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Post by mrjrt on Nov 14, 2006 21:25:14 GMT
Hi. As no doubt you are aware, there was some "fun" on the Victoria today. What I'm curious about is if anyone knows why some of the direct passageways down to the underground station were closed at Euston and Kings Cross? - The signs apparent suggest it was due to 'Congestion'. To me this seems incredibly pointless, as all it achieves is making the passengers walk further around before heading into the station - they still need to go that way after all! On another note, what a day for the Vic signalling to pull a sickie eh? The Northern would've been bad enough as it was, but the bus AND Vic passengers made the carriage conditions quite...friendly  |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Nov 15, 2006 3:35:35 GMT
To me this seems incredibly pointless, as all it achieves is making the passengers walk further around before heading into the station - they still need to go that way after all! You've answered your own question there ;D The idea is to 'control' the congestion by limiting it to a specific area - that way it can be managed much more effectively, and above all, safely. |
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Post by Tubeboy on Nov 15, 2006 4:37:40 GMT
By giving passengers a "detour" it gives staff more time to allow the platforms/passageways to clear. I think people would prefer to walk for a few minutes than stand in a queue for a few minutes which would seem like an age. Like I said the main thing is slowing the crowd down.
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Post by mrjrt on Nov 15, 2006 22:53:03 GMT
Not trying to be awkward here, just genuinely curious, but I don't see exactly how it "manages" anything? The same volume of people are going to have to make their way into the station, all going through the same number of barriers....
If the fault was with the barriers then maybe it would make sense (as that is where the build up would occur), but the fault was with the line itself, so the only place people were going to build up was on the platforms. The way they get there is fairly irrelevant, surely? - a short delay is going to do very little to this as everyone is going to be delayed by the same amount of time!
i.e. assuming they all go that way, after 10 minutes you have the same number of people flowing through a station regardless of whether you delay them by 5 minutes or not, and the delay between new arrivals is going to be exactly the same distance apart if they also have to go the long way round...
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Nov 15, 2006 23:37:52 GMT
The point is that if people need to held back because the platforms are overcrowded, it's easier to do if you have one area to worry about rather than two or three.
Controlling the flow through more passageways requires more staff resources and increases the need for more radio traffic (on the station radio). This can lead to confusion within the staff which is not good when safely dealing with large crowds.
Quite often the PA system will also play a part - but it's a lot harder to make it effective when you have to broadcast simultaneous messages to several different areas.
It's about making a difficult situation easier to handle with the resources available. On the face of it, I can see why the impression is given that LUL is making everyones life hard for no reason - but if you consider the bigger picture, ie the whole station, it is ultimately done for everyone's benefit.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2006 14:57:24 GMT
What's already been said is fairly 110% spot on. Just to add that the congestion measure are very rarely deemed to be sensible by the traveling public. We had a few problems last week and reduced the entry gates, so eventually we only had one gate going in. The complaints of people demanding to be let through the manual gate, "as there's a queue at the others" was deafening. I was almost hoarse telling them that the platforms were overcrowded etc. How I'd have liked a SCRA that day.
Although I'm obviously biased, LU staff are much better at handling congestion than colleagues working at NR, or from what I've seen. Not a criticism, just an observation.
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Post by tubeprune on Nov 19, 2006 17:24:28 GMT
How I'd have liked a SCRA that day. What, please , is an SCRA? |
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Post by Tubeboy on Nov 19, 2006 19:23:21 GMT
Station control room assistant, on the Jubilee we are known as SCRO-station control room operator. I believe the job has no official job title.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2006 20:33:48 GMT
How I'd have liked a SCRA that day. What, please , is an SCRA? Sorry. basically the member of staff keeps watch of the station via cctv & makes PA's etc (there is more to the job). So they're able to remain fairly detached if the S/S is involved in a problem |
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Nov 20, 2006 3:45:24 GMT
What's already been said is fairly 110% spot on. I don't generally 'blow my own trumpet' - but when it comes to crowd control, I'd like to think I have more than enough experience. To name a few: Concerts, etc @ Earls Court (up to 12,000) Chelsea FC @ Fulham Broadway (40,000) Tennis at Southfields (don't know figures off hand - but a lot!!) Boat Race / Fulham FC @ Putney Bridge (up to 22,000) I'd say the single most important bit of kit when dealing with such situations is none other than the humble megaphone ;D |
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Post by Tubeboy on Nov 20, 2006 3:48:42 GMT
As well as loads of patience. ;D
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Post by tubeprune on Nov 20, 2006 18:31:28 GMT
Station control room assistant, on the Jubilee we are known as SCRO-station control room operator. I believe the job has no official job title. Thank you Tubeboy |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2006 18:39:56 GMT
What's already been said is fairly 110% spot on. I don't generally 'blow my own trumpet' - but when it comes to crowd control, I'd like to think I have more than enough experience. To name a few: Concerts, etc @ Earls Court (up to 12,000) Chelsea FC @ Fulham Broadway (40,000) Tennis at Southfields (don't know figures off hand - but a lot!!) Boat Race / Fulham FC @ Putney Bridge (up to 22,000) I'd say the single most important bit of kit when dealing with such situations is none other than the humble megaphone ;D Ah the Earl's Court group. Probably have the most special events stretched over such a large area than any other group. The only saving grace is that 95% of the group is above ground. |
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Post by Tubeboy on Nov 20, 2006 20:38:51 GMT
Could you imagine Earls Court being in a tunnel section? I would imagine it would be like Camden, but far busier!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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