|
|
Post by scheduler on Sept 21, 2017 23:13:44 GMT
I took a Met train today that definitely had 8 cars, but it seemed to have the S7 seating layout, i.e. all side-ways seats and no forward backward facing pairs. It was really rather confusing, and I was most surprised by it. Does anyone know how this came to be?
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Sept 22, 2017 0:56:38 GMT
This will be the S7+1 about which there was recent discussion. Unfortunately I can't find the relevant thread at the moment.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 22, 2017 7:00:38 GMT
Initially three S7 trains were delivered directly to the MET as 8-cars, dubbed ‘S7+1’ to provide cover for the S8s to returning to Derby for engineering mods (round I).
An extra MET train was then required for the MLX Metropolitan Line Extension and as S8 production had finished an extra ordinary S7 (21567/68) was built and S7+1 21327/28 is to stay on the MET.
Then the decision was made to return all S Stock to Derby, rather than Ruislip, for ATC Automatic Train Control fitment and other mods. So S7+1 21323/24 is staying only until this work is completed.
S7+1 21319/20 has already had its additional car removed and placed into its correct formation and returned to the District/Circle/H&C as an S7.
The S7+1 trains running are unusual as they contain two 25xxx de-icer cars.
|
|
|
|
Post by norbitonflyer on Sept 22, 2017 7:05:38 GMT
Listed on the S7 deliveries thread www.districtdavesforum.co.uk/thread/19659/s7-stock-deliveries-listSeveral temporary S7+1 formations were used at various times to cover for S8s away for modifications, but there is also one permanent one. I believe this was because the Met's fleet was increased by one train in anticipation of the Watford Junction extension, but as this was decided after the production line for S8 seating had been closed down, the extra unit had to have an S7 type seating layout. For complicated reasons this S7+1 is not numerically the last unit. |
|
|
|
Post by whistlekiller2000 on Sept 22, 2017 9:32:04 GMT
There you have it! Two great minds speaking alike at exactly the same time!  |
|
|
|
Post by goldenarrow on Sept 22, 2017 14:43:49 GMT
Im not sure wether this is coincidental or not, but the S7+1's always seemed to have older CLD's. Since their time on the Met was subject to rolling stock availability, I guess it wasn't gauged as economical to replace the CLD's (Car Line Diagrams) dating from 2012 as the only thing that had changed was the removal of the Olympic pink sticker above Wembley.
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Sept 22, 2017 17:19:03 GMT
CLD - ? Line Diagram?
|
|
|
|
Post by goldenarrow on Sept 22, 2017 18:02:38 GMT
|
|
cso
Posts: 1,043 
|
Post by cso on Sept 22, 2017 21:09:43 GMT
Most of the S Stock on the Met Line I've been on have had out of date diagrams...
|
|
|
|
Post by goldenarrow on Sept 22, 2017 23:43:46 GMT
Most of the S Stock on the Met Line I've been on have had out of date diagrams... That's true, it's taken over a two years before Liverpool St got a TfL Rail sticker showing the interchange. But the S7+1's had distinctively faded/discoloured diagrams with TfL Rail and the Lea Valley additions to the London Overground still omitted from the central london map as of a few months back, safety stickers on the doors also differed only displaying the "items trapped in the doors" and not "mind the gap" ones beneath. |
|
|
|
Post by MoreToJack on Sept 23, 2017 8:44:07 GMT
Most of the S Stock on the Met Line I've been on have had out of date diagrams... That's true, it's taken over a two years before Liverpool St got a TfL Rail sticker showing the interchange. But the S7+1's had distinctively faded/discoloured diagrams with TfL Rail and the Lea Valley additions to the London Overground still omitted from the central london map as of a few months back, safety stickers on the doors also differed only displaying the "items trapped in the doors" and not "mind the gap" ones beneath. As cso states, this is true of most or the S8s - particularly the early ones - and numerous early S7s too. It's not indicative of anything and you're making a mountain out of a molehill. |
|
|
|
Post by spsmiler on Sept 23, 2017 16:20:57 GMT
Its a shame that there will not eventually be S8-1 trains (S8 minus one). The passengers would prefer it!
Ah well.
Too late now.
Simon
|
|
|
|
Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 23, 2017 16:29:08 GMT
Its a shame that there will not eventually be S8-1 trains (S8 minus one). The passengers would prefer it! Ah well. Too late now. Simon S8 trains 1 21001/02; 18 21035/36; 23 21045/46; 30 21059/60; 50 21099/100 were originally delivered to London as seven car (S8-1) for testing purposes. |
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Sept 23, 2017 17:34:07 GMT
Its a shame that there will not eventually be S8-1 trains (S8 minus one). The passengers would prefer it! Not all passengers. Short distance passengers in would prefer an S7 train they can board rather than an S8-1 they can't as standing space is not used as efficiently. |
|
|
|
Post by brooklynbound on Sept 23, 2017 19:37:21 GMT
But all passengers would like accurate maps or to use the Tfl term Car Line Diagrams. I do not understand why it is so difficult to ensure that the stock in service has accurate info on board. I quite recently saw an S7 that had maps showing no interchange with the Bakerloo at Paddington. That hasn't been true for a year.
|
|
|
|
Post by spsmiler on Sept 23, 2017 20:30:48 GMT
But all passengers would like accurate maps or to use the Tfl term Car Line Diagrams. I do not understand why it is so difficult to ensure that the stock in service has accurate info on board. I quite recently saw an S7 that had maps showing no interchange with the Bakerloo at Paddington. That hasn't been true for a year. There was a thread here some years ago which showed that TfL had planned a Car Line Diagram showing all the S7 services (District, Circle, Hammersmith & City) on the one map. Its a shame they dont use it, as the present solution is so very confusing for unsuspecting passengers. Simon |
|
|
|
Post by MoreToJack on Sept 23, 2017 23:04:47 GMT
But all passengers would like accurate maps or to use the Tfl term Car Line Diagrams. I do not understand why it is so difficult to ensure that the stock in service has accurate info on board. I quite recently saw an S7 that had maps showing no interchange with the Bakerloo at Paddington. That hasn't been true for a year. No permanent maps were produced without the Bakerloo interchange so it is simply that a sticker has been missed. When you consider the nature of the SSR, S7 railway this is not the end of the world - and it is much larger job than many here seem to believe. The vast majority of maps are accurate and, where they are not, they *do not* cause issues. Indeed, in the example referred to by goldenarrow (Olympic-dated maps) they actually offer *additional*, useful information such as local sporting venues. The often-cited example of missing TfL Rail at Liverpool Street is a non-issue - it's covered by the catch-all 'National Rail services', as much as TfL would like you all to believe otherwise - and, in most cases, the CIS screens and announcements *are* accurate (barring TfL Rail, again). What I will agree is problematic is the S7 line diagrams - customers frequently refer to the 'wrong' line and either can't find where they are or wrongly assume the train they are on will take them direct. As is life, though: there must always be compromises and what we have is probably the best possible combination of factors. Information provision on the Underground is still eons ahead of other provincial Metro operations. |
|
