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Post by trc666 on Mar 31, 2018 12:27:59 GMT
Hopefully I've put this in the right section but please move if need be!
During the construction of the Victoria line in the 1960s the Northern City Line (then a part of the Northern line) was cut back to Drayton Park and ran as a shuttle to and from Moorgate. Was it known back then that the line would be transferred to British Rail and was it ever considered to have the NCL as a branch of the Victoria line or at least use the existing alignment between Finsbury Park and Highbury & Islington so Drayton Park could also be served?
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
Posts: 1,480
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Post by slugabed on Mar 31, 2018 17:30:28 GMT
My recollection is that,no,they hadn't made the plans yet,to transfer the NCL when the Victoria Line was built.
I seem to remember that they were at a loss as to what to best do with the NCL but didn't want to go through the hassle of closing it.
As for the "branch" suggestion,the answer to this may lie in the earlier plans for the NCL (Northern Heights) and the evolution of the proto-Victoria Line.
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Post by superteacher on Mar 31, 2018 20:47:16 GMT
It wasn’t a shuttle in the accepted sense of the word since they used 5 trains for service and both the northbound and southbound lines.
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
Posts: 1,275
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Post by roythebus on Apr 2, 2018 9:49:36 GMT
It was always the intention since the line was built that it should connect with the main line and run through trains, hence the reason it was built to take big trains. There's been a number of threads on here about the NCL and its history.
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Post by John Tuthill on Apr 2, 2018 10:14:06 GMT
It was always the intention since the line was built that it should connect with the main line and run through trains, hence the reason it was built to take big trains. There's been a number of threads on here about the NCL and its history. It's well out of print, but keep your eyes open for an old LT publication called: "The Big Tube" by J. Graham Bruce, might be on Amazon |
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Post by superteacher on Apr 2, 2018 10:26:57 GMT
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Post by jukes on Apr 2, 2018 16:53:48 GMT
It was always the intention since the line was built that it should connect with the main line and run through trains, hence the reason it was built to take big trains. There's been a number of threads on here about the NCL and its history. It's well out of print, but keep your eyes open for an old LT publication called: "The Big Tube" by J. Graham Bruce, might be on Amazon "The Big Tube" was published in 1976. I bought my copy then for £1!!! It would probably answer your questions - I might re-read it tonight! One thing tho - it doesn't have any pictures showing the NCL platforms at Finsbury Park - so as an aside - if anyone has such pictures I would be very interested! |
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Post by superteacher on Apr 2, 2018 17:02:55 GMT
It's well out of print, but keep your eyes open for an old LT publication called: "The Big Tube" by J. Graham Bruce, might be on Amazon "The Big Tube" was published in 1976. I bought my copy then for £1!!! It would probably answer your questions - I might re-read it tonight! One thing tho - it doesn't have any pictures showing the NCL platforms at Finsbury Park - so as an aside - if anyone has such pictures I would be very interested! A few pics here, including the end of one of the platforms at Finsbury Park. www.flickr.com/photos/train-pix/5927927750 |
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
Posts: 1,480
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Post by slugabed on Apr 2, 2018 21:08:08 GMT
Looks like what is now the SB Vic.
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Post by jukes on Apr 2, 2018 21:14:30 GMT
Looks like what is now the SB Vic. The Finsbury Park picture is the northern end of what is now the southbound Piccadilly line platform. The picture at Highbury is definitely now the southbound Victoria line (ex Northbound NCL). |
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Post by superteacher on Apr 2, 2018 22:03:32 GMT
So I’m assuming that the old lift access to the platforms at Highbury was at the opposite end to the current access (northern end)? I’d love to see some pics of the inside of the old station. I wonder if there is still some access from the old station to the platforms?
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Apr 3, 2018 14:11:23 GMT
So I’m assuming that the old lift access to the platforms at Highbury was at the opposite end to the current access (northern end)? I’d love to see some pics of the inside of the old station. I wonder if there is still some access from the old station to the platforms? No the lift shafts and spiral staircase emerge in the passages near what are now the base of the escalators - they can still be clearly identified, in fact both passageways involve walking right past them. As to whether there is still access, looking at the plans it appears the answer is no - the spiral staircase shaft is shown as having had the stairs removed. The two lift shafts now serve as a draught-relief shaft. It's possible one or more of these shafts may have some kind of ladder, but if so unlikely to be suitable for general use! |
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Post by superteacher on Apr 3, 2018 14:27:47 GMT
Looks like what is now the SB Vic. The Finsbury Park picture is the northern end of what is now the southbound Piccadilly line platform. The picture at Highbury is definitely now the southbound Victoria line (ex Northbound NCL). In view of North End’s reply, it appears that the photo of Highbury and Islington was (and still remains) of the southbound NCL platform as opposed to the northbound. |
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Post by jukes on Apr 3, 2018 15:54:35 GMT
Having taken another look I still think it is now the southbound Vic. However, its not a particularly clear photo so I could be wrong. As an aside, I have a picture buried somewhere in my collection of the southbound NCL platform being redecorated a few weeks before it was opened in 1976. I'll see if I can dig it out
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Post by superteacher on Apr 3, 2018 15:58:06 GMT
Having taken another look I still think it is now the southbound Vic. However, its not a particularly clear photo so I could be wrong. As an aside, I have a picture buried somewhere in my collection of the southbound NCL platform being redecorated a few weeks before it was opened in 1976. I'll see if I can dig it out If it is the southbound Vic, then the entrance is at the wrong end. The entrances to the platform were / are at the southern end of the platform. |
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
Posts: 1,275
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Post by roythebus on Jun 21, 2018 8:08:45 GMT
Was the NCL actually diverted at Highbury? If so, then there must have been some forethought put into it by making the running tunnels the bigger size!
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Post by jukes on Jun 21, 2018 9:13:40 GMT
Yes and Yes.
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Post by superteacher on Jun 21, 2018 9:35:36 GMT
Was the NCL actually diverted at Highbury? If so, then there must have been some forethought put into it by making the running tunnels the bigger size! Even in the mid 60s there was the aim to transfer the NCL to BR, so the diversion tunnels were made to the bigger dimensions. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jun 21, 2018 9:37:04 GMT
The Northbound NCL was diverted into a new tunnel at Hi&I so that the Victoria Line could use the existing station tunnel for cross-platform interchange. (Something similar was done at Finsbury Park and Euston) Whether it was simply easier to match the profile of the existing tunnels, or the plans to divert the GN electrics were sufficiently well advanced by then to add the future-proofing, I wouldn't know. But it was less than four years between the opening of the Victoria Line and the authorisation of the GN electrification scheme, so plans were probably well-advanced.
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
Posts: 1,275
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Post by roythebus on Jun 24, 2018 20:24:56 GMT
It makes a change to have forward thinking on anything in this country!
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