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Post by harry1967 on Apr 10, 2008 9:10:47 GMT
Hi, can any one recall when OPO's were first commissioned on the underground? I know it's going back a few years but was hoping someone might have been involved with the project or was an operational member of staff when OPO's first came in. Regards Harry.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2008 16:29:31 GMT
Can't remember the year, but remember the Hammersmith and City line was the first to go, apart from Victoria line of course,
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Post by astock5000 on Apr 10, 2008 17:09:43 GMT
The sub-surface lines went OPO in the mid 1980s, then the tube lines were converted a few years later, except the Central and Northern that became OPO when they got their new trains.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2008 17:21:51 GMT
The H&C went OPO in 1984 (march, iirc), with the guards in the cabs for the frst month. Circle shortly later, the District in 1986. Then in the following order, Met, Picc, Jubilee, Bakerloo. Central and finally the Northen in 1999.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Apr 10, 2008 19:10:08 GMT
The 1940 stock on W&C was presumably crew operated?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2008 22:01:01 GMT
The 1940 stock on W&C was presumably crew operated? Yes
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Post by tubeprune on Apr 11, 2008 6:20:40 GMT
H & C went OPO 26 March 1984. For the full story, read "The Underground Electric Train No. 20", Underground News, February 2007.
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Post by Tubeboy on Apr 11, 2008 8:53:11 GMT
The Piccadilly was the first tube line to go OPO in 1987.
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Post by railtechnician on Apr 11, 2008 13:50:22 GMT
Hi, can any one recall when OPO's were first commissioned on the underground? I know it's going back a few years but was hoping someone might have been involved with the project or was an operational member of staff when OPO's first came in. Regards Harry. It rather depends what you are talking about! If you mean OPO from an operational standpoint then I bow to the knowledge of operating staff , however, if you are asking about equipment installation that is another matter entirely and of course OPO as installed on the H&C was the second attempt, the original attempt being OMO in the 1970s which was installed on the sub surface lines and tested from an installation standpoint but never brought into service or tested operationally AFAIK. Certainly the Victoria line was the first line with operational OPO from its opening and the OPO equipment for sub surface lines was installed from about 1982/3 AFAIR.
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Post by Tomcakes on Apr 11, 2008 17:33:23 GMT
Did the Victoria have CCTV and platform monitors from the outset, then? Or was it mirrors at that time?
Whilst I'm at it, AIUI the procedure when CSDE has failed is that the driver must open the cab door, put one foot on the platform, before opening the doors. How does this work on 67/72 stock?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2008 23:18:35 GMT
the OPO equipment for sub surface lines was installed from about 1982/3 AFAIR. Istr that there was OPO monitors in the 1970s at Victoria. Two black & White monitors used to switch on when a train entered the WB platform.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2008 23:23:20 GMT
Did the Victoria have CCTV and platform monitors from the outset, then? Or was it mirrors at that time? Whilst I'm at it, AIUI the procedure when CSDE has failed is that the driver must open the cab door, put one foot on the platform, before opening the doors. How does this work on 67/72 stock? All Victoria line platforms had on tiny B&W monitor on the platform wall oposite the cab. The picture was rubbish, but the platforms were straight and the ATO's always opened their cab windows. The Vic line does not have CSDE.
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Post by angelislington on Apr 15, 2008 22:14:08 GMT
<raises hand tentatively> Please, sir, woss OPO? and CSDE? <puts hand down, shuffles embarrassedly in seat>
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Rich32
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Post by Rich32 on Apr 15, 2008 22:18:18 GMT
<raises hand tentatively> Please, sir, woss OPO? and CSDE? <puts hand down, shuffles embarrassedly in seat> OPO - One Person Operation CSDE - Correct Side Door Enable
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Post by angelislington on Apr 15, 2008 22:44:40 GMT
aaaah <clunk as penny drops> Why thank 'ee kind sir!
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Post by Tomcakes on Apr 15, 2008 22:55:06 GMT
Ah right. Does anyone know what the procedure is on the Bakerloo for when CSDE has failed? As I say, it would be quite difficult to get out the cab, stand on the platform, *then* open the doors...
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Apr 15, 2008 22:58:14 GMT
the OPO equipment for sub surface lines was installed from about 1982/3 AFAIR. Istr that there was OPO monitors in the 1970s at Victoria. Two black & White monitors used to switch on when a train entered the WB platform. I've also seen photos of OMO monitors at Farringdon. Also, a lot of Sub Suface IMR bookwirings have 'TV Switching' circuits in them still.
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Post by railtechnician on Apr 20, 2008 8:48:19 GMT
The Victoria Line was built with OPO from the outset. I was of course still at school when the Victoria line opened and LT was my second job after leaving school so it was 10 years before I saw what was involved in the original system. the first site I worked at was Warren Street in 1977 where as part of the signal department I was a wireman installing PA loudspeakers on the Northern Line platforms but it gave me the opportunity to get to grips with the operations room sited above the concourse at the bottom of the escalators, you can't miss the mirrored windows!
Basically the Vic Line system used a Redifusion 8x5 CCTV switching matrix, i.e. a maximum of eight cameras could be connected to a maximum of 5 monitors. Generally speaking two cameras were fitted to each platform i.e. one at each headwall and tailwall and a maximum of a further four would be fitted to cover the ticket hall and lower concourse. A monitor was provided per platform for the driver, where reversing moves were possible I believe an additional monitor was parallelled at the back end of the platform. The 'station agent' i.e. station supervisor had two monitors in the ops room and usually this was duplicated in the passimeter with a switching arrangement allowing control from either point. OMO was also before my time but I saw the yellow signal heads with diamond backboards and yellow platform mounted emergency plungers before we went round removing them all. However, one legacy of the OMO programme was indeed the installation of OMO monitors worked off track circuits and these were certainly in situ and working on sub surface lines in some places in the 1970s. A case in point was indeed Whitechapel where I was based in 1977, there were two OPO monitors on the west end of the eastbound which showed trains in the platform whenever the track was dropped whether there was a train occupying the track or not. This of course was due to 'burn in' which was a real problem for those early monitors which worked on 240v ac and only ever saw a picture of the same image most of the time so that image became remanent.
The original OMO installations were followed by OPO installations all of which were installed and maintained by LU staff at that time as I recall. Thinking about it I was involved with the original stage 1 Line Controller's CCTV installations at Baker St, Waterloo, Piccadilly Circus, Tottenham Court Road, Oxford Circus and one other site. I was installing Baker Street throughout 1980 and as part of the job I installed three OPO cameras to replace the earlier OMO installation such that the station supervisor would also be able to view the OPO images which until then appeared only on dedicated platform monitors.
In 1982 I went into the training division for four years and when I returned 'to the tools' OPO was in on the subsurface lines and circa 1987 was outsourced for installation and maintenance so I had little to do with it although I caught the tail end of some of the ongoing work at Waterloo Northern line where OPO monitors had to be installed at both ends of the platform as OPO was imminent but guards were still on the trains.
In real terms OPO must by now be fifth generation equipment at least at most sites and fully integrated to the Station and Line Control/BTP long line CCTV system.
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