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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2012 13:33:58 GMT
Most trains indicate on the matrix signs they go to Hainaut via Newbury park.
Why do they not finish at woodford?
I was at Hainaut yesterday on a train awaiting to go westbound and an east bound train entered another platform. I heard the announcement saying was calling at all stations to woodford.
I have never seen a train saying woodford via Newbury park.
Also say if you boarded a train at south woodford and wanted to get to Newbury park for example you wound have to change at woodford again.
I have never seen any direct Hainault bound trains coming from that direction
Does the loop not work in that anti clockwise direction?
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Jun 10, 2012 13:42:02 GMT
Woodford-Hainault is a fairly lightly used section of the Hainault loop; so direct trains aren't usually run. Hainault-Ealing Broadway/West Ruislip via Woodford is sometimes run in the early mornings IIRC
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Jun 10, 2012 16:16:41 GMT
Most trains indicate on the matrix signs they go to Hainaut via Newbury park. Why do they not finish at woodford? One train does continue on to Woodford, every 20 minutes. You have to bear in mind though that as stated above, the section via Chigwell is very lightly patronised - and upon arrival at Woodford, the train has to detrained whilst occupying the westbound 'main line' from Epping. Therefore anything more than a 20 minute service just isn't practical. I was at Hainaut yesterday on a train awaiting to go westbound and an east bound train entered another platform. I heard the announcement saying was calling at all stations to woodford. Yep, quite normal & every 20 minutes. I have never seen a train saying woodford via Newbury park. I'm open to correction but am fairly certain they're described as 'Woodford via Hainault'. Also say if you boarded a train at south woodford and wanted to get to Newbury park for example you wound have to change at woodford again. Yep. I have never seen any direct Hainault bound trains coming from that direction Does the loop not work in that anti clockwise direction? There are some peak workings that come through the central area, travel via Snaresbrook, Woodford and then go direct to Hainault via Chigwell, but these trains are very rare indeed. You may also happen to come across a depot train that needs to be sent this way - to avoid the tunnel section via Newbury Park for example - but this'll be as rare, if not rarer, than the peak workings. So yeah, basically 'the loop' only works via Hainault to & from Woodford. Woodford-Hainault is a fairly lightly used section of the Hainault loop; so direct trains aren't usually run. Hainault-Ealing Broadway/West Ruislip via Woodford is sometimes run in the early mornings IIRC Not entirely correct fella..... Ealing Brodway - Woodford vis Hainault services run almost all day, every day, every 20 minutes!! |
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Post by bassmike on Jun 10, 2012 16:29:32 GMT
peak workings to hainault vyia woodford usually had "Grange Hill via Woodford" showing
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Post by superteacher on Jun 10, 2012 16:36:41 GMT
peak workings to hainault vyia woodford usually had "Grange Hill via Woodford" showing 1992 stock can show both "Hainault via Woodford" and "Grange Hill via Woodford". In the current timetable there are no such scheduled trainss although as Colin says, you do see them from time to time. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2012 16:40:27 GMT
peak workings to hainault vyia woodford usually had "Grange Hill via Woodford" showing On the old 62TS I seem to recall the Grange Hill via Woodford describer blinds being black writing on yellow to help people in the city, who didn't understand what "via Woodford" meant, from boarding the wrong train. I think all these trains ended up in the depot. |
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Post by superteacher on Jun 10, 2012 16:57:43 GMT
peak workings to hainault vyia woodford usually had "Grange Hill via Woodford" showing On the old 62TS I seem to recall the Grange Hill via Woodford describer blinds being black writing on yellow to help people in the city, who didn't understand what "via Woodford" meant, from boarding the wrong train. I think all these trains ended up in the depot. Grange Hill via Woodford were standard white on black. Black on yellow were "Hainault via Woodford" and "Woodford via Hainault". |
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Post by alfie on Jun 10, 2012 21:00:07 GMT
Also say if you boarded a train at south woodford and wanted to get to Newbury park for example you wound have to change at woodford again. Not that you'd ever need (or want) to do that..should you do, always a few buses anyway. |
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Post by superteacher on Jun 11, 2012 19:52:49 GMT
Why am I now thinking that Whistlekiller was right after all, in that Grange Hill via Woodford was black on yellow.
I spent so much time on the Central in the early 90's that I'm quite surprised that I can't remember!
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Post by Deep Level on Jun 11, 2012 20:17:20 GMT
I remember Hainault via Woodford Trains when I was younger (92ts).
Colin said everything that I was going to say.
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Post by Alight on Jun 11, 2012 21:29:48 GMT
I remember Hainault via Woodford Trains when I was younger (92ts). I questioned a while back in another thread (now archived) why Hainault via Woodford wasn't the norm, given that it serves Roding Valley, Chigwell and Grange Hill in a more timely manner. I'm still not convinced as to why Woodford via Hainault should take preference in serving the 3 stations in question. |
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Post by superteacher on Jun 11, 2012 21:42:39 GMT
I remember Hainault via Woodford Trains when I was younger (92ts). I questioned a while back in another thread (now archived) why Hainault via Woodford wasn't the norm, given that it serves Roding Valley, Chigwell and Grange Hill in a more timely manner. I'm still not convinced as to why Woodford via Hainault should take preference in serving the 3 stations in question. In the peak hours, sending a train to Hainault via Woodford would have to be in place of a train towards Loughton and Epping, thus creating an 8 minute gap. The demand towards Loughton and Epping far outweighs that to the stations from Roding Valley to Grange Hill. Sending trains to Woodford via Hainault is easier because you simply extend a Hainault train to Woodford every 20 mins or so, which then leaves the Epping line with its 4 min service. |
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Post by Chris M on Jun 13, 2012 20:07:07 GMT
You can also get to Grange Hill etc using the same-platform interchange at Woodford changing from an Epping, Loughton or Debden train to the Hainault shuttle.
