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Post by spsmiler on Mar 10, 2020 0:02:31 GMT
at least in hot weather they (the 710s) will be air-conditioned (unlike the C stock - which had such poor ventilation when first built that within a few years of being built it had to have extra ventilation added)
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Post by nopixar on Mar 12, 2020 0:08:31 GMT
Thought I’d add this to the thread as its relavant... Will be 2x 710 8 cars for football this Sunday.
EDIT
Make that 3x 8 cars. The training train has been handed over by Bombardier meaning it can now be utilised in service when not in use.
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Post by waysider on Mar 15, 2020 10:53:24 GMT
I agree the new ground has made travelling by train to the ground after the game much MUCH worse.
some factors that havent been mentioned...
1. The 'new' ground now has a 2 miles radius CPZ ...you can't park a car without a residents permit inside that area. It is more than double the size of the old parking zone. For example, I could park on Queen street just south of the North Middlesex hospital, giving me a 20 walk to the ground. Now parking controls extend way noth of the north circular road, ending just south of Edmonton Green - an infeasable 45 minute walk. Thousands of people must now be travelling by rail instead of car. In Cheshunt, parking around the station on matchdays is far higher than before and I'd say these people previously drove to Tottenham. So, add them to the already increased numbers
2. Buses divert away from the ground - after the club stating they would be press for them allowed onto the High Road outside the ground. Routes like the 279, 149 and 259 all divert at Bruce Grove, go along the Great Cambridge Road and A406 and rejoin on Fore Street. Travelling by bus is therefore a non-starter, forcing people onto the trains
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Post by John Tuthill on Mar 15, 2020 12:38:35 GMT
I agree the new ground has made travelling by train to the ground after the game much MUCH worse. some factors that havent been mentioned... 1. The 'new' ground now has a 2 miles radius CPZ ...you can't park a car without a residents permit inside that area. It is more than double the size of the old parking zone. For example, I could park on Queen street just south of the North Middlesex hospital, giving me a 20 walk to the ground. Now parking controls extend way noth of the north circular road, ending just south of Edmonton Green - an infeasable 45 minute walk. Thousands of people must now be travelling by rail instead of car. In Cheshunt, parking around the station on matchdays is far higher than before and I'd say these people previously drove to Tottenham. So, add them to the already increased numbers 2. Buses divert away from the ground - after the club stating they would be press for them allowed onto the High Road outside the ground. Routes like the 279, 149 and 259 all divert at Bruce Grove, go along the Great Cambridge Road and A406 and rejoin on Fore Street. Travelling by bus is therefore a non-starter, forcing people onto the trains Re item 2-Who is the barmpot who came up with that one? There is a famous photo, check out the LT museum photo archieve, of a crocadile of Trollybuses taking supporters away. Snowflakes??!!
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Post by cudsn15 on Mar 15, 2020 14:45:30 GMT
It's not that long a walk from Bruce Grove - indeed most people walk from/to Seven Sisters anyway!
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Post by waysider on Mar 15, 2020 23:01:16 GMT
It's not that long a walk from Bruce Grove - indeed most people walk from/to Seven Sisters anyway! well there's the solution ...dont use White Hart Lane station, just walk the 1.8 miles to Seven Sisters - simples!
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Post by phil on Mar 16, 2020 21:45:42 GMT
But back in 1960 they were more trains than now on the Enfield town branch so it can happen and it did back then,9tph as oppose to 6tph now So what is the problem? If seven platforms at LS cannot handle an intense service for one hour to shift the crowds afterwards then the system is not fit for purpose,irrespective of what stock is used or rather the people that run it are not.
Back in the 1960s we did not have powered doors on the WA route that will not open for a second or so after the train has stopped. This means dwell times at stations these days HAVE to be longer as half the trains passengers will not have exited before it has stopped moving.
Back in the 1960s we did not have TPWS or OTMDR. These days because if a driver is proven to fall foul of these safety devices then they WILL be sacked and quite possibility be sent to prison like the Thameslink driver a few years ago drivers have no opportunity to recover from delays. In the case of Liverpool Street TPWS will enforce a 10mph along the platform rather than the 'slam the anchors on at the last minute' approch used in the 1960s
Back in the 1960s signalling design standards with respect to things like minimum overlaps and run by protection were more relaxed thus the installation included several things which are now forbidden under the design rules which had to be used for the late 1990s / early 2000s resignalling of the routes.
All these (and more) mean that the modern railway cannot have the same capacity as was achievable in the 1960s.
