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Post by q8 on Jul 8, 2005 11:05:36 GMT
Look, look, look. This is all getting out of hand again. Let's all calm down (including me) All I myself personally want to see again before I pass over is a society like the late 1950's where we ALL went about our daily lives without fear. Did our jobs without hindrance and continually worrying we've broken some rule or other. Worked an 8 hour day for 8 hours pay. Where unemployment was low. Where the lust for money did not exist. Where PUNISHMENT not clap-trap was the result of crime . Above all where we ALL lived in reasonable harmony with our fellows wether they were black, white or skybluepink. Wether they were Jew, Christian, Muslim or agnostic. Where this constant flux of populations here there and everywhere did not exit. Where folk stayed in the land they were born in and tried to improve it by thier own efforts as the Africans did when they gained independence. They tried, believe me they tried, but were sold down the river by tinpot liitle dictators who lined their own pockets with the aid the people were supposed to have. Where people were HAPPY and reasonably content with their lot. The two most destructive curse's befalling this world today are multiculturalism because it is devisive and political correctness because it fosters the very intolerance it tries to eradicate.
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Post by chris on Jul 8, 2005 11:08:35 GMT
Here is a poem which I had to study as part of the English GCSE. It makes you think. My personal revenge will be the right of your children to school and to flowers; My personal revenge will be to offer you this florid song without fears; My personal revenge will be to show you the good there is in the eyes of my people, always unyielding in combat and most steadfast and generous in victory.
My personal revenge will be to say to you good morning, without beggars in the streets, when instead of jailing you I intend you shake the sorrow from your eyes; when you, practitioner of torture, can no longer so much as lift your gaze, my personal revenge will be to offer you these hands you once maltreated without being able to make them forsake tenderness.
And it was the people who hated you most when the song was language of violence; But the people today beneath its skin of red and black has its heart uplifted.
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Phil
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2018
Posts: 9,473
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Post by Phil on Jul 8, 2005 11:23:20 GMT
gr8 chris- but who was the author?
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Post by q8 on Jul 8, 2005 11:29:07 GMT
Thank you Chris for posting that.
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Post by chris on Jul 8, 2005 11:30:25 GMT
Luis Enrique Mejía Godoy. The poem above will be a different in some places from some copies as it was translated from Spanish. It was written against extremists who ruled his country (Nicaragua). They persucuted, scared and terrorised the people, so it has some relevance. Anyway, this guy became Minister for the Interior and it was then he got his revenge; He forgave them.
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Igelkotten on another computer
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Post by Igelkotten on another computer on Jul 8, 2005 12:50:09 GMT
Regarding the Sunni and Shia (Shi´ite in english transliteration) directions of Islam:
As I have posted earlier, Islam is a faith and a way of life that has over one billion adherents. As such, it is a heterogenous faith, with lots of differences between various groups and lots of influence by local culture. How many know, for example, that the majority of the world's muslims are not arabs? That the largest muslim country in the world is Indonesia? That the area in which Islam is growing fastest is probably in western europe and USA?
Now, Sunni and Shia are the two largest directions of Islam. The division between them is an old one, dating back to the 700's and having it's root in a dispute over the nature of worldly government and the role of the descendants of the prophet Muhammed. You could, in a very, very simplified manner, liken the situation to the one within christendom when the church split into a roman catholic and a eastern orthodox one.
Sunni Islam is, worldwide, in the majority, but Shia are a large miniority and locally a majority. The largest population of Shia muslims can be found in Iran and Iraq, as well as large minorities in Syria, Lebanon and other countries.
While there are theological differences between the groups, they are all definately muslims. Shia go on the hadj, the pilgrimage to Mecca, despite the holy city being located in the staunchly Sunni country of Saudi Arabia.
Now, a very important part of being a muslim is following the shari´a, the law according to which you should live. It is based on human interpretations of the holy Q´aran, as well as examples from the lives and deeds of the prophet Muhammed, his family and other notable persons, as well as "the consenus and understanding of good muslims everywhere" -in practice learned scholars.
There are several schools of islamic law, all having differences in how they look upon things, the relation between earthly and religious powers being one, for example. Some are very strict, others more loose. Some, like so many other philosophies, are very closely tied the current ruling powers at the time of their inception.
So, what does all this mean? Basically, my point is that it is both pointless and ignorant, even dangerous, to point at one branch of Islam and say "they are all extremists", or saying that "all muslims are like X".
The myth of Shia being some kind of violent sect of fanatcis is one that started to surface in Western media after the revolution in Iran, when the dictatorship of the Shah was overthrown, upsetting the balance of power in the region, and scaring the USA and the Gulf states. The Shia where then tarred as some sort of fanatic, Soviet-funded cold war boogeyman, out to get all the nice oil in the region, and burning down your local Mc Donalds. And while the islamic republic of Iran did engage in a bit of state terrorism every now and then, it was almost always directed at it's own internal enemies and dissidents.
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Igelkotten at another computer
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Post by Igelkotten at another computer on Jul 8, 2005 12:57:22 GMT
Luis Enrique Mejía Godoy. The poem above will be a different in some places from some copies as it was translated from Spanish. It was written against extremists who ruled his country (Nicaragua). They persucuted, scared and terrorised the people, so it has some relevance. Anyway, this guy became Minister for the Interior and it was then he got his revenge; He forgave them. It is indeed a very good poem. The extremists you speak of was the Somoza dicatorship, a US-sponsored right-wing junta that was eventually overthrown by the Sandinista rebels. The defeated junta eventually started a long and bloody war against the government of Nicaragua, with their Contra rebel groups being heavily funded by the USA, all in the name of the "struggle against world communism". Oh, and incidentally keeping US control over the Nicaraguan economy -mainly agricultural produce and some petrochemicals.
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Post by Colin D on Jul 12, 2005 18:48:47 GMT
Well done Chris, maybe that poem can calm us all down in these very troubled times
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