly over-run. You are quite correct adw, thanks for the correction! |
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