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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 22:38:50 GMT
Unlikely it was 117, that's not due at Holland Park eastbound until about 09:42 - scary thought though!
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 22:39:33 GMT
That wouldn't explain why the Leytonstone to Epping via Snaresbrook is operating.
Would it be possible that the train started the day at Ruislip, went to Leytonstone, back to Ealing Broadway/West Ruislip and then an eastbound journey that didn't get any further than ~4 carriage lengths beyond Holland Park?
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Post by jamesb on Sept 12, 2007 22:39:46 GMT
The straw that broke the camels back... Indeed, but on the other hand, think of all the experience and problem solving skills you have acquired. You'd be scouted to drive trains all over the world with the experience you get from the '92 stock! |
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 22:41:54 GMT
I imagine that the 92 stock maintenance staff would now be fully qualified to work on Blue Peter with the amount of sticky tape they've had to employ!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 22:42:12 GMT
Won't know for sure until I find out what train it was...
Well 3m Scotchlite got a massive sponsorship deal... and a free mobile advert canvas to boot!
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 22:44:38 GMT
That wouldn't explain why the Leytonstone to Epping via Snaresbrook is operating. Would it be possible that the train started the day at Ruislip, went to Leytonstone, back to Ealing Broadway/West Ruislip and then an eastbound journey that didn't get any further than ~4 carriage lengths beyond Holland Park? There are no booked reversers at Leytonstone except for a few in mid evening, but I suppose it's possible that the train was running late and got short tripped there. However, that theory still doesn't explain why Hainault - Woodford is suspended. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 22:50:07 GMT
I wonder why such a large area of suspension was needed - was it not possible to simply suspend between North Acton and Holborn, make the faulty train safe for restricted manual, then reverse it at Queensway and put it away at White City? The suspension area has only been extended to "West of Leytonstone" this evening / very late afternoon. Whilst i was watching the service on trackernet reasonably late this afternoon it was only suspended between Holborn and White City. |
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Post by jamesb on Sept 12, 2007 22:50:37 GMT
I am just wondering if the problem is a computer software type of issue, connected to the ATO system and the way the train picks up codes etc. or a more 'hardware' type of problem. I suppose all those details they are still investigating.
Whatever it was, it can't have been * that * bad because trains continued to run, and are running now according to the TfL website. Unless they are all been driven in restricted manual or with speed limits, but this wouldn't get anyone anywhere very quickly!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 22:53:25 GMT
All will be revealed in the coming hours/days....
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 22:55:33 GMT
The TfL realtime map does say that there are severe delays on the parts of the line that are running, but that could just be because of the emergency timetable.
Hainault-Woodford may be suspended just to simplify operations of course.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 22:55:38 GMT
There are no booked reversers at Leytonstone except for a few in mid evening, but I suppose it's possible that the train was running late and got short tripped there. However, that theory still doesn't explain why Hainault - Woodford is suspended. Limited stock and / or (willing) crew availability seems the most likely expalanation |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 22:56:49 GMT
could be Stock Displacement...
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 22:57:21 GMT
I am just wondering if the problem is a computer software type of issue, connected to the ATO system and the way the train picks up codes etc. or a more 'hardware' type of problem. I suppose all those details they are still investigating. Whatever it was, it can't have been * that * bad because trains continued to run, and are running now according to the TfL website. Unless they are all been driven in restricted manual or with speed limits, but this wouldn't get anyone anywhere very quickly! Thry don't close 75% of London's busiest tube line for something that's "not that bad"! |
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Post by jamesb on Sept 12, 2007 22:58:19 GMT
 I know  I wasn't trying to provoke you to reveal (well, maybe a bit!) just genuinely curious! They could concrete over all the Central Line and turn it into a bicycle way. It would remove lots of cyclists from the streets of London, and it would be cheap, and it would be environmentally friendly, and it would be healthy. Perfect!
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 23:00:53 GMT
I know I wasn't trying to provoke you to reveal (well, maybe a bit!) just genuinely curious! They could concrete over all the Central Line and turn it into a bicycle way. It would remove lots of cyclists from the streets of London, and it would be cheap, and it would be environmentally friendly, and it would be healthy. Perfect! LOL ;D ;D Theyd probably try to install ATP on the bikes, and when it fails you'd have to pedal in restricted manual. |
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Post by suncloud on Sept 12, 2007 23:03:43 GMT
The East end of the Central is the bit that has the least amount of sensible alternative routes... and seems to have layouts that make special arrangements work quite well (e.g. Leytonstone can reverse Epping trains in platform 2 and have Hainault trains reverse beyond using platforms 1&3). In previous cases of full line suspension the East end has been the first to get buses sorted out.
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 23:04:48 GMT
If only the Victoria Line met up with the east end of the Central...
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 23:05:22 GMT
It's also much busier than the west end of the line . . .
