metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on May 7, 2012 16:46:46 GMT
Not really a main complaint, more of a question, but why do the S stock brakes screech so much compared with older trains? Is it the disk brakes? It's damn noisey!
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Post by v52gc on May 7, 2012 16:47:21 GMT
We are reading a lot of complaints about losing seats on this forum regarding the s stock on the Met.
I wonder if there was a drop in seats when the Pic went from 59s to 73s and if yes did people complain as much...
After all, Kings Cross to Chesham is just over an hour stopping all stations and the Pic is roughly the same to T5 from Kings Cross.
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metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on May 7, 2012 16:57:54 GMT
What is the drop in seats from 59ts to 73ts (unrefurbed)? 288 -> 264 less of a dent than 464 ->306!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2012 18:18:52 GMT
There was a lot of derision about the D stock when it entered service, being tiny compared to the CO/CP and R stocks and the D stock having a period of teething problems. Now it is held in high regards.
I need to do another trip on an S stock and hear those squeaks.
I do think the 09 TS is a better train for its purpose.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2012 18:52:55 GMT
There was a lot of derision about the D stock when it entered service, being tiny compared to the CO/CP and R stocks a the D stock having and having a period of teething problems. Now it is held in high regards. I need to do another trip on an S stock and hear those squeaks. I do think the 09 TS is a better train for its purpose. If we all stand back for a moment, lose the hysteria and give the new trains a chance I'm fairly sure they'll do OK. Change is difficult I'll admit but as been said above, we've been here before with D Stock and they're accepted now. No reason why it shouldn't be the same with S Stock. I'd hazzard a guess that within 5 years the anti S Stock arguments covered so vehemently on here will be long forgotten by passengers and everybody excepting the avid traditionalists. Too many other far more important things to worry about unfortunately.  |
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Post by tecchy on May 7, 2012 19:11:24 GMT
metman. 95's tend to squeak more aswell! They use tread brakes and I believe over time different materials combine to create brake blocks. Newer stock probably use a different combination which reacts differently to heat/ friction/ wet or pressure. I'm sure it was the same when escalators were first introduced. Now we ride them all over the world.... I think its the case of not too getting emotionally attached to an object. Admitted, I like the A Stock, just like any other train on LU. But times move on.
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metman
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5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on May 7, 2012 21:08:17 GMT
Thanks tecchy, I thought I was something like that. They are very noisey, I hope they settle down!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2012 23:34:11 GMT
Doesnt anyone know why the brake release sound on the S stock and 09ts is stuttured? I have noticed the 09ts brake release sound has got smoother recently but the S stock has not changed. Even if it is mere seconds, the train does take that tad longer to get moving. The usual sequence is: beep beep... slide BANG, ss s ssss ssss, squeeeeel, weeee and its off.
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Post by redsetter on May 21, 2012 19:24:00 GMT
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Post by alfie on May 21, 2012 19:29:26 GMT
Errrr...destination screens always come up like that in photos.
(why? taught to us by superteacher below)
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Post by superteacher on May 21, 2012 19:30:16 GMT
I agree that electronic destination displays are, in general, less effective than the old fashioned blinds. But to call it useless isn't fair. Also, remember that they have a flicker rate, meaning that they don't show up well in photos. I rather suspect that your post is more to do with having another unfair dig at the S stock, which as I've said before, is getting a bit tedious. We all know that you love the A stock, as do many others. I think that their passing will be the end of an era, and another chunk of my childhood goes with it. But get a grip; they've had a fantastic run of over 50 years. Get your hankie out ready . . . |
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Post by tecchy on May 21, 2012 20:24:09 GMT
I rather suspect that your post is more to do with having another unfair dig at the S stock, which as I've said before, is getting a bit tedious. We all know that you love the A stock, as do many others. I think that their passing will be the end of an era, and another chunk of my childhood goes with it. But get a grip; they've had a fantastic run of over 50 years. Get your hankie out ready . . . Whilst I like the A Stock. It is time for them to go as they no longer suit 21st Century London. I can say I travelled and worked on them, so I am happy for this. Nostalgia is a wonderful thing, but it also gives you a very rose tinted outlook on life. |
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Post by superteacher on May 21, 2012 20:33:20 GMT
I rather suspect that your post is more to do with having another unfair dig at the S stock, which as I've said before, is getting a bit tedious. We all know that you love the A stock, as do many others. I think that their passing will be the end of an era, and another chunk of my childhood goes with it. But get a grip; they've had a fantastic run of over 50 years. Get your hankie out ready . . . Whilst I like the A Stock. It is time for them to go as they no longer suit 21st Century London. I can say I travelled and worked on them, so I am happy for this. Nostalgia is a wonderful thing, but it also gives you a very rose tinted outlook on life. That's what nostalgia does I'm afraid! The summers were always warmer, the trains were always on time etc etc. If only! Agreed though - it is time for the A's to go. Sorry Redsetter! |
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a60
I will make the 8100 Class DART my new A Stock.
