Moorgate Disaster

Thank you for the link.

I'm very unconvinced too, since it was mentioned that his brain was too badly damaged to be analysed.

I actually have a copy of that book, and it's a very interesting read.

Chris is right about the futility of speculating, but for me the most compelling argument AGAINST suicide is the fact that Driver Newson didn't raise his hands to protect his face. Even if suicide was his intention, that would have been an instinctive move.

I really feel for Lawrence Marks losing his father in the crash , but his view of the disaster only takes account of evidence in favour of suicide, and very flimsy evidence at that.

I think we have to resign ourselves to the fact that we will never know what really happened that day.

There is also some quite disturbing tripe on other forums about this. We can do without it here.

There's never been a shred of new evidence produced, simply speculation of one sort or another based on guesswork or worse.

And what's worse than bad science is guess science, making the 'facts' fit your theory.

As a good example, there was a fascinating documentary on Horizon some years ago, which apparently suggested sedimentary evidence proved a Tsunami hit the area of the Severn Estuary in January 1607. It was several years later that thorough examination of church records etc on the EAST coast showed equally devastating floods there the next day, and no tsunami could have gone right round our coast having made its first landfall in such devastating fashion on the opposite coast.

The clear evidence of a storm surge similar to 1953 in records of the time continue to be overlooked by the conspiracy theorists!

My view is that it's reasonable to debate the possibilities, we will never fully satisfy the curiousity into knowing what happened. However I don't agree with claiming that something is fact without being able to provide proper supporting evidence, as the RAIL letter seems to do.

It's a subject which does get discussed at work from time to time, there are still a handful of staff on the Underground who were around at the time. I know one who actually went down the overrun tunnel in the aftermath. The only real consensus is that no one can fully explain what happened based on the evidence available, every theory put forward contains 'buts'.

One aspect which was recently pointed out to me, the terminal protection measures introduced were, I believe, intended to mitigate against the possibility of a deliberate act. However the main appartus in providing protection was the tripcock, a piece of equipment that can be easily isolated by a driver. Modern rolling stocks enforce slow-speed running with the tripcock isolated, I am open to correction on this as I have never worked with the stock in question, however I have a feeling there remains at least one stock on the Underground where this does not apply.

This is a link to the Railway Inspector's report on it:

moorgate

It's noticeable that the brain state theory originates from the inquest and that one of the two theories propounded there, would, had it been the case, have left no visible trace even if the driver had somehow been undamaged in death.

And also note the Inspector himself tried an experiment to see if they could distinguish from Moorgate's platform, the face/eyes of a capped driver in a compartment that was not lit, as was proven to be the case at Moorgate. So that also casts doubt on the reliability of eyewitnesses saving he was sitting staring into space.

I don't wish to add to speculation with this link, but it may illustrate that much of the speculation, however well-intended, just does not marry with the evidence.

I don't subscribe to the theory of losing concentration. Our very own Piers Connor has mentioned that he may have done this, but I believe that the rough ride over the crossover and hitting the sand drag would have jolted him enough to bring him to his senses. In the latter case, it would have been too late to prevent the crash, but enough time to move the controls and raise his hands to protect his face; his hands were found to be holding the controls at the moment of impact.

It's a very eerie mystery which, in my mind, contributes to the eerie feel of the line, even to this day.

I've recently finished reading the paperback book "End of the Line - The Moorgate Disaster" by Richard M Jones (2015-Lodge Books ISBN 9781326211417) £9.99
and the book contains a photo and reference to a 'MOORGATE' destination plate recovered from the disaster scene by a Tony Wallis of the City of London Police photography department.
Believed to be from the front of ill fated train 272 this is on display at the City of London Police Museum ( cityoflondon.police.uk/museum) which is located within the Guildhall Library, Aldenmanbury EC2V 7HH open Monday to Saturday, a gallery type museum with free admission.
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I'll post a pic later, Are forum members aware of any other parts of the train that exist on display anywhere ??

<<Threads merged.>>

I raised some points about this matter a couple of years ago on this very forum following a news item on BBC Radio, and the thread was quickly locked by the admin of the time as there were still a number of LT staff on here who attended the scene and it was mentioned that further speculation would not be allowed on here.

I worked on that line when it was being rebuilt by BR, and I later drove on the Waterloo and City Line in BR days, and yes, it's possible to go into auto pilot and momentarily lose concentration, but something usually happens which jolts you back into the real world.