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 23:07:27 GMT
Most of the west of the line is not far from the District/Picc/Met/mainline so assuming the population is not dissimilar you would expect the west to have a lower ridership per line than the east where there isn't anything else on rails.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 23:08:21 GMT
If only the Victoria Line met up with the east end of the Central... It wouldn't be a major project to extend it from Walthamstow to South Woodford, but the Victoria line can't handle any more traffic as it is! |
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 23:12:40 GMT
Much more money, but extend the existing Victoria line to South Woodford and maybe beyond and duplicate it with a sub-surface gauge express tube - South Woodford-Walthamstow-Finsbury Park-Kings Cross-Holborn-Victoria-Waterloo-Brixton perhaps.
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Post by jamesb on Sept 12, 2007 23:14:21 GMT
During the Chancery Lane suspension, the replacement bus which took me from Roding Valley to Blackhorse Road was very quick, that would be a good idea to link them up - it would make getting into Euston very fast indeed. I wonder did that idea ever get considered? If only the Victoria Line met up with the east end of the Central... It wouldn't be a major project to extend it from Walthamstow to South Woodford, but the Victoria line can't handle any more traffic as it is! |
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Post by superteacher on Sept 12, 2007 23:15:06 GMT
Much more money, but extend the existing Victoria line to South Woodford and maybe beyond and duplicate it with a sub-surface gauge express tube - South Woodford-Walthamstow-Finsbury Park-Kings Cross-Holborn-Victoria-Waterloo-Brixton perhaps. Sounds like the old Chelsea - Hackney tube proposal . . . well, bits of it! |
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Post by Chris M on Sept 12, 2007 23:17:25 GMT
Haven't there been about 27 different iterations of that proposal?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2007 23:18:37 GMT
I am just wondering if the problem is a computer software type of issue, connected to the ATO system and the way the train picks up codes etc. or a more 'hardware' type of problem. I suppose all those details they are still investigating. Whatever it was, it can't have been * that * bad because trains continued to run, and are running now according to the TfL website. Unless they are all been driven in restricted manual or with speed limits, but this wouldn't get anyone anywhere very quickly! I do not belive there is any issue with the ATO or signalling or software. *If* there is an issue with the hardware, one has to remember that these trains have covered millions of killometers, *should* a new issue have arisen suggesting a possible latent defect. The occurance of such an event on one train after all this time, may be indicative of a problem, but after such a long time it is reasonably unlikely that a further occurance is a matter of hours away. But it is common sense to check the whole fleet to establish the state of play and assess if there is a need for any fleetwide modifications either immediately, urgently, soon or not at all. depending upon findings. It is my experience that safety is very highly regarded by London Underground and they would not play fast and loose with passenger safety. Either the stock running at the east end of the Central has had a check, or their is a negligable chance of any further issue before close of traffic. It is very easy to "stop the lot" as a knee jerk reaction give the unfortunate history of this particular stock, but that may not be the most realistic level headed decision. I don't know, but I'd suspect, given the BBC reports, that the suspension out west is probably down to "crewing issues" and the reduced service out east down to either "some crewing issues" or "limited stock availability" or both ! All a shame, I have to say the 1992 stock is probably one of the best stocks from a visual perspective, a layout perspective and a speed perspective. A shame about some presentation / maintenance issues (and missing arm rests) but even so ... nicer than their successors ! |
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Post by towerman on Sept 13, 2007 4:14:11 GMT
Had the same thing on the Central back in the 70's,a posi current rail on the crossing at Liverpool St was cracking pos shoe beams,the whole service was suspended by about 10:30am for checks and didn't resume till lunchtime.The shop staff loved it,got a weekend in on OT changing shoe beams.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2007 6:19:47 GMT
Good service on the Central this morning..
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Post by johnb on Sept 13, 2007 8:23:59 GMT
It is my experience that safety is very highly regarded by London Underground and they would not play fast and loose with passenger safety. Either the stock running at the east end of the Central has had a check, or their is a negligable chance of any further issue before close of traffic. It is very easy to "stop the lot" as a knee jerk reaction give the unfortunate history of this particular stock, but that may not be the most realistic level headed decision. If only Comrade Bob and his merry men shared your levels of sanity... |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2007 11:24:03 GMT
Holland Park. 50% failure 50% politics IMHO Oh, wasn't there a Footie Match last night  ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2007 11:33:40 GMT
e.g. Leytonstone can reverse Epping trains in platform 2 and have Hainault trains reverse beyond using platforms 1&3 With stepping back & double ending, this method of reversing is very effective, as there are no conflicting movements. White City also allows for similar movements. Paris, Sao Paulo, and Mexico City metros use this terminus design with great success. If only London had more of these designs as proper termini instead of intermediate reversing points! |
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I wasn't trying to provoke you to reveal (well, maybe a bit!) just genuinely curious! 
;D
