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Post by melikepie on Nov 18, 2015 16:46:11 GMT
When the Moorgate services were part of London Underground, did they ever run at the weekend? Did they ever run at weekends regularly when part of Network Southeast? If so, when was it decided that they would be curtailed to an up to 10pm weekday service?
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Nov 18, 2015 16:53:32 GMT
When the Moorgate services were part of London Underground, did they ever run at the weekend? Did they ever run at weekends regularly when part of Network Southeast? If so, when was it decided that they would be curtailed to an up to 10pm weekday service? If I recall correctly the only station shut on that section in London Underground days was Essex Road on Saturdays and Sundays. This is when the line was curtailed to Drayton Park-Moorgate. For the rest of it, I'm sure somebody else will be along to fill you in properly. |
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Post by theblackferret on Nov 18, 2015 18:47:49 GMT
When the Moorgate services were part of London Underground, did they ever run at the weekend? Did they ever run at weekends regularly when part of Network Southeast? If so, when was it decided that they would be curtailed to an up to 10pm weekday service? If I recall correctly the only station shut on that section in London Underground days was Essex Road on Saturdays and Sundays. This is when the line was curtailed to Drayton Park-Moorgate. For the rest of it, I'm sure somebody else will be along to fill you in properly. According to wiki The station was, from the early 1960s, closed on Sundays. In the 1970s it was also closed on Saturdays.Tube-Map history I've got shows that being the case in 1963/4, but nothing indicated on the map or the stations list at all in 1970, except the general note in red at the bottom of the station list-'certain stations are closed at the weekend'. But, as I regularly journeyed through West Brompton that year, which was quite categorically closed on a Saturday, I'd say Essex Road probably was by then. Then, in 1974, yes Essex Road closed all weekend, as shown on map & stations index. It transferred to BR in 1975 & then 1988 Network Rail map goes back to the misinformation line 'Certain stations are closed at weekends'!!! Sorry I can't help more, but suspect weekend services went after the transfer to BR. EDIT Had a look again at the 1986 Tube Map-shows the line still & by now Drayton Park has also got a star on it as closed on Sundays. And on 1995-whole line shown as Mondays to Fridays only. So looks like weekend closing happened between 1987-1994 & not during Tube tenure. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2015 22:58:31 GMT
Essex Road closed on Sundays from 05/10/1958
Essex Road closed on Saturdays from 31/01/1970
Essex Road reopened on Saturdays and Sundays from 13/11/1976 and 14/11/1976 respectively
12/5/86 - Sunday BR service to Moorgate withdrawn.
11/5/87 - Saturday BR service to Moorgate withdrawn
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Post by melikepie on Nov 19, 2015 3:12:30 GMT
Sorry for posting at this time. Thanks. Were they withdrawn due to low passenger numbers do you know? And why was 10pm decided ?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2015 8:51:19 GMT
I guess the lack of patronage led to reduced operating hours Monday to Friday from 16/5/88. c.06.20 to c.21.00.
MF evening service extended until c.21.50 from 12/6/05. The reason stated for this was 'increase' in mid-evening traffic in the City.
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Post by John Tuthill on Nov 19, 2015 11:06:26 GMT
Anyone who is interested in a short history of the line, should look out for "The Big Tube" a short history by J. Graeme Bruce. No longer in print, but might show up at an open day or bus fair, or amazon. It was published by London transport in 1976, and at the time cost me the princely sum of £1:00! A good selection of maps and photos. ISBN 0 85329 071 7 Hope this helps.
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Post by theblackferret on Nov 19, 2015 11:42:50 GMT
Anyone who is interested in a short history of the line, should look out for "The Big Tube" a short history by J. Graeme Bruce. No longer in print, but might show up at an open day or bus fair, or amazon. It was published by London transport in 1976, and at the time cost me the princely sum of £1:00! A good selection of maps and photos. ISBN 0 85329 071 7 Hope this helps. Thanks-I need a new bedtime railway book pretty shortly. And----------Available on Amazon-£2.65 + £2.80 postage;I've just ordered one, there are several others left. |
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Post by John Tuthill on Nov 19, 2015 12:50:09 GMT
Anyone who is interested in a short history of the line, should look out for "The Big Tube" a short history by J. Graeme Bruce. No longer in print, but might show up at an open day or bus fair, or amazon. It was published by London transport in 1976, and at the time cost me the princely sum of £1:00! A good selection of maps and photos. ISBN 0 85329 071 7 Hope this helps. Thanks-I need a new bedtime railway book pretty shortly. And----------Available on Amazon-£2.65 + £2.80 postage;I've just ordered one, there are several others left. That was quick, let us all know what you think of it  |
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rincew1nd
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Junior Under-wizzard of quiz
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Post by rincew1nd on Nov 19, 2015 19:14:54 GMT
Sorry for posting at this time. Thanks. Were they withdrawn due to low passenger numbers do you know? And why was 10pm decided?Part of me wonders if it's linked to the shift patterns of the drivers? A kind of operationally convenient time rather than anything else. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2015 21:50:57 GMT
Ah, but the same trains then go into King's Cross. Just a thought .....
