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Post by jamesb on Aug 25, 2017 16:51:41 GMT
There is an epidemic of faulty trains at the moment - and it seems to be getting worse. From a passenger point of view, when the service is advertised as 'good' it often isn't good, with long gaps between trains or occasional waits at platforms 'for a defective train to be on the move ahead'.
Yesterday, for example, at Roding Valley (at around 10:30am ish) the indicator board kept changing from Woodford 6 mins to Woodford 7 mins and then back to 6 mins. In reality, it took about 15 minutes for the train to arrive. When it did arrive, we sat on the platform for another 15 minutes -initially 'to allow trains to pass the junction ahead of us' and eventually due to a defective train ahead 'which was on the move'.
Today, there are minor delays due to defective trains.
The control room staff appear to do a good job at keeping the service moving, as do the drivers.
The central line has reinvented its own version of good - it should be advertised as 'good for central line'!
It's frustrating when the line is advertised as 'good service' when it clearly isn't for some passengers, like me yesterday morning.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Aug 25, 2017 20:01:35 GMT
The 92s are suffering from the increase in off peak and weekend service introduced under WTT67 in 2013 and Night Tube with the additional problem of a shortage of drivers thanks to a large number of "one unders" in the last couple of months. Ironic that earlier in the year management insisted that we were overstaffed to justify the displacement of a number of drivers from the Central Line to the Bakerloo and District.
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Post by jamesb on Aug 26, 2017 13:20:04 GMT
The 92s are suffering from the increase in off peak and weekend service introduced under WTT67 in 2013 and Night Tube with the additional problem of a shortage of drivers thanks to a large number of "one unders" in the last couple of months. Ironic that earlier in the year management insisted that we were overstaffed to justify the displacement of a number of drivers from the Central Line to the Bakerloo and District. Makes sense. Seems that the management need a reality check! The gaps in service are more evident towards the extremities of the line, and early or late in the evening. The central line heavy overhall programme target completion date is mentioned as 1st August 2017 in the document linked below. It's staggering to think that £123 million pounds has been spend on this, yet the service seems to be getting worse and not better. content.tfl.gov.uk/rup-20150212-part-1-item10-central-line-overhaul.pdfThe heavy overhall programme seems separate to a programme to install a new AC traction package and new Data Transmission System (DTS*) - maybe this will improve reliability? *Date Transmission System - monitors train systems and provides information about train health. |
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Post by superteacher on Aug 27, 2017 9:46:24 GMT
The 92s are suffering from the increase in off peak and weekend service introduced under WTT67 in 2013 and Night Tube with the additional problem of a shortage of drivers thanks to a large number of "one unders" in the last couple of months. Ironic that earlier in the year management insisted that we were overstaffed to justify the displacement of a number of drivers from the Central Line to the Bakerloo and District. Years ago, rolling stock had a relatively easy life with the far less intensive off peak and weekend services. Even the peak periods were shorter in length. When the 1992 stock was new, 85 trains were available to work a 71 train peak service. Midday off peak was only 43 trains, and evenings less than that. Now, it's 67 trains in service until around 10pm, with up to 78 in each peak. The Saturday service even requires over 70 trains in service! When you couple this with the fact that the 92's were built on the cheap, you can see the problem. |
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Post by spsmiler on Aug 27, 2017 21:53:10 GMT
Maybe this explains why when I went to Ealing Broadway last week I had to wait 13 minutes for a train. (That was the time shown on the PID when I arrived at the station where my journey began).
I suppose that Crossrail will be the answer to many of the Central line's severe overcrowding woes, with new trains (eventually) helping too.
