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Post by longhedge on Jul 20, 2014 7:46:49 GMT
I understand the existing overrun tunnels as Elephant & Castle were constructed in 1940 and the old original tunnels - under New Kent Road were closed. Are they still visible or , as is more probable, completely sealed off.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Jul 21, 2014 16:20:22 GMT
No, they're not visible. I spent a few nights looking down there when I worked on the Bakerloo.
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North End
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Post by North End on Jul 21, 2014 16:37:19 GMT
No, they're not visible. I spent a few nights looking down there when I worked on the Bakerloo. I concur with this - when I did a walk down there earlier this year, we did a ring-by-ring survey of the (present) southbound siding, and there's definitely nothing there at all. Although their alignment is shown on some plans, other drawings indicate they are filled with weak concrete. So unless there's some other means of access, which I strongly doubt, it appears they are backfilled. Which in itself is unusual, as generally most abandoned tunnels tend to be left empty. I would suggest the fact that being originally fairly short, and the current siding access and crossover consuming part of their length, it was easier to backfill the entire sidings and then construct the new tunnels through the backfill. (Unless anyone knows different!). |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2014 18:42:01 GMT
What i would give for a walk and look around the undergrounds tunnels, i don't think I'd ever get bored
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Post by longhedge on Jul 21, 2014 19:11:06 GMT
Tom and North End Thanks for replying. There has been a lot of discussion on `London Reconnections` about Bakerloo line extensions, and the original tunnels were mentioned as a possible route to the Old Kent Road.
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North End
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Post by North End on Jul 22, 2014 8:41:03 GMT
What i would give for a walk and look around the undergrounds tunnels, i don't think I'd ever get bored Indeed, no matter how many times I've walked it, Stockwell to London Bridge on the Northern Line never ceases to interest. Stockwell disused station and C&SLR sidings, the two temporary crossover tunnels at Portland Place and South Island Place, the vent shaft at Oval which was originally built to be part of the abortive deep shelter, Kennington junctions, the Kennington floodgates, Elephant & Castle disused siding tunnel and the short disused section of running tunnel which was abandoned in the middle of the enlargment works, the site of the Newington Causeway tunnel collapse of 1923, Borough Junctions, the former JLE workings at Redcross Way, and finally the disused C&SLR tunnels to King William Street! |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Jul 22, 2014 11:51:50 GMT
Given the popularity of the Thames Tunnel walks, I'm surprised that TfL have never offered walks through other tunnels when circumstances permit.
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Jul 22, 2014 12:35:30 GMT
Given the popularity of the Thames Tunnel walks, I'm surprised that TfL have never offered walks through other tunnels when circumstances permit. I would imagine the safety issues would make it too much of a liability, I'd imagine the Thames Tunnel is more solid underfoot than much of LUL. I have taken small numbers of staff on track walks for one reason or another, including for interest purposes, however as a minumum they have to be track certified, which in turn means meeting certain medical requirements, and there are risks and hazards which have to be considered and mitigated against. It's not impossible, indeed if a detrainment becomes necessary then it *has* to be done, but for those untrained and unfamiliar with the environment, I can't see there being a business case against the background of risk. Remember also the Tube tunnels can be very hot, even in normal temperatures long sections like Old Street to Angel can be tiring, whilst in summer temperatures some of the less ventilated sections (for example much of the Bakerloo) are positively unbearable. |
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Jul 22, 2014 23:08:40 GMT
Somewhere - can't immediately find them - I have the scale plans for the extension to Camberwell: two versions IIRC.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2014 8:21:17 GMT
Somewhere - can't immediately find them - I have the scale plans for the extension to Camberwell: two versions IIRC. That would be interesting to see, please, M. |
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Post by bassmike on Jul 23, 2014 12:00:55 GMT
There was a tunnel walk from King William st: down and under the river I went on it --think it was mid 1970's-- got some photos somewhere but cant find them at present.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Jul 23, 2014 14:52:26 GMT
Remember also the Tube tunnels can be very hot, even in normal temperatures long sections like Old Street to Angel can be tiring, whilst in summer temperatures some of the less ventilated sections (for example much of the Bakerloo) are positively unbearable. Even when it was snowing the temperature at Elephant was unbearable! |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2014 0:15:25 GMT
What i would give for a walk and look around the undergrounds tunnels, i don't think I'd ever get bored Indeed, no matter how many times I've walked it, Stockwell to London Bridge on the Northern Line never ceases to interest. Stockwell disused station and C&SLR sidings, the two temporary crossover tunnels at Portland Place and South Island Place, the vent shaft at Oval which was originally built to be part of the abortive deep shelter, Kennington junctions, the Kennington floodgates, Elephant & Castle disused siding tunnel and the short disused section of running tunnel which was abandoned in the middle of the enlargment works, the site of the Newington Causeway tunnel collapse of 1923, Borough Junctions, the former JLE workings at Redcross Way, and finally the disused C&SLR tunnels to King William Street! I'd love to see all those things! |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 31, 2015 7:48:26 GMT
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North End
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Post by North End on Aug 1, 2015 2:51:51 GMT
There's no truth in it. Both sidings are a tight berth for 72 stock, and both end against a solid wall. The only extra length is to provide space for the crossover. The original BS&WR sidings appear almost certainly to be partially or wholly backfilled, probably as part of the construction of the current ones - and as far as I can tell there is no access to any remains. |
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Post by bassmike on Aug 1, 2015 10:51:00 GMT
Probably was useful as space to dispose of soil from later consruction.
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Post by longhedge on Aug 1, 2015 17:25:21 GMT
I started this thread, and subsequent, I spoke with a Senior Manager on the Bakerloo, and he really confirms what has been said. The old tunnels are shown on plans, but are in no way visible and were back filled with weak cement.
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Post by bruce on Aug 2, 2015 19:58:09 GMT
There is a third short tunnel which runs parallel with the southbound platform tunnel and southbound siding. It is full of pumping equipment and this is probably why the disused sidings were backfilled and sealed to alleviate the need for more pumping equipment. Not only is E&C hot it is also wet which makes a very uncomfortable environment to work in.
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Post by programmes1 on Aug 2, 2015 20:23:18 GMT
Yes the third tunnel is full of pumping equipment for the very reasons you say as the area is very wet, however, there is another use but I think the forum rules stop me from saying exactly what else there is.
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Post by ianvisits on Aug 16, 2015 11:12:08 GMT
Although their alignment is shown on some plans, other drawings indicate they are filled with weak concrete. So unless there's some other means of access, which I strongly doubt, it appears they are backfilled. Which in itself is unusual, as generally most abandoned tunnels tend to be left empty. Unless there is a use for the tunnels, such as for storage or ventilation, then backfilling them with concrete foam/etc is a very common and sensible practice as it cuts down on maintenance costs considerably. |
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