Unreliable Stock across the network | District Dave's London Underground Site

will

Posts: 254

Unreliable Stock across the network Feb 11, 2024 21:31:13 GMT roman80, AndrewPSSP, and 1 more like this

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Post by will on Feb 11, 2024 21:31:13 GMT

Many lines seem to be struggling to provide the timetabled service because of a lack of good stock especially in peak periods. I wanted to get a list on one thread of what's wrong with each stock and the plan for repair. I have a vague idea of the stock issues each line has, I know there are many more knowledgeable people on here that could hopefully provide more specific details?

Bakerloo - New timetable introduced to release trains for accessibility works. They have had life extension works too recently in 2015 that repaired the body work of the trains. LUL basically just trying to keep the trains running for as long as possible.

Central - Major long term motor issues that at the moment is causing around 20-25 train cancellations every peak period. The heavily delayed CLIP is trying to remedy the issues.

Jubilee - Major car body issues and serious cracks that have resulted in some trains long term stopped and some trains being cannibalised to keep others going. What is actually happening to repair the long term issues of the major body cracks?

Northern - Some issues been mentioned but I cannot find much about the 95 stock and the issues they are having. Anyone know how many trains are being cancelled because of a lack of serviceable stock?

Piccadilly - Regular cancellations - not sure of the specific reasons. The last few autumn seasons have been hard on the wheels of the 73. Replacement obviously planned soon.

Victoria - Any issues with the 09 stock? I am under the impression this is the most reliable stock on LUL

SSR - Any issues with train defects causing cancellations?

Waterloo & City - The only line that can run all required trains?

Some more information from those in the know would be great

xtmw

Posts: 581

Unreliable Stock across the network Feb 11, 2024 22:32:26 GMT gefw likes this

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Post by xtmw on Feb 11, 2024 22:32:26 GMT

Concerning the Bakerloo line, you say 'LUL basically just trying to keep the trains running for as long as possible.', I don't know what else there is to say considering the current financial situation? The Piccadilly Line can't have it's life-expired signalling replaced with ATP/ATO systems due to the funding not being in place. Getting new trains is not easy as it sounds - the 2024 stock introduction comes with alot of prep. Co-acting signals being commissioned, new sidings & depots being upgraded, platforms being altered in order to accommodate for the new stock.

Of course they are trying to keep all the fleet running for as long as possible, there isn't the money available! Hence why the CLIP project is here, BBC News pointed out it's a 'refurbishment not replacement'.

gefw

Gone - but still interested

Posts: 201

Unreliable Stock across the network Feb 12, 2024 10:24:58 GMT

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Post by gefw on Feb 12, 2024 10:24:58 GMT

Feb 11, 2024 22:32:26 GMT xtmw said:

Concerning the Bakerloo line, you say 'LUL basically just trying to keep the trains running for as long as possible.', I don't know what else there is to say considering the current financial situation? The Piccadilly Line can't have it's life-expired signalling replaced with ATP/ATO systems due to the funding not being in place. Getting new trains is not easy as it sounds - the 2024 stock introduction comes with alot of prep. Co-acting signals being commissioned, new sidings & depots being upgraded, platforms being altered in order to accommodate for the new stock.

Of course they are trying to keep all the fleet running for as long as possible, there isn't the money available! Hence why the CLIP project is here, BBC News pointed out it's a 'refurbishment not replacement'.

This rather comes down to the whole life asset management process (which I think is the role of the Annual asset condition assessment and resulting Asset strategy review). This is something the government specifically asked TFL to improve is the conditions of the early bail out agreements.

As I understand good Asset Strategy and Management practice requires a regular review of the balance of maintenance/heavy overhauls/refurb (sometimes called interventions) against full replacement. Same sought of thing you may do yourself with a car - when is it time to stop throwing good money after bad with repairs and running costs and instead spend that on loan repayments/depreciation on a newer one.?

PiccNT

Posts: 377

Unreliable Stock across the network Feb 12, 2024 11:34:24 GMT

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Post by PiccNT on Feb 12, 2024 11:34:24 GMT

On the Picc it's a combination of trains not offered for service because of the flatted wheels issue, partly down to poor driving techniques, and unavailability of drivers. There's always a lot of training on the line due to a shortage and it seems that as soon as we get new drivers trained, others disappear to other lines, or retire or move elsewhere for various reasons.

will

Posts: 254

Unreliable Stock across the network Feb 12, 2024 14:32:37 GMT

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Post by will on Feb 12, 2024 14:32:37 GMT

Feb 12, 2024 10:24:58 GMT gefw said:

Feb 11, 2024 22:32:26 GMT xtmw said:

Concerning the Bakerloo line, you say 'LUL basically just trying to keep the trains running for as long as possible.', I don't know what else there is to say considering the current financial situation? The Piccadilly Line can't have it's life-expired signalling replaced with ATP/ATO systems due to the funding not being in place. Getting new trains is not easy as it sounds - the 2024 stock introduction comes with alot of prep. Co-acting signals being commissioned, new sidings & depots being upgraded, platforms being altered in order to accommodate for the new stock.

Of course they are trying to keep all the fleet running for as long as possible, there isn't the money available! Hence why the CLIP project is here, BBC News pointed out it's a 'refurbishment not replacement'.

This rather comes down to the whole life asset management process (which I think is the role of the Annual asset condition assessment and resulting Asset strategy review). This is something the government specifically asked TFL to improve is the conditions of the early bail out agreements.

As I understand good Asset Strategy and Management practice requires a regular review of the balance of maintenance/heavy overhauls/refurb (sometimes called interventions) against full replacement. Same sought of thing you may do yourself with a car - when is it time to stop throwing good money after bad with repairs and running costs and instead spend that on loan repayments/depreciation on a newer one.?

Asset management is clearly an issue but its a serious concern that the 1992 &1996 stock are all having major issues. The 1992 stock particularly extremely unreliable from introduction with someone can't unfortunately think who saying "The Central Line now works almost as well as it did in the days before they spent £800m on it" when they introduced the 1992 stock. Anyone know anything more about the defects i have heard mentioned about the 1995 stock?