simon
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Post by will on Aug 27, 2017 23:15:30 GMT
Maybe this explains why when I went to Ealing Broadway last week I had to wait 13 minutes for a train. (That was the time shown on the PID when I arrived at the station where my journey began). I suppose that Crossrail will be the answer to many of the Central line's severe overcrowding woes, with new trains (eventually) helping too. simon When Crossrail launches will they reduce the Central service slightly to do more matience and run a sustainable service frequency unlike what is the situation today ? |
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Post by crusty54 on Aug 27, 2017 23:45:35 GMT
Maybe this explains why when I went to Ealing Broadway last week I had to wait 13 minutes for a train. (That was the time shown on the PID when I arrived at the station where my journey began). I suppose that Crossrail will be the answer to many of the Central line's severe overcrowding woes, with new trains (eventually) helping too. simon When Crossrail launches will they reduce the Central service slightly to do more matience and run a sustainable service frequency unlike what is the situation today ? As discussed in another thread, they are looking at running the Woodford-Hainault shuttle with 3 car trains to free up one train. Other reductions are being examined. |
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Post by MoreToJack on Aug 28, 2017 0:20:56 GMT
When Crossrail launches will they reduce the Central service slightly to do more matience and run a sustainable service frequency unlike what is the situation today ? As discussed in another thread, they are looking at running the Woodford-Hainault shuttle with 3 car trains to free up one train. Other reductions are being examined. Four car trains*. A number of test runs have operated to check the integrity of the signalling etc., and it sounds like this everything is progressing well. |
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Post by crusty54 on Aug 28, 2017 4:19:24 GMT
As discussed in another thread, they are looking at running the Woodford-Hainault shuttle with 3 car trains to free up one train. Other reductions are being examined. Four car trains*. A number of test runs have operated to check the integrity of the signalling etc., and it sounds like this everything is progressing well. Thanks for pointing out my mistake. |
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Post by jamesb on Aug 29, 2017 8:09:14 GMT
I wonder if the Woodford via Hainault loop allows some 'buffer' for the timetable which would be lost if a shuttle service was introduced?
A 20 minute service gives enough time for a late running Woodford via Hainault train to turn around at Woodford and depart for Hainault (and on to central London) 'on time'.
Even a train which isn't faulty seems to struggle at times, e.g. ATO in the rain, or motors cutting out when people lean on the doors. Yesterday, en route to the Notting Hill Carnival, the motors cut out 4 or 5 times departing every station. We subsequently kept stopping. The massive windows, almost flush with the door, combined with a packed carriage, combined with drunk people weren't a good combination. The driver couldn't be heard because of the noise.
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Post by metman on Aug 29, 2017 20:42:14 GMT
I assume that some of the decommissioned middle cabs will be reinstated now for the four car trains?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2017 12:09:27 GMT
I wonder if the Woodford via Hainault loop allows some 'buffer' for the timetable which would be lost if a shuttle service was introduced? A 20 minute service gives enough time for a late running Woodford via Hainault train to turn around at Woodford and depart for Hainault (and on to central London) 'on time'. Even a train which isn't faulty seems to struggle at times, e.g. ATO in the rain, or motors cutting out when people lean on the doors. Yesterday, en route to the Notting Hill Carnival, the motors cut out 4 or 5 times departing every station. We subsequently kept stopping. The massive windows, almost flush with the door, combined with a packed carriage, combined with drunk people weren't a good combination. The driver couldn't be heard because of the noise. The Motors cutting out when passengers lean against the doors is not unique to the Central Line, the Circle Line C stock used to do the same thing, if pressure on the doors is excessive, the motors dropped out, just like on the Central line - This is not a new problem - far from it. |
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Post by superteacher on Aug 30, 2017 12:14:45 GMT
I wonder if the Woodford via Hainault loop allows some 'buffer' for the timetable which would be lost if a shuttle service was introduced? A 20 minute service gives enough time for a late running Woodford via Hainault train to turn around at Woodford and depart for Hainault (and on to central London) 'on time'. Even a train which isn't faulty seems to struggle at times, e.g. ATO in the rain, or motors cutting out when people lean on the doors. Yesterday, en route to the Notting Hill Carnival, the motors cut out 4 or 5 times departing every station. We subsequently kept stopping. The massive windows, almost flush with the door, combined with a packed carriage, combined with drunk people weren't a good combination. The driver couldn't be heard because of the noise. The Motors cutting out when passengers lean against the doors is not unique to the Central Line, the Circle Line C stock used to do the same thing, if pressure on the doors is excessive, the motors dropped out, just like on the Central line - This is not a new problem - far from it. But it's far worse on the 1992 stock. I don't recall it being an issue on the C stock. I think the motors cutting out on those trains was because of some other reason. |
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Post by Chris M on Aug 30, 2017 12:50:58 GMT
I've also known it happen on the Jubilee line. Not as frequently as on the Central, but the 1992s are not unique
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2017 16:07:35 GMT
73TS seem to do it as I am forever hearing the driver telling people to avoid leaning on the doors.
