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Post by lutn on Oct 13, 2022 18:26:06 GMT
Hello all, I've recently seen a Circle Line train (T212) at Paddington's Sub station with the dot matrix suggesting that its going to "Goldhawk Road" as a H&C, but the WTT says the opposite, being a Circle Line O/R via Aldgate (?!) So I'm very curious to ask if anyone has the full list of codes used by the S-Stock (I'm guessing its a long one) to see where these trains can terminate. (PM will do  ) Cheers |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Oct 13, 2022 21:30:11 GMT
I saw a video on Facebook the other day of an S stock proclaiming it was going to Watford Junction.
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Post by lutn on Oct 13, 2022 22:49:05 GMT
I’ve seen the video of the PIS screen saying Watford Junction, even the DVA announcements were about to say it, but the driver managed to cut it off before it said “Junction” with the PA button 😅
Interesting to see that’s even implemented
Mod edit [Antharro]: Quote removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread.
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Oct 14, 2022 0:38:51 GMT
So I'm very curious to ask if anyone has the full list of codes used by the S-Stock (I'm guessing its a long one) to see where these trains can terminate. (PM will do ) Cheers It's a fairly looooooong list. In the first instance we can only show destinations that are reversing points. Not sure where this Watford Junction one has come from (on the District we don't have the Met codes) though to be fair Gloucester Road was recently added to our list and that's an exception to the rule as its not a reversing point for us on the District line. From the reversing points the list of three digit code numbers is then made up of logical routes. So on the District for example there is a code number for Upminster to Richmond. Now it doesn't matter where on that route the journey starts; it can be Upminster, Dagenham East, Barking, Tower Hill or any other reversing point on that route - the same code number is used. The train knows where it is when it's in a platform and it'll simply start the digital voice announcer and internal displays from wherever the start of that given journey is. That's the basics of the S stock system. |
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Post by philthetube on Oct 14, 2022 1:27:28 GMT
On the Met there are quite a few destinations missing you cannot display a route all stations north to Harrow on the hill then fast to Ricky and beyond, also being able to show routes for 1 station before termini would be useful, in case the final station is closed but trains are able to run empty to it.
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jimbo
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Post by jimbo on Oct 14, 2022 3:13:53 GMT
Hello all, I've recently seen a Circle Line train (T212) at Paddington's Sub station with the dot matrix suggesting that its going to "Goldhawk Road" as a H&C, but the WTT says the opposite, being a Circle Line O/R via Aldgate (?!) ..... Goldhawk Road is, of course, a service termination point for trains working direct to Hammersmith sidings. Workings can be varied from WTT as required, e.g. staffing problems, or train change-overs. |
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Post by Dstock7080 on Oct 14, 2022 5:05:15 GMT
Not sure where this Watford Junction one has come from (on the District we don't have the Met codes) though to be fair Gloucester Road was recently added to our list and that's an exception to the rule as its not a reversing point for us on the District line. If you change an S7 to list alphabetically rather than numerically Watford Junction can be found, or 58 59 60 366 367. |
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Post by t697 on Oct 14, 2022 7:31:33 GMT
Having worked on this, I looked up some history. At one time there were 557 specific 'Trips' available. This was when the Watford Junction related trips were added as the Met Line Extension Project was proceeding at that time. When it was stopped, there was no instruction to remove these ones. Perhaps there's a twinkle that it might come back, although I suspect it's just been quietly forgotten. If it did proceed and actually open, there would need to be further changes to the interchange announcements at Harrow and Moor Park.
As mentioned earlier in the thread, the trips available cover all usable terminations for reverse or to proceed to depots/sidings, continuous Circles, 5 different stopping patterns on the Met and so on. Fasts and Semi-fasts each have options for stopping at Wembley Park or not.
It's often been offered to add the inverted semi-fast Mets (fast north of Harrow, all stations south of Harrow) but Operations and Customer Experience have never decided what to call them or whether to implement them as a permanent feature.
