Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 21, 2012 8:38:29 GMT
Hello, I've been taking photos of platforms on a Canon EOS 450D on the Tamron - Aspherical [IF] MACRO AF 18-200mm F/3.5-6.3 XR Di II LD lens, and I've noticed that some of they photos have appeared both blurry and crisp at the same time: for example, have a zoom into the original size of two of my photos: Chancery Lane StationMonument StationWhen you zoom in the photo, one can deduce that the centre appears okay, but at the edge the detail is kind of lost. Example: the man's face at Monument to the far right has red and cyan artefacts at the edge, and at Chancery Lane the tube map appears smudged. The focal distance of the lens I used can go from 0.45 to 45 metres, but I noticed that if I focused on closer objects, then the background gets blurred. What I am trying to do is get all of the objects in focus, but due to poor lighting in tunnels, I have had to use 1/20-30 at F3.5 (ISO 400) in manual Landscape mode in order to reduce the noise, had I used ISO 1600, obviously without a tripod due to the Conditions of Carriage (flash was pointless anyway as it would have washed out the colours). What settings should I use if I want to get all the objects in focus? Thanks.
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slugabed
Zu lang am schnuller.
Posts: 1,480
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Post by slugabed on Aug 21, 2012 9:41:54 GMT
This is an issue of "Depth of Field" en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth_of_fieldAs with anything photographic,there are multiple variables to consider,including the constraints of working in a low-light environment (such as the Underground) Essentially,the solution is to use as small an aperture as you can get away with. This may necessitate longer shutter opening (perhaps not practicable,without a tripod) or using a faster filmstock.
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Post by trt on Aug 21, 2012 11:49:23 GMT
You could also consider using a vibration reducing lens, a monopod (I have one of a walking stick variety), and a prime lens (single, fixed focal length) which has a greater range of apertures and fewer optical interfaces that distort and reduce the light. The red and cyan artefact towards the edges is due to chromatic aberration, i.e. light of different wavelengths gets refracted by different amounts through the lens (the prism effect of Newton - a lens can be considered as a number of prisms joined back to back). There is a filter in Photoshop which is preset with the characteristics of a number of commercial lenses and this can be used to compensate for the aberration. You can also try using only manual focus and exposure setting, and installing a split prism focussing screen in your viewfinder.
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 22, 2012 13:17:34 GMT
It looks like that the problem has been reduced by fixing the chromatic aberration in Photoshop: it was in the same tab as the lens correction feature. Lancaster Gate StationThis on was done on f/7.1 at 1/20" and ISO 400. The lighting is becoming more generous due to the Tube Upgrade Plan: in some past photos, I had to use the RAW Editor to beef up the lighting, which was 50% darker than expected.
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Post by trt on Aug 23, 2012 13:02:49 GMT
It's important to perform the lens correction on the raw image (best) or (if RAW is not available) at least before you have applied any other corrections (e.g. for colour balance, exposure, sharpness). This is because the filter set in Photoshop is keyed to the individual characteristics of the lens and camera and if you move the colours around, then the filters are not operating at the peaks they should be so the effect is lessened.
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 24, 2012 13:30:47 GMT
Since 2009 all my photography has solely been on RAW like all professionals do. London Bridge (Jubilee line) Station - Fill light and Recovery has been used often in many photos like this station in order to balance the contrast. Is the sharp contrast natural in cameras?
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Post by trt on Aug 24, 2012 13:44:19 GMT
I'd use the basic tone controls in Lightroom 4 rather than fill light and recovery. Fill light can create halo effects around high contrast borders which your brain can interpret as over-enhanced image processing for sharpness. I'm not sure what you mean by "is sharp contrast natural in cameras". [EDIT - ADDITIONAL] I've searched for a depth-of-field table for that lens of yours and I can't seem to find one. I don't know if you've ever heard of the hyper-focal distance technique... but basically it runs as follows. Your lens/camera combination will have a depth of field, i.e. a 3D block of space where objects that the lens focuses will appear to the eye to be in focus. The size of this region is dependent on a lot of things, but the main thing that you have control over is aperture; the higher the f number i.e. the smaller the aperture, the deeper the region is. Now, this block of space occupies a region both in front of and behind the focal distance. If the focal distance you have set is infinity, then there's a region beyond infinity which would be in focus if it could exist. Such a region cannot exist, obviously, so you can focus on a point closer than infinity but within your DoF block and objects between that point and infinity will still appear to be in focus. This shifts the block of focussed space towards you, bringing more objects in the foreground into focus. If you extend the principle to a tube station, then objects beyond the end of the platform cannot be seen (kind of), so you if you set the furthest region of your depth of field to that distance or slightly beyond it to allow for errors in reading aperture etc, you bring more of the foreground into focus. You see why I said about using manual focussing before... by the way, I'm a great fan of using film and non-auto-focus cameras! [EDIT - MORE INFORMATION] If you look here: www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.htmlyou can work out a hyperfocal distance! So for your London Bridge picture, given that the head or tail wall could be at most 115m away, you could set your focus manually to 3.3m and be sure (at f5 18mm) to get everything between 1.7m and 108m to be in focus, i.e. almost everything on the platform (as I expect you are around 1.5m tall and the camera's field of view would not extend to include your feet!)
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 24, 2012 15:12:49 GMT
I'm not sure what you mean by "is sharp contrast natural in cameras". I have already ceased to use Auto-focus for many situations now... What I mean by sharp contrast is how we record the lighting as opposed to how the camera does it. A few scenarios: - At Bow Road, we can correctly see the tones of the covered and open sections of the station, but the camera either records only wither the open or covered section with leaving the other either under or over exposed. - At Stratford, we can deduce the station and sky at reasonable levels, but the camera either records the sky correctly and leave the station detail underexposed, or record the station correctly but leave the sky overexposed. This sometimes happens even if we don't face the sun.
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Post by trt on Aug 24, 2012 15:19:06 GMT
Ah! I see. Well, the dynamic range of a camera is still woeful compared to our eye, which is logarithmic in nature. In those circumstances, I would use an auto-bracketed exposure sequence, layer the images in Photoshop and use the layer blending to allow the shadows and highlights to come through from the appropriately exposed image.
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 24, 2012 15:35:12 GMT
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Aug 24, 2012 15:51:24 GMT
It almost looks like a painting...
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 25, 2012 8:27:40 GMT
Yes, I think it is more of a dithered GIF, yet without a tripod I won't be able to prevent potential blurring.
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Post by trt on Aug 25, 2012 13:41:04 GMT
Monopod.
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Antje
侵略! S系, でゲソ! The Tube comes from the bottom of London!
Posts: 605
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Post by Antje on Aug 25, 2012 16:23:20 GMT
Thanks for the link to the Depth of Field calculator. I'm a bit nervous about the monopod because that might be interpreted as a tripod under the Conditions of Carriage (it's probably normal if I'm new to it).
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Post by trt on Aug 25, 2012 17:11:42 GMT
Like I say, I have one built into my walking stick. :-)
EDIT
Just checked conditions of carriage and it now says that you can't use a tripod or other camera support system, so a monopod is out. :-(
But there is that body worn mounting system... who makes it??? Eboboo I think they are called.
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Post by bruce on Aug 25, 2012 20:48:20 GMT
Technically still a camera support system.
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Post by trt on Aug 25, 2012 23:09:41 GMT
So's your hands in that case. Or propping it up on a bench.
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