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Post by melikepie on Nov 17, 2015 10:55:53 GMT
Evening services to close and weekend services to Moorgate (including Drayton Park and Essex Road) have been confirmed for the December 13th timetable change with Great Northern/GTR. Also worth noting is that unlike weekdays, Drayton Park will be closed 2 hours before matches as well to prevent overcrowding at the station. www.thameslinkrailway.com/your-journey/timetables/dec-2015-gn |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2015 4:28:32 GMT
Sadly the weekend service remains a pathetic (by LSE standards) two trains an hour on both the Welwyn Garden City and Hertford North routes. Connections at Finsbury Park between trains to/from Kings Cross and those to/from Moorgate are virtually non-existent too, as hardly any meet the 5 minute minimum connection time. Taking a typical hour on a Saturday: - Southbound:
- xx 09 : Welwyn Garden City - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 13 : Cambridge - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
- xx 24 : Hertford North - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 25 : Cambridge - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
- xx 39 : Welwyn Garden City - Moorgate (Platform 2)
- xx 43 : Peterborough - Kings Cross (Platform 2)
- xx 54 : Stevenage - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 55 : Peterborough - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
[li] Northbound:[/li] - xx 58: Kings Cross - Cambridge (Platform 7)
- xx 02: Moorgate - Stevenage (Platform 8)
- xx 11: Kings Cross - Cambridge (Platform 7)
- xx 17: Moorgate - Welwyn Garden City (Platform 8)
- xx 28: Kings Cross - Peterborough (Platform 7)
- xx 32: Moorgate - Hertford North (Platform 8)
- xx 41: Kings Cross - Peterborough (Platform 7)
- xx 47: Moorgate - Hertford North (Platform 8)
[/ul] For those who are unfamiliar with the layout at Finsbury Park, it comprises four island platforms serving six tracks: Platforms 1 & 2, 3 & 4, 5 & 6 and 7 & 8, with 2/3 and 6/7 being opposite sides of the same track (like 3/3A for the Westbound Central Line at Stratford). Whilst there is the option of a cross-platform change to the Victoria Line at Highbury & Islington, there are people for whom that is not a feasible option, such as my Grandmother, who basically has a phobia when it comes to the tube. There's also a significant increase in interchange times involved as well, particularly if wanting to catch a train from St Pancras, as the tube ticket hall at King's Cross St. Pancras is basically under the forecourt of Kings Cross, whereas going from the suburban train shed (Platforms 9 to 11) to St Pancras is simply a case of crossing Pancras Road. Naturally, the GTR spin on this is that it's the best thing since sliced bread and only a handful of people will be inconvenienced... |
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Post by crusty54 on Nov 25, 2015 5:22:10 GMT
Sadly the weekend service remains a pathetic (by LSE standards) two trains an hour on both the Welwyn Garden City and Hertford North routes. Connections at Finsbury Park between trains to/from Kings Cross and those to/from Moorgate are virtually non-existent too, as hardly any meet the 5 minute minimum connection time. Taking a typical hour on a Saturday: - Southbound:
- xx 09 : Welwyn Garden City - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 13 : Cambridge - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
- xx 24 : Hertford North - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 25 : Cambridge - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
- xx 39 : Welwyn Garden City - Moorgate (Platform 2)
- xx 43 : Peterborough - Kings Cross (Platform 2)
- xx 54 : Stevenage - Moorgate (Platform 1)
- xx 55 : Peterborough - Kings Cross (Platform 4)
[li] Northbound:[/li] - xx 58: Kings Cross - Cambridge (Platform 7)
- xx 02: Moorgate - Stevenage (Platform 8)
- xx 11: Kings Cross - Cambridge (Platform 7)
- xx 17: Moorgate - Welwyn Garden City (Platform 8)
- xx 28: Kings Cross - Peterborough (Platform 7)
- xx 32: Moorgate - Hertford North (Platform 8)
- xx 41: Kings Cross - Peterborough (Platform 7)
- xx 47: Moorgate - Hertford North (Platform 8)
[/ul] For those who are unfamiliar with the layout at Finsbury Park, it comprises four island platforms serving six tracks: Platforms 1 & 2, 3 & 4, 5 & 6 and 7 & 8, with 2/3 and 6/7 being opposite sides of the same track (like 3/3A for the Westbound Central Line at Stratford). Whilst there is the option of a cross-platform change to the Victoria Line at Highbury & Islington, there are people for whom that is not a feasible option, such as my Grandmother, who basically has a phobia when it comes to the tube. There's also a significant increase in interchange times involved as well, particularly if wanting to catch a train from St Pancras, as the tube ticket hall at King's Cross St. Pancras is basically under the forecourt of Kings Cross, whereas going from the suburban train shed (Platforms 9 to 11) to St Pancras is simply a case of crossing Pancras Road. Naturally, the GTR spin on this is that it's the best thing since sliced bread and only a handful of people will be inconvenienced...[/quote] think you've forgotten the new northern ticket hall at King's Cross. Direct access to the same area from the Tube. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Nov 25, 2015 8:15:15 GMT
Sadly the weekend service remains a pathetic (by LSE standards) two trains an hour on both the Welwyn Garden City and Hertford North routes. ... How the other half lives! If you think two trains an hour on a Sunday is pathetic, what would you call the 1tph many lines get south of the river? |
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Post by melikepie on Nov 25, 2015 10:36:43 GMT
Well, it apparently will all change in 3 years time. Btw, it is 1tph north of Hertford 7 days a week
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Post by norbitonflyer on Nov 25, 2015 11:04:57 GMT
Well, it apparently will all change in 3 years time. Not in SW London. (and Hertford-Stevenage is not really London, is it?) |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 10:54:48 GMT
When it comes to SOUTHBOUND connections, passengers already aboard a train heading to Moorgate who desire to go to King's Cross would surely either
a) alight at Finsbury Park and use the spiral staircase to access the Victoria Line or
b) alight at Highbury & Islington and use the cross-platform connection to the Victoria Line
I know of no sensible person who would alight at Finsbury Park and then wait for a National Rail train into Kings Cross ! The frequency of trains on the Victoria Line is much greater, and it can be extremely frustrating if you change to a NR service at Finsbury Park, only to have that service held at signals outside the last tunnel before Kings Cross, awaiting a path into a vacant platform
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Post by norbitonflyer on Nov 26, 2015 11:19:37 GMT
If a KX train is there, or imminent, that must be the quickest way of getting to Kings Cross itself (and through the Core once that comes into being). The alternatives all require a subterranean excursion at either Finsbury park or Kings Cross, which would cancel out any delay caused by waiting for signals at Belle Isle.