The current list has 454 Trips. Over a few updates, Trips terminating at Hornchurch, Bromley-by-Bow and East Putney have been deleted as crossovers were removed. Also all the non-stop Cannon Street trips as the 'skip' announcements would now be triggered automatically by ATC on the normal Trip so separate Trips are not required. Trips are now included for all reversing at Tower Hill that the new track layout was supposed to provide also Westminster for another future crossover project.
Hillingdon and all Aldgate Easts remain included. No instruction to remove those. Maybe Hillingdon to UXB Sidings move will be reinstated some day...
My favourite obscure Trip is Ickenham from Uxbridge, for the train to be working an Uxbridge - Ickenham shuttle reversing EB to WB using the signalled move at the Ruislip Siding crossover. Ever been used? I know the Wimbledon Park - Wimbledon shuttle has been used occasionally.
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Post by lutn on Oct 14, 2022 9:17:44 GMT
The current list has 454 Trips. My favourite obscure Trip is Ickenham from Uxbridge, for the train to be working an Uxbridge - Ickenham shuttle reversing EB to WB using the signalled move at the Ruislip Siding crossover. Ever been used? Uxbridge to Ickenham would make sense using the Ruislip Siding crossover, but I've never heard it being used Have you got those 454 trips? Quote partially removed. Please be selective about the part of a post you wish to quote rather than the whole post verbatim, particularly if you are replying to the previous post in the thread.
-Dstock7080 |
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Post by t697 on Oct 14, 2022 9:21:36 GMT
PM'd the list.
Even more obscure is North Harrow from each of the northern termini. This was provision for the replacement of Harrow North Junction with a new layout and signalled moves allowing a train to be reversed SB to NB before getting to Harrow. This work seems to be on permanent hold.
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Post by t697 on Oct 14, 2022 19:20:44 GMT
Gloucester Road was recently added to our list and that's an exception to the rule as its not a reversing point for us on the District line. It's a destination available in ATC. Presumably the train would reverse in platform 3 then a C&H driver take it to High St or Edgware Road, then it could reverse again and go to the west end of the District from whence it came in the first place. A triangular set of moves for a Special Service for a Closure I guess. I wonder whether it will ever be used. |
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Post by t697 on Oct 14, 2022 19:47:26 GMT
being able to show routes for 1 station before termini would be useful, in case the final station is closed but trains are able to run empty to it. Actually the Met is well provided for that particularly as we've left Hillingdon available  . Chalfont, Croxley, Hillingdon are all available on the NB trips, one short of Amersham/Chesham, Watford and Uxbridge. North Harrow, Finchley Road and Liverpool St are all available on the SB trips, one short of Harrow, Baker Street and Aldgate. On the H&C, Goldhawk Road WB, West Ham EB (& WB), East Ham EB (& WB) are available. On the District, Ealing Common, Wimbledon Park, Earl's Court, West Ham EB (& WB), East Ham EB (& WB), Upney but not Paddington (C&D), Monument, Kew Gardens, Dagenham Heathway or Upminster Bridge. One can pick more examples and more holes I'm sure.
And I now recall deleting Stepney Green WB when the Whitechapel siding was removed. Maybe should have left it!
