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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 14:36:15 GMT
This is a fun question really as I have always been curious....but would love to know
Say for instance the museum wanted to (for whatever reason ) take the 1938 tube stock on tour in America...like the New York Subway and have the train running on it....would it be possible?
Would it have to have the bogies changed? Obviously I think it would need the signalling equipment changed... but the loading gauge would be fine as the tube trains are smaller
Lastly would the train's wheels fit on the track?
Cheers : )
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Post by whistlekiller2000 on Mar 4, 2015 14:49:58 GMT
This is a fun question really as I have always been curious....but would love to know Say for instance the museum wanted to (for whatever reason ) take the 1938 tube stock on tour in America...like the New York Subway and have the train running on it....would it be possible? Would it have to have the bogies changed? Obviously I think it would need the signalling equipment changed... but the loading gauge would be fine as the tube trains are smaller Lastly would the train's wheels fit on the track? Cheers : ) Both systems use the standard gauge of 4 ft 8 1?2 in (1,435 mm) so the wheels would fit. |
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Post by domh245 on Mar 4, 2015 16:47:01 GMT
The train would physically sit on the rails, yes. However, other than that, it is a whole different kettle of fish! The train would need to be towed as the NY subway uses a 3rd rail system (side contact I think?) like the DLR that would necessitate new current collection shoes. The signalling would have to be changed (unless you operate it under their version of degraded working - ie walking speed and ready to stop at any obstruction). The loading gauge should be fine as the body is considerably smaller than the NY subway, but it may be the case that the body would impact with the tunnel or platform. TBH, if the 38TS went to New York, it would only ever be on a display track.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Mar 4, 2015 17:52:23 GMT
The train would need to be towed as the NY subway uses a 3rd rail system (side contact I think?) like the DLR that would necessitate new current collection shoes. New York uses top-contact 3rd rail, although is placed further away and higher than standard LU practice. Although the width of the cars are similar (on the IRT Division) boarding would be a problem as NY platforms are at 1.15m whereas the '38 Stock floor is at 700mm. |
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Post by phillw48 on Mar 4, 2015 18:00:25 GMT
It should fit comfortably, as the New York subway system can take wider stock than the London sub surface stock. As we know the 1938 stock can be adapted to the third rail system and if necessary the shoebeams could easily be replaced. The only thing that could cause difficulties would be the line voltage. The train would probably use the 'Express' lines anyway so clearance should not be a problem.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 18:48:22 GMT
Thanks for the replies ...interesting to know this
Would be great if this did happen, lol...with any stock
What do you all think the New Yorkers reaction would be if they saw the little red 38 stock pull in (and if they were actually let on, ha ha )?
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Post by MoreToJack on Mar 4, 2015 22:13:54 GMT
The track gauge may be the same but the rail/wheel profiles could also be different - I'm not too au fait on these for either LUL or MTA, but I know in the tramway world they differ vastly from town to town, let alone country to country!
A '38 stock in NYC though... now that would be a sight worth seeing...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 22:48:30 GMT
The track gauge may be the same but the rail/wheel profiles could also be different - I'm not too au fait on these for either LUL or MTA, but I know in the tramway world they differ vastly from town to town, let alone country to country! A '38 stock in NYC though... now that would be a sight worth seeing... It's what the New Yorkers would think that intrigues me...ha ha... especially if they were allowed in for a ride Would they think it looks weird? .....a lot more comfy than what they're used to? Nice livery? Old looking?...... I do know that the camera phones would be out, lol Shame it couldn't just run on the track like that though....as they did have main line British Rail trains tour America before I just read from someone on another site.... back in the 1920's or something? |
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Post by domh245 on Mar 4, 2015 22:59:28 GMT
They'd probably think something along the lines of "Gee, those London-folk sure are short". If they were allowed in to sit on the padded, transverse seating, it'd probably cement their idea that we all wear top hats, monocles, have tea with the queen every tuesday afternoon, and speak as if we all were raised in Buckingham Palace.
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Post by John Tuthill on Mar 4, 2015 23:55:31 GMT
The track gauge may be the same but the rail/wheel profiles could also be different - I'm not too au fait on these for either LUL or MTA, but I know in the tramway world they differ vastly from town to town, let alone country to country! A '38 stock in NYC though... now that would be a sight worth seeing... It's what the New Yorkers would think that intrigues me...ha ha... especially if they were allowed in for a ride Would they think it looks weird? .....a lot more comfy than what they're used to? Nice livery? Old looking?...... I do know that the camera phones would be out, lol Shame it couldn't just run on the track like that though....as they did have main line British Rail trains tour America before I just read from someone on another site.... back in the 1920's or something? KGV of the GWR ran on their lines, hence the bell on the front of the engine. Alan Pegler when he owned the Flying Scotsman ran coast to coast, but lost money on it. Both the 'Royal Scot' and the streamlined Stanier 'Coronation' were out there. Then the reciprocal in the last war were the 'USA Class' the 0-6-0 shunters. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 18:55:09 GMT
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Post by domh245 on Mar 5, 2015 20:53:55 GMT
You could make the argument that american subway trains have been running around the underground since the District Line A Stock
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 20:56:28 GMT
You could make the argument that american subway trains have been running around the underground since the District Line A Stock How? |
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Post by domh245 on Mar 5, 2015 21:07:14 GMT
Ooops, bit of a typo in my previous post, it should of course be the district railway, not the district line! The original A stock were to an American design because of Charles Yerke's (an American!) input. Indeed quite a few aspects of the tube are down to american influence, such as the tripcock system, 630V DC electrification, and I think there are some others, but I'm not really a Historian!  |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 5, 2015 22:45:49 GMT
quite a few aspects of the tube are down to american influence, such as the tripcock system, 630V DC electrification, and I think there are some others, What about terminology? - trucks not bogies, cars not carriages, motormen not drivers |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2015 22:53:20 GMT
Remember the first Bakerloo Line trains were built in the USA!
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Post by norbitonflyer on Mar 5, 2015 23:33:49 GMT
Remember the first Bakerloo Line trains were built in the USA! and the original Hampstead Tube gate stock. |
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Post by phillw48 on Mar 6, 2015 11:28:19 GMT
The NY subway car at Quainton has near identical controls to 'Q' stock. Someone once told me that 'Q' stock trucks would fit it as well.
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