Tom
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Signalfel?
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Post by Tom on Nov 8, 2005 17:48:18 GMT
Thanks very much, Met App - you wouldn't happen to know if the VLU will retain them when the new signalling is put in place, do you? As the new signalling system on the Victoria Line will be near enough the same as that on the central I wouldn't be quite so sure of that, there are some big differences between the two. And as these 'headwall indicators' are actually the starter in a lot of places, I expect they might be around for a while.
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Post by Tomcakes on Nov 8, 2005 18:16:17 GMT
CSA PDs (the new name for SATS) But the name SATS itself is only a few years old! How many could they have employed by not wasting the money on a name change?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 16:31:17 GMT
I wouldn't be quite so sure of that, there are some big differences between the two. Hence the reason i put that 'will be near enough the same' And as these 'headwall indicators' are actually the starter in a lot of places, I expect they might be around for a while. I would have thought that new signals would be installed and therefore relocated to the more normal position; insidethe tunnel mouth.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Nov 9, 2005 16:55:51 GMT
I wouldn't be quite so sure of that, there are some big differences between the two. Hence the reason i put that 'will be near enough the same' But they aren't even going to be near enough the same. There will be no white aspects for a start, and blue will be making it's first appearance as a signal aspect colour on LU. This mans a major change in the signalling principles, coupled with the new ATP system, a different method of ATO etc... And as these 'headwall indicators' are actually the starter in a lot of places, I expect they might be around for a while. I would have thought that new signals would be installed and therefore relocated to the more normal position; insidethe tunnel mouth. I'm not so sure. They may need to be as 2009 stock is around 3m longer than 1967 stock.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 17:48:32 GMT
Blue?
WTF is a blue aspect going to show?
Blue is for tripcock testers!
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Post by subwayrail on Nov 9, 2005 18:55:48 GMT
Blue? WTF is a blue aspect going to show? Blue is for tripcock testers! Basically the same as the present lunar white aspect, but with an important difference. As with lunar white it tells the driver that, after the signal he/she is looking at, there are no more colour light signals protecting the train ahead. However, unlike a lunar white, the driver will be able to pass it in protected manual (which replaces coded manual) as target speeds will be displayed and changes notified in advance.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 19:12:28 GMT
Basically the same as the present lunar white aspect, but with an important difference. As with lunar white it tells the driver that, after the signal he/she is looking at, there are no more colour light signals protecting the train ahead. Right, I understand this, but... However, unlike a lunar white, the driver will be able to pass it in protected manual (which replaces coded manual) as target speeds will be displayed and changes notified in advance. ... this is the part I don't understand. On the Central Line, white aspects can be passed in Coded Manual, but not Restricted Manual, because the ATP system is able to relay the target speed of the next block section, which the current ATP signalling on the Vic Line can't do, by design. Are you saying that Coded Manual on the VLU signalling is simply called "Protected Manual" now, with Restricted Manual retaining its existing name?
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Nov 9, 2005 19:25:52 GMT
However, unlike a lunar white, the driver will be able to pass it in protected manual (which replaces coded manual) as target speeds will be displayed and changes notified in advance. ... this is the part I don't understand. On the Central Line, white aspects can be passed in Coded Manual, but not Restricted Manual, because the ATP system is able to relay the target speed of the next block section, which the current ATP signalling on the Vic Line can't do, by design. Are you saying that Coded Manual on the VLU signalling is simply called "Protected Manual" now, with Restricted Manual retaining its existing name? What I *think* is happening is that blue on the Vic Line post-upgrade is the same as white on the central now. The idea being that a white can't have two different meanings depending on the site which it is displayed at.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 19:38:27 GMT
Ah, I see - so blue is temporary then?
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Nov 9, 2005 20:08:16 GMT
I don't think so...
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 20:36:41 GMT
So blue will be used in place of white forever on the VLU signalling?
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Post by subwayrail on Nov 9, 2005 22:36:53 GMT
So blue will be used in place of white forever on the VLU signalling? Correct. In fact, the way I heard it, lunar whites will also be replaced by blue signals on the Central Line at some point in the future, though not necessarily to coincide with the VLU.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2005 22:43:09 GMT
Why? Have TPTB decided that lunar white is for junction indicators only?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2005 23:01:28 GMT
I would describe the Brixton horn as more of a klaxon, and as mentioned earlier in this thread it is an audible alarm pressed by the arriving driver to tell the departing driver that the rear cab is clear. Although it's usually sounded within 30secs of arrival, I've never seen the starter go green within about 95secs of the train arriving anyway.
Shoreditch's rear cab clear alarm is a bell instead of a klaxon. I can't recall hearing anything audible at Bank and Elephant&Castle for when the rear cab is clear. In fact does Bank even have a rear cab clear indicator?
On the subject of the headwall indicators, I love their curvy retro 1960s design, and hope that they stay in use. There is at least one to be found on the 70s part of the Jubilee, but it didn't have the lights installed, maybe as ATO wasn't used?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2005 23:24:36 GMT
There should be six on the Jubilee - one for each platform headwall on the stage I route. It was intended to use ATO in the tunnel sections; BAET says that all of the circuitry was designed to handle Vic-style ATO and ATP.
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