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Post by stapler on Aug 30, 2017 16:38:59 GMT
So the good (??) folk of Chigwell are to have their train lengths reduced by 50% this year as well as their service reduced by ??50% last? And enforced changes at Hainault as well as at Woodford....
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Post by Chris M on Aug 30, 2017 17:20:21 GMT
The measure is being taken so that they (and the rest of the Central line) have a service at all.
As long as the train has enough capacity for its entire journey it doesn't really matter how long it is, and I would be very surprised if Hainalut-Woodfoord generated more than 4-cars worth of traffic and certainly not off-peak.
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Post by superteacher on Aug 30, 2017 17:35:09 GMT
The measure is being taken so that they (and the rest of the Central line) have a service at all. As long as the train has enough capacity for its entire journey it doesn't really matter how long it is, and I would be very surprised if Hainalut-Woodfoord generated more than 4-cars worth of traffic and certainly not off-peak. 1 car could cope off peak! |
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Post by cso on Aug 30, 2017 18:27:25 GMT
1 car could cope off peak! Might ve an issue with people falling out the back of the train 😀 On the subject of sudden stops - the other one I notice it on is the Bakerloo. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 0:50:16 GMT
I thought 2016 had the most one understand with in my opinion a high death record but in a seriousness after the traction replacement with maybe the motors too would the trains be more reliable?
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Post by drainrat on Sept 6, 2017 7:41:00 GMT
The 92s are suffering from the increase in off peak and weekend service introduced under WTT67 in 2013 and Night Tube with the additional problem of a shortage of drivers thanks to a large number of "one unders" in the last couple of months. Ironic that earlier in the year management insisted that we were overstaffed to justify the displacement of a number of drivers from the Central Line to the Bakerloo and District. Not forgetting the increase in service down drain which will further pressure a depot which is already at splitting point due to driver displacements yet all the while using the term 'staff shortages' to imply that staff can't be bothered to turn up for work. People always come to 5 when they add 2 & 2 🤔 |
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Post by drainrat on Sept 6, 2017 7:42:08 GMT
So the good (??) folk of Chigwell are to have their train lengths reduced by 50% this year as well as their service reduced by ??50% last? And enforced changes at Hainault as well as at Woodford.... Yep 👍🏽 Seems like a step back 3 decades |
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Post by drainrat on Sept 6, 2017 7:52:27 GMT
I wonder if the Woodford via Hainault loop allows some 'buffer' for the timetable which would be lost if a shuttle service was introduced? A 20 minute service gives enough time for a late running Woodford via Hainault train to turn around at Woodford and depart for Hainault (and on to central London) 'on time'. Even a train which isn't faulty seems to struggle at times, e.g. ATO in the rain, or motors cutting out when people lean on the doors. Yesterday, en route to the Notting Hill Carnival, the motors cut out 4 or 5 times departing every station. We subsequently kept stopping. The massive windows, almost flush with the door, combined with a packed carriage, combined with drunk people weren't a good combination. The driver couldn't be heard because of the noise. The Motors cutting out when passengers lean against the doors is not unique to the Central Line, the Circle Line C stock used to do the same thing, if pressure on the doors is excessive, the motors dropped out, just like on the Central line - This is not a new problem - far from it. The motors cut out, then there's a loss of pilot light, not vice versa. There was a mod carried out by Metronet around 2004 which they neglected to tell Central line management about at the time for fear the Central line would over ride the mod as it was linked to the door closing chimes. Basically, EU railway regs said the chimes had to ring 3 secs before the doors closed, however, LUL had a dispensation arguing that it would initially import a risk where there was none. Metronet were on a promise (see brown envelopes) so did it without asking LUL, as a result the 92s now suffers a jolt during times of high loading due to the mod and NOT passengers leaning on doors (though not discounting this too 😉) just we never suffered it before the mod, but we did after 🤔 |
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