TfL announces safety ban of e-scooters on transport network

I saw this earlier and wondered why TFL aren't bothered about commercially owned e-scooters catching setting the network ablaze.

The sign above does not appear to make the distinction.

E-scooters hired under TfL’s rental e-scooter trial have already been banned from TfL’s services because they cannot be folded.

Yes, but, technically, if anyone else offered them for hire, they would not be banned.

Which is odd.

If you want to ban e-scooters because they are a fire risk, why not just say they are banned, rather than fannying around banning one type and then, later, another? (Whilst, apparently, leaving a loophole for another commercial operator's scooters that would then need to be banned with a third order.)

Phew, we got there in the end.

It was the text in the first post that was not clear.

"Privately-owned e-scooters and e-unicycles will not be permitted on any TfL service or premises
Transport for London (TfL) has announced that all privately-owned e-scooters and e-unicycles, including those that can be folded or carried, will be banned on London's transport network from Monday 13 December. This is the result of safety concerns about these items following recent fires on TfL premises & services. Customers in possession of such devices will not be permitted to enter any premises on TfL's network or travel on any of its services, including on the Tube, buses, Overground, TfL Rail, Trams and DLR."

Whilst not inaccurate, to anyone who was not aware of the extant ban on rented scooters, it made it appear that it was specifically private scooters that were not permitted.

We eagerly await the next spasm of circumlocution!

Also banned from the Tyne and Wear Metro

www.nexus.org.uk/news/item/e-scooters-banned-metro-and-shields-ferry-monday-13-december

And here's the thing-

Just how many of these machines have actually caught fire at all? (I don't know.) For a while there was a laptop computer fire scare where a very few models of machine occasionally lit up (but none of the others did), yet we're still allowed to carry them pretty much everywhere. Same for power tool batteries. This sort of ban smacks of an antipathy to the machine and the people who are likely to use it. Granted that some will have shoddy design/construction but many won't. Granted that there have been a couple of fires but has anyone submitted the failed product for root-cause analysis? I'd be somewhat surprised if TfL did.

I wonder about Segways? Some years ago I saw Warwick Davis using a mini one to join the throng of passengers along a platform at Kings Cross mainline station. It made him just about the same height as most others...

I believe using a Segway has always been illegal other than on Private Property.

Obviously not - unless it's a secret ban. LU operate reactively. They don't have a team of people searching the world's catalogues looking for big batteries. If something is causing a problem on their property, static or dynamic, they will do something about it. Although, pragmatically, power tools would be a bit of a problem, as they can be carried without being visible, unlike a scooter.


When it comes to flight safety airlines, quite reasonably, operate a 'shoot first and ask questions later' policy. If they perceive a possible threat of fire in the air they will ban the possible cause until it's shown to be safe. They won't 'do a Boeing' and wait until a couple of aircraft have crashed before taking action.


No, they won't, but TFL don't need it to be illegal to ban it.

Smoking was legal, and you couldn't do it on the underground.
Drinking alcohol is, generally, legal, but you can't do it on the underground.

Indeed, riding a fixed frame bicycle is legal, but there are areas of the underground where you can't take a fixed frame bike.

It's TFL's property and they can ban what they like as long as it does not infringe the rights of a protected group.

People once said similar things about wheelchairs, now trains are built to accommodate them.

Lots of modern stock has similarly been built with cycle spaces; the new Merseyrail trains have six cycle spaces per train so that cycles can be carried.

Indeed so, but that is a different issue.

btw, my Stratford example was a London based variant of what happened several years ago when people wanted to catch a train from Brighton (I think it was that they had unfolded bikes) so that they could return home but were denied access to the platform, even though they had brought the bikes with them on the train earlier that day.

The problem was that the TOC which ran the majority of trains to and from that station had banned the unfolded bikes but these passengers wanted to catch a train operated by another TOC (probably CrossCountry) who did not ban unfolded bikes. The improperly trained station staff simply said 'no admittance' - they did not understand the subtlety of the situation / refused to listen / just did not want to know.

Which suggests they can't ride a scooter with a mobile, either. (Being able does not equate to being allowed.)

I agree it doesn't, but it moves the goalposts in TfL's favour in a couple of ways:

• It now gives staff powers to refuse entry to people with scooters
  
• If another incident involving a scooter takes place, it puts TfL in a stronger position to recover costs for any damage and/or injury, especially if the person using the scooter knew them to be banned (and was therefore knowingly in contravention).