Travelling to southern loop stations from South Woodford and points north-east it's probably quickest to change at Leytonstone or get a bus. Wanstead is also only a short walk from Snaresbrook.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2012 17:15:12 GMT
I frequently see a Hainault via Woodford on my way to Liverpool Street in the morning, sometimes with a Woodford via Hainault simultaneously on the indicator.
Until a few years ago Hainault-Woodford was run as an independent shuttle with short trains every 20 minutes, including some of the unique Cravens 1960 stock, and as a test bed for automatic operation. On the maps Hainault was shown as a double-ended terminus (not an interchange). Then the shuttle was combined with the through Hainault service from the west, possibly as much for operational purposes as passenger convenience.
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Post by alfie on Jun 15, 2012 17:48:36 GMT
Do you? I'm surprised.
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Post by Deep Level on Jun 15, 2012 18:00:34 GMT
Me too, I've just taken a look at the WTT and there doesn't appear to be any morning workings Hainault via Woodford if there's even any at all (I only looked at the mornings) so if you're seeing this frequently I'd love to know why. Care to share an approximate time?
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Post by alfie on Jun 15, 2012 18:35:32 GMT
Have asked before, but got no answer, but two weekends in September the Central is closed Leytonstone - Hainault via Newbury Park - so presumably there will be Hainault via Woodford trains then? Or a shuttle..
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Rich32
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Post by Rich32 on Jun 15, 2012 20:58:42 GMT
@alfie IIRC the last time there were indeed Hainault via Woodford's (I'm sure it was the weekend of the Xmas meet?) but I certainly remember catching one HOL to LIS and noting the unusual destination. Deep Level, I've certainly noticed a few Eastbound in evening peaks gone by, but whether that was to timetable, or a re-route, I couldn't say. Maybe one of the Central drivers on here will be able to enlighten us? |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2012 8:05:14 GMT
I frequently see a Hainault via Woodford on my way to Liverpool Street in the morning, sometimes with a Woodford via Hainault simultaneously on the indicator. Until a few years ago Hainault-Woodford was run as an independent shuttle with short trains every 20 minutes…. By "a few years ago" you mean at least a decade as we were running WOO via HAI back when I was an SA at Stratford in 1999. If the train says HAI via WOO but the platform dot matrix says WOO via HAI I'd trust the platform as that's linked to the signals at Wood Lane. I don’t do earlies but I’ve never done a timetabled HAI via WOO, it’s always been because there’s a shutdown (planned or otherwise) between Leytonstone – Hainault and we can’t run normal service. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2012 9:51:36 GMT
Yes, at least a decade ago.
A couple of months ago when the Met was stuffed I used the Central a few times to reach LST about 08.10, and observed Hainault via Woodford on a couple of occasions, together with "Woodford via Hainault" on the platform matrix once; so it looked like a normal working for that time of day. So "frequently" is in relation to a very small sample and is misleading. Apologies.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2012 15:49:43 GMT
Yes, at least a decade ago. A couple of months ago when the Met was stuffed I used the Central a few times to reach LST about 08.10, and observed Hainault via Woodford on a couple of occasions, together with "Woodford via Hainault" on the platform matrix once; so it looked like a normal working for that time of day. So "frequently" is in relation to a very small sample and is misleading. Apologies. I’ve just been through WTT66 and there are no scheduled HAI via WOO in passenger service. There are a few that are meant to run empty, the earliest being 484 leaving West Ruislip at 11:40 and arriving at Hainault 13:05 but I've never known them to actually run and the describer on those would read “Not in Service” |
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Post by superteacher on Jun 17, 2012 10:13:18 GMT
There are trains which start from Hainault depot north end, enter service at Grange Hill then run to Central London via Woodford. These trains are in the morning peak and the build up to the evening peak. However, no such trains run in the opposite direction in regular timetabled service.
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Post by ruislip on Jun 17, 2012 22:23:44 GMT
In 1973 I remember boarding a Grange Hill via Woodford train @ Ruislip Gardens.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2012 0:25:20 GMT
There are trains which start from Hainault depot north end, enter service at Grange Hill then run to Central London via Woodford. These trains are in the morning peak and the build up to the evening peak. However, no such trains run in the opposite direction in regular timetabled service. Trains leaving Hainault depot via Grange Hill weekdays T 123, 06:24 des. White City T 113, 06:48 des. Ealing Bwy T 002, 07:12 des. W Ruislip T 061, 07:33 des. W Ruislip T 050, 07:55 des. White City T 075, 08:11 des. Ealing Bwy T 011, 08:27 des. Ealing Bwy T 143, 15:39 des. W Ruislip T 144, 15:55 des. W Ruislip Only one train goes into Hainault via Grange Hill, T 026 at 21:38, but that runs empty from Hainault. No moves via Grange Hill at weekends |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2012 19:46:29 GMT
In 1973 I remember boarding a Grange Hill via Woodford train @ Ruislip Gardens. When still in short trousers I can recall being astounded at seeing an 8 car 62TS at Roding Valley one morning having only ever seen Cravens 60TS with 2 x Standard Stock cars or the occasional 67TS there. My mother, father, brother and maternal grandparents were bored to tears after I'd rushed home to recount the tale! ;D |
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