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Post by Chris M on Mar 17, 2020 0:19:44 GMT
It is though a much safer railway than the 1960s one. 1983: 28 workers killsed, 69 people killed* 2014-15: 4 workers killed, 14 people killed* *excluding trespassers and suicide) There were at least two fatal train accidents every year in the 1960s, there have been no fatal train accidents since 2006, the last year wth 2 was 2003. There were 50 fatal train accidents between 1960 and 1969, that's the same total as 1976-2019. Source: ORR
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 17, 2020 7:15:35 GMT
1983: 28 workers killsed, 69 people killed* 2014-15: 4 workers killed, 14 people killed* *excluding trespassers and suicide) Does the "people" figure include the workers, or should that read "other people" As I understand it, the figures include all fatalities on railway property, regardless of whether a train was involved, so includes for example people falling down steps at a station. Not sure where you are getting the dates of the most recent fatal accidents from. There were indeed two fatal accidents in 2003, both on level crossings and neither killing any passengers on the trains involved, but the same is true of 2005 and there have been several more fatalities at level crossings since then - the most recent for which I can find a report was in 2014. Apart from incidents involving road vehicles on the track (Ufton Nervet, Great Heck), the only fatalities to passengers on board trains since the turn of the century have been at Hatfield (2000), Potters Bar (2002) and Grayrigg (2007). In the last-mentioned, a passenger suffered a fatal heart attack, probably brought on by the derailment, but there were no other fatalities.
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Post by brigham on Mar 17, 2020 8:31:30 GMT
I remember a major collision which was front-page news for over a week, in which the final death-toll was a staggering five days' worth of road casualties. It may be time for a frank discussion on the always-awkward subject of 'an acceptable number of deaths'.
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Post by Chris M on Mar 17, 2020 9:47:32 GMT
1983: 28 workers killsed, 69 people killed* 2014-15: 4 workers killed, 14 people killed* *excluding trespassers and suicide) Does the "people" figure include the workers, or should that read "other people" As I understand it, the figures include all fatalities on railway property, regardless of whether a train was involved, so includes for example people falling down steps at a station. Not sure where you are getting the dates of the most recent fatal accidents from. There were indeed two fatal accidents in 2003, both on level crossings and neither killing any passengers on the trains involved, but the same is true of 2005 and there have been several more fatalities at level crossings since then - the most recent for which I can find a report was in 2014. Apart from incidents involving road vehicles on the track (Ufton Nervet, Great Heck), the only fatalities to passengers on board trains since the turn of the century have been at Hatfield (2000), Potters Bar (2002) and Grayrigg (2007). In the last-mentioned, a passenger suffered a fatal heart attack, probably brought on by the derailment, but there were no other fatalities. I explicitly linked the source in my post: an ORR document about railway safety. The figures do not include deaths at levelcrossings, but they don't include them for either year so we are comparing like with like which is the point.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 17, 2020 11:01:25 GMT
]I explicitly linked the source in my post: an ORR document about railway safety. The figures do not include deaths at level crossings, but they don't include them for either year so we are comparing like with like which is the point. That chart in the ORR report is not very clear. I can't see anything suggesting level crossing accidents are excluded - those in which railway users died seem to be counted - the one accident shown for 2004/5 is presumably Upton Nervet. There were collisions at level crossings on the Romney Hythe & Dymchurch Railway in 2003 and 2005, both fatal to the train drivers. One of these appears to be included in the chart, but not the other. The most recent fatal accident was at Grayrigg in February 2007 (not 2006), and is shown in the 2006/07 reporting year. One of those in 2002/03 was presumably Potters Bar (May 2002), but I can't identify the second. The two in 2000/01 were Hatfield and Great Heck - the latter (in Feb 2001) was a collision with a road vehicle, albeit not at a level crossing.
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Post by Chris M on Mar 17, 2020 11:06:47 GMT
That you are quibbling over whether a few years in the last 15 years have had 0, 1 or 2 fatal accidents rather proves the point I was making that the railway is a lot safer now than it was in the 1960s when two fatal crashes meant an exceptionally safe year rather than an exceptionally deadly one.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 17, 2020 14:16:58 GMT
That you are quibbling over whether a few years in the last 15 years have had 0, 1 or 2 fatal accidents rather proves the point I was making that the railway is a lot safer now than it was in the 1960s when two fatal crashes meant an exceptionally safe year rather than an exceptionally deadly one. Quite so
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Post by stafford on Apr 26, 2020 14:04:33 GMT
I know for a fact that the old LNER had plans to four track this area up the lea valley way way back even with first thoughts before WW2. Revived in the 45=46 era, the money was never forthcoming. Quite a few minor structural things were however done with this in long term mind. Maybe we are seeing a trifle of this at last. Should help with all this agony.
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Post by waysider on Aug 11, 2020 21:35:11 GMT
Went by White Hart Lane this afternoon. Old Ticket office demolished... 20200810_142812 by james tuite, on Flickr The powers that be at Haringey Council have decided to install 'rain gardens' all along White Hart Lane (the final ones going in now, in front of the old ticket office location). These are sunken flower beds, a foot lower than the pavement and will help 'prevent flooding'. I have never encountered flooding on White Hart Lane but can imagine when its dark and several thousand people are walking by, one or two may stumble into them 20200810_142824 by james tuite, on Flickr Big intentionally rusty railings and gate now surround the 'old' London-bound staircase 20200810_142759 by james tuite, on Flickr and similar gates are at the foot of the old northbound stairs and a second gate is now on the right with a path leading to the new stairs further along 20200810_142724 by james tuite, on Flickr
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