Of course if your destination is elsewhere on the Victoria Line, changing at H&I is the obvious thing to do.
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Nov 26, 2015 14:20:47 GMT
When it comes to SOUTHBOUND connections, passengers already aboard a train heading to Moorgate who desire to go to King's Cross would surely either a) alight at Finsbury Park and use the spiral staircase to access the Victoria Line or b) alight at Highbury & Islington and use the cross-platform connection to the Victoria Line I know of no sensible person who would alight at Finsbury Park and then wait for a National Rail train into Kings Cross ! The frequency of trains on the Victoria Line is much greater, and it can be extremely frustrating if you change to a NR service at Finsbury Park, only to have that service held at signals outside the last tunnel before Kings Cross, awaiting a path into a vacant platform It's surprising how many people *do* board mainline trains at Finsbury Park for the short journey to King's Cross. Being cynical I always assumed it was so they didn't have to pay, however nowadays both Finsbury Park and King's Cross have gatelines (albeit frequently left open) so perhaps this isn't the reason. Definitely quicker to take the Victoria Line, especially changing at Highbury off a Moorgate train, so I don't really understand why people use the mainline, but they do. As far as I know tickets are inter-available. |
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
Posts: 1,769
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Post by North End on Nov 26, 2015 14:25:55 GMT
Sadly the weekend service remains a pathetic (by LSE standards) two trains an hour on both the Welwyn Garden City and Hertford North routes. ... How the other half lives! If you think two trains an hour on a Sunday is pathetic, what would you call the 1tph many lines get south of the river? The WGC trains in particular are often very lightly loaded off-peak. I agree the Hertford line could possibly benefit from more trains at certain times, but probably only inwards from Gordon Hill. (What the Hertford line could really benefit from is some limited-stop trains outside peak times, but I can't see this happening, again because the demand doesn't seem to be there). |
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Post by melikepie on Nov 26, 2015 16:21:36 GMT
In regards to Finsbury Park, cross platform interchange without the really long walk at Kings Cross back to the main line although this is only for some. Coming north from Kings Cross and getting off at Finsbury Park makes enough sense without explanation.
HLL semi-fasts have actually been considered in the relatively recent Herts Rail Consultation and so we still need to await the results. And I disagree that it should be limited to Gordon Hill south.
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Post by rail2210 on Nov 26, 2015 16:26:02 GMT
A few weeks ago on a Saturday, there were half-hourly Great Northern services to Gordon Hill from London King's Cross, stopping at Finsbury Park, Alexandra Palace then fast to Gordon Hill. I'm guessing it was related to the fireworks at Alexandra Palace but still, it was strange speeding past the stations on the Hertford Loop.
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Post by melikepie on Nov 26, 2015 16:54:23 GMT
The current peak semi-fasts from Hertford North call at Cuffley, Gordon Hill, Enfield Chase, Winchmore Hill, Palmers Green, Alexandra Palace (sometimes) and Finsbury Park
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Post by rail2210 on Nov 26, 2015 17:00:38 GMT
The current peak semi-fasts from Hertford North call at Cuffley, Gordon Hill, Enfield Chase, Winchmore Hill, Palmers Green, Alexandra Palace (sometimes) and Finsbury Park However, I don't think that any potential off-peak semi-fast services could be made any faster than that, as those stations, mainly Enfield Chase and south of that, are the ones probably with the highest amount of passengers boarding/alighting. |
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Post by melikepie on Nov 26, 2015 18:34:02 GMT
Cuffley and Hertford North still get bustier than surrounding stations
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Post by superteacher on Dec 22, 2015 20:53:49 GMT
Has anybody used the service in the evening or at weekends? If so, what are the loadings like?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2015 9:24:58 GMT
Haven't used the service in the evenings as it's not in my neck of the woods. However, there have been many cancellations and gaps in the service because of driver shortage according to their website and confirmed on their live departures boards, even including yesterday evening On the first Sunday there was but an hourly service Moorgate - Welwyn and nothing on the Hertford branch with only a part replacement bus service on that day.
However, this morning, all seems to be well - we'll have to see how it goes later. Watching with interest.
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Post by snoggle on Dec 23, 2015 11:49:50 GMT
Has anybody used the service in the evening or at weekends? If so, what are the loadings like? Nope and I did consider using it last weekend but the service has been so poor that it simply wasn't worth the risk. If TSGN can demonstrate they can run the service reliably then I may well give it a go. |
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Post by melikepie on Jan 6, 2016 12:30:42 GMT
Having used the service on Sunday gone, the amount of people on the train was somewhere between peak and off-peak loading. But that may be simply because of the usual waiting for half an hour for the appropriate train just shifted to different stations. Probably more journeys are needed before deciding whether it is a resounding success. It was crowded but quiet and creeepy (as usual) waiting at Highbury for the train.
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