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Post by melikepie on Aug 3, 2013 14:21:42 GMT
According to the August edition of Modern Railways (p20), when Bank is rebuilt, there will be a new ticket hall, four new escalators and other improvement works including two new lifts to the Waterloo & City Line, giving it step-free access. However there are no lifts at Waterloo. So I don't really see how people are going to go anywhere other than getting fun rides up and down the line.
Will Waterloo be rebuilt as well?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2013 15:03:14 GMT
There is one lift at Waterloo from the arrival W&C platform to ticket hall level, giving step-free access between the two. This went into service 12/7/10.
On the departure side there is a ramp down from the ticket hall to the W&C platform, giving step-free access.
However, that doesn't cater for the fact that people might want to get from the ticket hall to the main line station/exit in a step-free manner.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2013 18:53:16 GMT
So is the W@C line at Waterloo step free to train?
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Post by rsdworker on Aug 3, 2013 19:08:53 GMT
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Post by norbitonflyer on Aug 3, 2013 22:23:54 GMT
i believe there used be step free route via old eurostar area - this would be reopened with new lifts Indeed there was - used it several times, but you needed to know your way round Bank pretty well to find your way out (or to the DLR, as I was usually doing) Only worked that way round, too - there was no step-free exit from the Drain at Waterloo
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Post by rsdworker on Aug 4, 2013 12:56:45 GMT
so either has no step free now but could be accessible for pushchairs but latter could be open for wheelchairs when new platforms are open but i believe TFL could install lifts - to make wheelchair access from other lines means wheelchair would be on and off on this line more easier - just needs replace the ramp with new lift in departures because its graded very steep
at bank - i can confirm there is step free via travelators but in future - they won't need use this route to gain access - wheelchairs will use lifts at new entrance in few years time removing need of using travelators
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2013 15:43:26 GMT
Just to re-state that at Waterloo, there is step-free from the W&C arrival platform to the main ticket hall by lift, and step free from the main ticket hall to the W&C departure platform by inclined ramp down. And that, at the moment, is it.
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Post by rsdworker on Aug 5, 2013 12:26:54 GMT
i mean the exits from ticket hall - currently has steps to main ticket hall - no lift connecting to way out from main station - if the original step free is not opening soon
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2013 12:21:10 GMT
If there going to remove the translator at Bank at a later date then does this open up a possible real discussion about a W&C extension? As I think the translator is one of the reasons (other then the Bank of England and Central Line) why no extension is possible currently?
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Post by melikepie on Aug 15, 2013 13:11:56 GMT
If there going to remove the translator at Bank at a later date then does this open up a possible real discussion about a W&C extension? As I think the translator is one of the reasons (other then the Bank of England and Central Line) why no extension is possible currently? Do you mean travelator? I didn't know there was anything being translated there
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2013 22:13:34 GMT
My mistake. But if it was remove would it open a discussion about a W&C extension towards the north east or east London? And of a southern extension?
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Post by Chris M on Aug 15, 2013 22:17:02 GMT
From memory, while the travelator is the most immediate obstacle to a W&C extension from Bank, the gradients needed to pass under the Central Line and thread through the bank vaults and other tunnels en-route are the most significant.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2013 16:03:11 GMT
From memory, while the travelator is the most immediate obstacle to a W&C extension from Bank, ...... There used to be a siding beyond each of the platforms at Bank. That on the travolator (eastbound) side was lost when that was constructed. The (long disused) siding on the westbound side was finally obliterated when the passageway to/from the Central/Northern lines was constructed (opened 19/7/93). In that passageway remains the tunnelling shield at what was the end of the siding picked out in red with a small plaque.