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Post by superteacher on Nov 19, 2015 22:18:28 GMT
Next month, the Northern City will see the return of a regular 7 day service for the first time in nearly 30 years.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Nov 19, 2015 23:36:42 GMT
Sorry for posting at this time. Thanks. Were they withdrawn due to low passenger numbers do you know? And why was 10pm decided?Part of me wonders if it's linked to the shift patterns of the drivers? A kind of operationally convenient time rather than anything else. More likely the shift patterns of the station staff, as the trains still ran (into Kings Cross) after 10pm |
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Post by theblackferret on Nov 20, 2015 20:35:54 GMT
Thanks-I need a new bedtime railway book pretty shortly. And----------Available on Amazon-£2.65 + £2.80 postage;I've just ordered one, there are several others left. That was quick, let us all know what you think of it Arrived today-review in a trice, not yet read it fully, but just skimmed to make a review. Vide the weekend services, I believe Saturday morning working began to diminish amongst white & blue-collar workers from around 1960, and by 1964, SR had started to reflect this in the withdrawal of many commuter trains into London on Saturday mornings. This may've been less of a factor on GNCR, but surely had some part to play in reduced services. As for the Big Tube, it's only 56 pages, but packs a lot in, somewhat superficial detail compared to, say, Capital Transport's The Aldwych Branch, which is exactly twice the length of Big Tube, but it still covers a lot of ground across many areas. Only thing I would have liked would be a couple of timetables reproduced, although I understand this became a Middleton Press speciality & they didn't start operations until 1985/6. It does tell you the Act authorising was 1892, construction began 1898, open to the public 1904. And that the Lothbury extension-Act authorising 1902, work started & stopped ?, Act authorising abandonment thereof 1909. You know what the crayonista in me wants to suggest, but I shan't. Promise!  Anyway-book well worth the £6.50 inc P & P. |
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Post by John Tuthill on Nov 20, 2015 21:38:18 GMT
That was quick, let us all know what you think of it Arrived today-review in a trice, not yet read it fully, but just skimmed to make a review. Vide the weekend services, I believe Saturday morning working began to diminish amongst white & blue-collar workers from around 1960, and by 1964, SR had started to reflect this in the withdrawal of many commuter trains into London on Saturday mornings. This may've been less of a factor on GNCR, but surely had some part to play in reduced services. As for the Big Tube, it's only 56 pages, but packs a lot in, somewhat superficial detail compared to, say, Capital Transport's The Aldwych Branch, which is exactly twice the length of Big Tube, but it still covers a lot of ground across many areas. Only thing I would have liked would be a couple of timetables reproduced, although I understand this became a Middleton Press speciality & they didn't start operations until 1985/6. It does tell you the Act authorising was 1892, construction began 1898, open to the public 1904. And that the Lothbury extension-Act authorising 1902, work started & stopped ?, Act authorising abandonment thereof 1909. You know what the crayonista in me wants to suggest, but I shan't. Promise! Anyway-book well worth the £6.50 inc P & P. Glad you like it. It would be interesting if Capital Transport did a 'revision' seeing as how "From Steam to Silver" was originally a LT publication |
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Post by spsmiler on Nov 20, 2015 21:45:52 GMT
such a shame the Lothbury extension did not open... the highly unusual situation of a train being in two stations at the same time (one end Lothbury, other end, Moorgate) would have made for an excellent general knowledge quiz topic.
Simon
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Post by theblackferret on Nov 20, 2015 22:14:11 GMT
John TuthillIntriguingly, Middleton Press don't have a volume on it, either, which is a major surprise; just checked their updated stations list & no, still not on there. Looks like one of those railway lines, and an ex-Tube Map one, too, that's fallen down the back of the sofa, though quite how over 3 miles of railway tracks fall out of someone's pocket into that position defied the laws of Physics, Jim! spsmilerBelieve the Greathead Shield from 1903/4(?)is still down there, so maybe we need to get up a grid square map of the underground area around there & play spot the shield-£1 a square, proceeds to charity!
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Post by spsmiler on Nov 20, 2015 22:26:15 GMT
spsmilerBelieve the Greathead Shield from 1903/4(?)is still down there, so maybe we need to get up a grid square map of the underground area around there & play spot the shield-£1 a square, proceeds to charity! If *is* still there then a short extension to lengthen the dead-end over-run and allow faster arriving train entries could actually benefit the service. As money is tight I would not expect anything more than this. (Yes I would like to see the Lothbury extension completed, but accept that realistically it is not going to happen). Simon |
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Post by abe on Nov 23, 2015 13:44:02 GMT
The shield is still in place (minus the hydraulic systems). There should be a good photo of it in one of Capital Transport's books out next year.
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Post by John Tuthill on Nov 23, 2015 14:08:36 GMT
The shield is still in place (minus the hydraulic systems). There should be a good photo of it in one of Capital Transport's books out next year. What is the subject do you know? |
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Post by abe on Nov 23, 2015 19:09:41 GMT
Constructing the Underground - a detailed history of the civil engineering.
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Post by John Tuthill on Nov 23, 2015 19:49:20 GMT
Constructing the Underground - a detailed history of the civil engineering. Will be interested to see what additional information the author has found, after all we know about Brunel's shield on the Rotherhithe/Wapping section, Greathead's shield, cast iron and concrete tunnel sections, freezing the ground at Vauxhall, I am very curious  |
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roythebus
Pleased to say the restoration of BEA coach MLL738 is as complete as it can be, now restoring MLL721
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Post by roythebus on Feb 15, 2016 11:22:01 GMT
From what I remember in my days as a secondman at Kings Cross there never was a Sunday service when BR re-opened the line. Services that would use Moorgate went into KX instead.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2016 20:59:45 GMT
Essex Road closed on Sundays from 05/10/1958 Essex Road closed on Saturdays from 31/01/1970 Essex Road reopened on Saturdays and Sundays from 13/11/1976 and 14/11/1976 respectively 12/5/86 - Sunday BR service to Moorgate withdrawn. 11/5/87 - Saturday BR service to Moorgate withdrawn |
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