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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:26:13 GMT
While riding westbound into Ealing Broadway today from North Acton, I was somewhat alarmed by the juddering and vibrating emanating from the west end bogie of UNDM 91224. The vibration was especially pronounced when accelerating or decelerating, and it got so bad at one point that the entire carriage literally shook! Judging from the way in which the vibration built, it seemed like every tyre on the bogie had at least one or two flats!
After making it to EAB without having a handle down, I flagged down the driver next to 91224 while he was changing ends and pointed out what the problem was, suggesting that it could have been wheel flats. He thanked me effusively and ran off to the east end cab to report it.
What is the 'usual' procedure to report train problems that may result in a non-ALARP scenario? Had the vibration been truly bad I would have pulled the handle at West Acton, but I figured it would be better to simply tell the driver at EAB to avoid delaying the service.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:28:42 GMT
Tell me OneKEA, do you have a red cape and wear your pants on the outside like a certain other super hero? ;D ;D ;D
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:30:30 GMT
Tell me OneKEA, do you have a red cape and wear your pants on the outside like a certain other super hero? ;D ;D ;D *listens to the sound of a rotating handle* No, I wear my pants in the normal place - I don't want to get chucked off the stations by the security folks  ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:31:18 GMT
Did you notice a repetitive knocking noise while the train was in motion? Strictly, 92ts don't have UMDM cars, 91xxx are designated 'A' cars...
Could also have been Traction probs, intermittent contact with juice rails?
I write faults in the Defect Log and also in my notebook to cover myself... anything I consider major will call control for advice/arrange a techy guy to attend...
think I grabbed 224 yesterday too...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:34:46 GMT
Did you notice a repetitive knocking noise while the train was in motion? Strictly, 92ts don't have UMDM cars, 91xxx are designated 'A' cars... Actually, yes - beneath the incessant vibration I thought I could detect the characteristic slapping sound of wheel flats, which is what I told the T/Op. I didn't want to sound like an idiot by saying that the bogie itself had gone wrong, although I would not be shocked if it had, judging from that vibration... Could also have been Traction probs, intermittent contact with juice rails? I doubt it - the vibration, surprisingly, lessened ever so slightly when the train was not accelerating or decelerating. There was no sound of arcing, either. |
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Post by Tubeboy on Mar 18, 2007 18:38:01 GMT
Tell me OneKEA, do you have a red cape and wear your pants on the outside like a certain other super hero? ;D ;D ;D He didn't report it and obtain a reference number though did he! ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:39:50 GMT
I think you're right with your assumption... Sounds like severe flats on all wheels...
I'll probably find out Tuesday...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:40:03 GMT
Tell me OneKEA, do you have a red cape and wear your pants on the outside like a certain other super hero? ;D ;D ;D He didn't report it and obtain a reference number though did he! ;D The scary thing is that if I could actually do that, I would have... |
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Post by Tubeboy on Mar 18, 2007 18:41:07 GMT
You should get a job on LU!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:47:20 GMT
Can give you the number for Hainault Depot if you want!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 18:48:41 GMT
Can give you the number for Hainault Depot if you want! ROTFLMAO, I can already imagine what the DDM will think when Joe Q. Random calls him up and starts blathering about UNDMs and wheel flats and maintenance stoppage. Comedy gold!! |
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Post by jamesb on Mar 18, 2007 19:34:10 GMT
What's a wheel flat/how does it happen? Maybe the question is a bit basic...  |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 19:38:22 GMT
Wheel flat is where the tyre is not of the same diameter. theres a flat patch on it... Imagine it like having a puncture on a bike, except that the flat bit will move around... flats occur where the wheel/axle locks up due to heavy braking, or worst case, a seized axle/traction motor...
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Mar 18, 2007 19:42:18 GMT
A wheel flat is just that: a flattened portion of the steel or other metal tyre affixed to the train's wheel. They can be caused by say wheels locking, skidding, wheelslip...and they cause a "knock-knock-knock" sound when on the move that at speed sounds like a pneumatic drill. The solution is to take the offending car out of service and then use a wheel lathe that turns the tyres down to perfect round profile, with chamfering. Once upon a time this meant taking the offending wheel off, but now they can use an in-situ wheel lathe to turn the wheel. Much quicker! And cheaper.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 19:56:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2007 19:59:24 GMT
Most definately a flatted wheel there...
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Post by District Dave on Mar 18, 2007 21:33:52 GMT
(Noted on fault card "Servicable - get call point to confirm" |
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Post by jamesb on Mar 18, 2007 23:08:12 GMT
Thanks for description... I learnt something new today!
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Post by Chris M on Mar 19, 2007 3:44:04 GMT
For an extreme cases of wheel flats and the damage they can do to infrastructure see this RAIB report into a derailment near Cheltenham, and this one into broken rails caused by wheel flats at Urchfont and Kennington). Although both reports relate to freight trains on NR the mechanics (I presume) will be the same on LU. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 17:47:35 GMT
BUMP. I think you're right with your assumption... Sounds like severe flats on all wheels... I'll probably find out Tuesday... Did you find out? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 17:55:09 GMT
224 has been 'stopped'... Thats according to the DDM at Hainault. Dunno how true it is, because I dinnae have that unit today.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 18:07:37 GMT
224 has been 'stopped'... Thats according to the DDM at Hainault. Dunno how true it is, because I dinnae have that unit today.  Clearly the source of that vibration was a serious matter! |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 18:16:05 GMT
The DDM did not say how serious it was... I just called him on the auto phone to let them know about it... he said he wad already aware of 224...
I await developments, but clearly yes, it is being taken as a serious issue!
You deserve a Silver 'Thanks to You' award!!! ;D
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 18:48:27 GMT
The DDM did not say how serious it was... I just called him on the auto phone to let them know about it... he said he wad already aware of 224... I await developments, but clearly yes, it is being taken as a serious issue! I do wonder though precisely what the T/Op reported - I'm sure that the BCV fitters at Ruislip and Hainault are quite used to receiving reports of "vibration while under power" and marking it NDF to wind up everyone You deserve a Silver 'Thanks to You' award!!! ;D Well, it's not every day that Joe Q. Random gets a unit of 1992TS stopped! |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 18:54:50 GMT
You want to see some of the Defect Entries I have come across, apart from the fitters reply of NDF... I have seen much worse... Nice to see that most T/Ops are requesting a written reply when they report persistant defects...
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Post by auxsetreq on Mar 21, 2007 20:43:59 GMT
Actually guys - there is no 91224 as all 91 car have odd numbers. I take it this car is located somwhere in the middle of the train and would have a 92/93 prefix - unit 93224/92224
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 20:49:51 GMT
ARGH.
It must have been 92224 or 92114 then...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2007 21:05:56 GMT
Unless of course, some wizzock has got the numbering stickers muddled! [say after a graffiti attack] Possible, given Metronots current efforts...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2007 21:23:06 GMT
BUMP.
Has Metronet BCV lost the instruction booklet to the Central Line wheel lathe? 92197's west end bogie was making evil noises today as well, and it sounded exactly like 92224!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2007 21:16:13 GMT
*sighs*
*picks up phone and dials Hainault DDM*
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;D ;D ;D