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Post by grahamhewett on Aug 16, 2013 17:53:11 GMT
@chris M - at the risk of setting the crayonistas off again, the extension of the W&C was something I did ask my engineering colleagues to consider in NSE days. They reported that it was just feasible to thread through the Central/Northern congeries of tunnels to get to Liverpool Street ( and on to Spitalfields, where English Partnerships were interested in paying for a new tube station). The travolator would certainly have had to go, although it might have been possible to place it in the present stairway instead; taking the travolator away would have permitted five car operation (possibly 6 with SDO), but finding depot accommodation would have been a headache. There has already been exhaustive discussion - some would say exhausting - on this forum about the revival of the 1913 plan to link the W&C and the GN&C but I believe that the extendadors have finally convinced themselves that XR is in the way at Moorgate.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2013 23:23:41 GMT
A station a Spitalfields? Never heard of this? With Liverpool Street and the Aldgate's stations and the then Shoreditch tube station in the area back then. Was there any demand for a station here? Would it have been next to the market? Where could the W&C gone from here?
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Post by grahamhewett on Aug 17, 2013 10:34:07 GMT
@futureguy -At the time, English Partnerships were leading the redevelopment of the Spitalfields site and believed that a new tube station would be just the thing to make the project take off. they were prepared to put up around £150m (1993 prices). Their first preference was for a new station on the Central Line - greeted with understandable disinterest by LU -so the W&C option was a more workable option. Extending beyond Spitalfields up the Lea valley slow lines would have been my preferred option for further extension - LU's own analysis showed that a tube extension along that routeing was financially viable and, given that a Victoria branch from Northumberland Park was unsustainable, a W&C extension would have dealt satisfactorily with a number of issues (and would have opened up options for a new depot). Any progress was rolled by privatisation, however; I dare say that a long extension to the W&C under BRB control would almost certainly have led to institutional issues probably precipitating the transfer of the line to LU anyway.
Thinking had not developed as to the possibility of any southern extension. Although the crayonistas love the option of Clapham Junction, the line points south/south east at Waterloo, and given the failure to get the Jubilee/Fleet line into SE London to relieve London Bridge and the Dartford Loops, that could have been a logical destination. [remember that in those days, XR was only going to Shenfield].
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2013 22:32:19 GMT
Now day's a W&C southern extension would better to go towards Camberwell via Kennington and onto Denmark Hill up to Streatham would be better. This would allow as Southwark Council have said the Bakerloo Line should go to Peckham via Old Kent Road. Shame about the Northern going to Battersea. Would of been perfect for this. I'm gonna put my idea on the W&C extension thread.
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Post by grahamhewett on Aug 19, 2013 14:35:58 GMT
@futureguy-many have suggested CLJ as a possible W&C destination and in traffic terms, it makes a lot of sense. Technically, however, it would require something like a 120 degree turn to enable it to point in the right direction - you'd have to pass quite close to Kennington in order to complete the turn. It is a pity about the Northern, it might have made better sense for XR2 to pass that way rather than via Chelsea.
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Post by londonstuff on Aug 19, 2013 17:25:11 GMT
Mod comment
Evening all. Can we keep the focus of this particular thread on step-free access? If any of the contributors to the thread want to carry on the Drain extension discussions, feel free to create a new thread - possibly in the RIPaS section. If it happens I'll then move the last few posts into the thread as well.
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Post by malcolmffc on Aug 30, 2013 6:35:09 GMT
We really need a stock post on why a W&C extension is highly unlikely and unfeasible that anyone who joins the forum has to read before they post!
In summary:
- Extension southwards from Waterloo is infeasible as the line is already full to bursting there - A SW extension from Waterloo would be expensive as the W&C platforms at Waterloo point South-East and the depot is in the wayl - Extension from Bank is very difficult due to the Central and Northern lines in the way - But most importantly of all, if you wanted a tuble line running between Waterloo and Bank with other stations at both ends, you would be far better off just starting from scratch with a brand new line built to modern standards. The W&C infrastructure is ol, leaks water everywhere (hence the infamous smell) and the platforms are only long enough for 4-car trains.
If you sent me into space for 50 years and asked me to bet on how London's transport infrastructure would look when I returned, one of the few things I would be able to predict for certain is that the W&C would still only be running between Waterloo & Bank!
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