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Post by a60 on May 21, 2012 21:22:33 GMT
Even I agree with the above, sorry redsetter. But we realistically have to consider this - do we keep the A Stock on and allow them to get more unreliable? Let the public groan more, and hold London and the home-counties up to the extent that the A40(M) requires 8 lanes in each direction? No.
The S Stock may not be great, but they are going to be doing the job for the next 30 or so years. The A Stock have done well over the past 52 years - and now they're going gracefully.
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Post by 21146 on May 21, 2012 22:21:57 GMT
Never mind the destination LEDs 'flicker rate' not showing up on photos, they don't show upm in real life either.
Many of the S Stock I've photgraphed have had either the destination, or set number, not showing; or both blank - and these on brand new trains.
Ditto the 1996 Tube stock whose destinations are so faded as to be almost unreadable now, along with the associated set number above.
In contrast, 50 year old trains rung alongside both with technology that actually works!
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Post by tecchy on May 22, 2012 10:00:45 GMT
Never mind the destination LEDs 'flicker rate' not showing up on photos, they don't show upm in real life either. Many of the S Stock I've photgraphed have had either the destination, or set number, not showing; or both blank - and these on brand new trains. Ditto the 1996 Tube stock whose destinations are so faded as to be almost unreadable now, along with the associated set number above. In contrast, 50 year old trains rung alongside both with technology that actually works! Software updates will remove these bugs so hopefully the District/ Circle and Hammersmith and city fleet will not suffer these problems. Blinds are quite expensive to print, fade/ destroy/ muck up due to water leaks quicker than LED displays and require minimal effort to change. The argument for LED displays far out weighs blinds. |
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 22, 2012 10:11:50 GMT
Blinds are quite expensive to print, fade/ destroy/ muck up due to water leaks quicker than LED displays and require minimal effort to change. The argument for LED displays far out weighs blinds. Odd therefore that another arm of TfL, London Buses, still insist on using easily readable traditional blinds. |
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castlebar
Planners use hindsight, not foresight
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Post by castlebar on May 22, 2012 10:31:36 GMT
Odd then that some bus companies are now going back to blinds as matrix displays are a proven disaster in bright sunlight.
Matrix are fine on lines that never see sunlight, but blinds every time for outside use. To pretend otherwise is drivel. Try reading a matrix from 20 metres with the sun shining directly on it.
Matrix is fine where the sun never shines.
I can think of a few places like that.........
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2012 11:16:34 GMT
Odd then that some bus companies are now going back to blinds as matrix displays are a proven disaster in bright sunlight. Matrix are fine on lines that never see sunlight, but blinds every time for outside use. To pretend otherwise is drivel. Try reading a matrix from 20 metres with the sun shining directly on it. Matrix is fine where the sun never shines. I can think of a few places like that......... LEDs can be made to be better in bright daylight by having the display fitted with a light sensor to increase or decrease the brightness. If they are too bright in dull conditions or in a tunnel station then the display blurs. A good example of this fault is the LED display on the side of New Scotland Yard, around the corner from 55 Broadway. You can read the police dot matrix sign in bright daylight, but at night or overcast conditions you have to squint your eyes to read it. Anyway, none of the LED displays currently used on the front of LUL trains, even in perfect conditions are not as good as an old school blind or real old school destination boards. The matrix boards are just too small. Remember the destination cards on the 1992s. |
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Post by redsetter on May 22, 2012 11:26:31 GMT
these are not the only ones,chiltern trains have been running with display problems also,and its not the camera. www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/6254751817/sizes/l/in/photostream/this isn't such a problem because you know its going to aylesbury.however when trains are to be identical and in the case of the met four destinations heading out of london it becomes a problem. |
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Post by torquewrench on May 22, 2012 11:38:43 GMT
New technology brings in new issues/problems. Fact of life there for you.