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Oct 14, 2022 19:51:00 GMT
PM'd the list. Even more obscure is North Harrow from each of the northern termini. This was provision for the replacement of Harrow North Junction with a new layout and signalled moves allowing a train to be reversed SB to NB before getting to Harrow. This work seems to be on permanent hold. Interesting you mention that (as it also related to some of the discussion here). The idea of renewing Harrow North Junction has come up several times since about 2008 (and probably earlier), but every time it hasn't progressed. The first time it stopped as it would have interefered with the works Westinghouse were doing to replace track circuits, then the next time for similar reasons with Thales' 4LM design. Like the South Junctions, the best time to have done the work was in about 2007. I expect it will be some time before it is done because of the need to involve Thales for the redesign of the CBTC guideway because of the new track layout - which won't be cheap! |
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Post by Tom on Oct 14, 2022 20:24:43 GMT
On the District, Ealing Common I did wonder why Ealing Common made an appearance on the Train Indicators at Earl's Court - an odd choice considering no train ever terminates there because of the difficulty in accessing the depot from the WB. It makes more sense now! |
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Post by t697 on Oct 15, 2022 8:03:51 GMT
You can detrain in the WB platform, draw forward to an LOS sign and then there is a signalled shunt move back into the depot. Probably not used often but I think I recall it in an earlier WTT.
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Post by Tom on Oct 15, 2022 8:50:34 GMT
Exactly - hence the difficulty. It's not like a quick 'detrain and change ends' like other places.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Oct 16, 2022 15:14:56 GMT
And I now recall deleting Stepney Green WB when the Whitechapel siding was removed. Maybe should have left it! thankfully managed to capture it by inputting wrong code at Ealing Broadway!  |
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Post by exwatfordian on Oct 24, 2022 18:08:10 GMT
I saw a video on Facebook the other day of an S stock proclaiming it was going to Watford Junction. I will be very interested to see said video! |
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Post by Chris M on Oct 24, 2022 18:21:28 GMT
Unfortunately I don't remember off the top of my head where I saw it and Facebook's search is atrocious, but I'll keep trying to relocate it.
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Post by exwatfordian on Oct 1, 2023 15:31:35 GMT
Managed to find a YouTube video showcasing the rare announcement! I wonder if Cassiobridge, Watford Vicarage Road and Watford High Street have been recorded?
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Post by xtmw on Oct 1, 2023 22:26:43 GMT
I wonder if Cassiobridge, Watford Vicarage Road and Watford High Street have been recorded? I know closed stations have announcements recorded (eg, Charing X, North Weald, Ongar etc). If Watford Junction has been recorded, I would assume the rest have been recorded. On another note, I have seen pictures of a 92 describing its destination as Ongar. I wonder what that one would sound like! |
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Post by t697 on Oct 1, 2023 22:32:38 GMT
Yes, all the necessary audio files for Cassiobridge, Watford Vicarage Road and Watford High Street were also recorded and remain in the current CIS files. Unlike some other redundant items, no instruction has yet been made to remove the Met line Extension (MLE) announcements and trips. There's a maintenance test feature that one can use to play any 'trip' and these have been tested on train that way.
If the MLE were actually to be built, the interchange announcements at Harrow and Moor Park would need amendment. |
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Post by Chris M on Oct 1, 2023 22:34:50 GMT
Many years ago we had a forum outing to the east end of the Central line, and one of the drivers, having recognised one or more of our party, played a message describing the train as a Waterloo & City line train (I forget which way it was going). We weren't expecting this and so didn't record it, but I presume that it is still available.
Regarding why messages like Watford Junction were recorded, I presume that it would be (possibly very) significantly cheaper to add a small handful of items to an already long list to items than to commission another small set in the future. And that's even if the same recording artist is still alive and in business and still sounds similar to their earlier self.
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Post by t697 on Oct 1, 2023 22:51:16 GMT
Two different female artistes have already been used. I seem to recall the last set of new recordings rather than just simple edits being done maybe as long ago as about 2015 or 2016, which would have included the MLE stations and the Elizabeth line interchanges, oh and the NLE stations for disruption messaging. Had to wait quite a while for the EL ones to be brought into use!
Maybe the next need for new audio will be the LO line names and any other updates needed by then or foreseen for the next few years.
There are about 3000 audio files in S stock, so it would be expensive to re-record the full set with one person. If it's ever done, perhaps it would be done using a synthesis based on a specific real human's voice. Same principle as 24TS but for the S stock system synthesised and recorded, rather than synthesised at the moment of use.
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