I agree the A stock has had it's time basking in the sun that shines out of the LOM's rear. Please don't forget that it's not just life expectancy you're looking at, it's also technical outsourcing in the sense of yeah you can buy wheelsets and brake blocks but the components which are specific to the A stock just aren't available anymore and hence have to be custom built which gives you massive costing which I will add just isn't worth it for something so old and run down.
With regards to the LED boxes, it's a new technology with a new problem which will find its way sorted out. However, my opinion is that you don't really need to know where the train is going on LUL. You've got enough maps on platforms to tell you all you need to know! And to be more S stock specific, you can look at the near/offside LED displays which are situation down the length of each carriage.
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Post by redsetter on Jun 10, 2012 16:43:48 GMT
its often said what will the A stock be recycled into,the question then arises what were the s stock recycled from.
they lack any appeal or character.it appears the only difference is the seat layout and seven or eight cars.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2012 16:59:32 GMT
New technology brings in new issues/problems. Fact of life there for you. I agree the A stock has had it's time basking in the sun that shines out of the LOM's rear. Please don't forget that it's not just life expectancy you're looking at, it's also technical outsourcing in the sense of yeah you can buy wheelsets and brake blocks but the components which are specific to the A stock just aren't available anymore and hence have to be custom built which gives you massive costing which I will add just isn't worth it for something so old and run down. With regards to the LED boxes, it's a new technology with a new problem which will find its way sorted out. However, my opinion is that you don't really need to know where the train is going on LUL. You've got enough maps on platforms to tell you all you need to know! And to be more S stock specific, you can look at the near/offside LED displays which are situation down the length of each carriage. It would be better to have electronic flipper boarders, illuminated/flood lit by LEDs, for the S7s side displays, one flipper board would have the destination and the other would be a yellow Circle line or green District line board. |
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Post by fleetline on Jun 28, 2012 9:14:06 GMT
Do people realise that on the railway there are rules to how information is shown? That's why you see LED style screens because they have to be a certain way. There is stupidly complex rules like the letters need to be at least this big etc etc to comply. Blinds are not accepted any more.
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Post by redsetter on Jun 28, 2012 10:39:17 GMT
i don't wish to sound flippant but presumably that includes being able to see and read them clearly and in all conditions with reasonable eyesight.
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Post by superteacher on Jun 28, 2012 11:29:43 GMT
i don't wish to sound flippant but presumably that includes being able to see and read them clearly and in all conditions with reasonable eyesight. Absolutely. All these regulations about what destination displays should look lke is meaningless if you can't see them! And let's face it, LED's in bright sunshine are practically invisible. |
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Post by pwilliams on Jul 19, 2012 17:44:12 GMT
sorry, but i beg to differ.
today my wife and i were fortunate enough to catch the 11.55am (approx) from uxbridge. there was a fault with the announcement system which meant it was turned off.
the total peace and quiet and freedom from stress,- three announcements, at least, per station, was brilliant:- normally, by the time the train reaches rayners lane, i have the beginnings of a headache .
Appart from a few wrong announcements, the journey to bakers street was completely peacefull. Now - could something be done to silence the police car noise every time the doors open ?
P.S, is the announcer's voice on these trains ever so slightly 'speeded- up in tempo?
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metman
Global Moderator
5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
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Post by metman on Jul 19, 2012 23:01:54 GMT
Agreed. I hate the constant dribble coming out of the DVA although it is there for a reason.
I was a Harrow in the late morning and a train came in [422] to platform 4 with Aldgate fast on the front. You can imagine the confusion. I think so people even ran from plats 5 and 6! Crazy!
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