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Post by underground2010 on Nov 25, 2011 2:16:30 GMT
I know a lot of people say don't always believe what you read on Wikkipedia, but I was reading up on the Piccadilly line to see if there was any information on the new trains that the line will be recieving whenever a train is designed.
Apparently a rough design has been made for these new trains and they are supposed to be getting used on the Central line and all other deep level tube lines when they are rolled out. Does anyone know if this is true? Thanks.
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Post by auxsetreq on Nov 25, 2011 8:02:29 GMT
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Post by trt on Nov 25, 2011 10:55:13 GMT
How long is a proposed EVO car? Unless each car is shorter, I can't see the door configuration being somehow better than current arrangement. By having shorter cars, but more of them, the train should hug curved platforms better. I know the placement of the wheels limits where you can have door openings, but by using single wheeled Grover bogeys on the leading and trailing set, with a conventional powered bogey for the centre, you could have the doors opening much closer to the car ends.
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 25, 2011 13:52:19 GMT
LU would save a lot of money on EVO if the cars are really long so less bogies are needed. Can someone here by the way infiltrate into LU to make sure they're using single leaf doors /sabotage
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Nov 25, 2011 15:55:58 GMT
Is the technology there to have articulated cars without bogies? This would have the platform-hugging advantage of short cars and the fewer bogies advantage of long cars.
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Post by auxsetreq on Nov 25, 2011 16:39:13 GMT
Read all about your hugging bogies here............ www.rail.co/2011/02/06/revolution-on-the-tube/Also can you spot the mistake in the article under the heading..........."Timescale"...........Gives us all hope doesn't it! The pic is an artist's impression but still I'm curious. Will the front open sideways like a bubble car or swing up gull-wing style or plop down like a Thunderbirds thingy for emergency detrainment? Or hasn't the artist thought of that yet as it's all still a twinkle in his mind's eye............. |
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Post by alfie on Nov 25, 2011 16:59:43 GMT
To quote tthe article..
Oh dear.
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Post by plasmid on Nov 25, 2011 17:43:32 GMT
Why is the Northern Line mentioned for EVO replacements? 95ts is better than the 96ts. Must be a typo of some sort. Bakerloo line should get new trains first, followed by the Bombardier refurbished Piccadilly line trains followed by the Central line. 92ts may have a design life of 35 years but the A stock certainly wasn't designed to last any where near 50 years and the 92ts has just had a shed load of money spent on modified gearboxes and bogies so mechanically it should all be gravy. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2011 18:25:36 GMT
I dont see the point of replacing the 1992TS. If the new EVO trains were put in use on the Baker and Picca lines, they would have to come on quickly, and by the time they do come, the 1992TS would not be life-expired. Mabye they would do it staggered by line like with the S Stock for SSL.
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Nov 25, 2011 18:27:41 GMT
Saying the 09ts is a development of the 38ts is a bit too simplistic for a rail engineering magazine, isn't it? Surely it could be argued there have been two distinct generations since then; the 1960ts onwards and the 92ts onwards...
The pic is indeed interesting. Nothing has been designed that neatly and run on the tube since the 83ts, and then 'run' is a subjective term... Mind you I expect that the front will be akin to the DLR; door in the middle front, a window facing pair of transverse seats either side where a cab isn't.
Once again though the side pax windows are tiny... isn't it time to revisit that perhaps?
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 25, 2011 18:52:04 GMT
To quote tthe article.. Oh dear. S stock on the Victoria line... would imagine the wind tunnel it would create  |
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Tom
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Post by Tom on Nov 25, 2011 21:16:53 GMT
Saying the 09ts is a development of the 38ts is a bit too simplistic for a rail engineering magazine, isn't it? Shows they really shouldn't have tried to be remarket themselves more to the professionals. Everyone knows that's the part of the market Modern Railways addresses. The publishers of Rail would do well to recall the launch of Rail as 'Rail Enthusiast' some thirty years ago... |
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Post by tecchy on Nov 25, 2011 21:36:33 GMT
Reliability is not in the question here. The fact that the train with the least passenger capacity is being used on the most used line is more in question. Personally Id move the 95's to another line and bring in the EVO stock for the Northern Line.
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 25, 2011 21:47:29 GMT
Northern line is only the busiest line due to the 2 central London branches. Has TfL's research been split up into the two branches? Because that would make the Central line much busier.
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Post by v52gc on Nov 25, 2011 22:54:19 GMT
Reliability is not in the question here. The fact that the train with the least passenger capacity is being used on the most used line is more in question. Personally Id move the 95's to another line and bring in the EVO stock for the Northern Line. Agreed. Don't forget the 73TS is currently the most reliable stock! |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2011 23:37:58 GMT
And most comfortable!
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Nov 25, 2011 23:50:59 GMT
Tecchy; nice idea. The northern fleet is 106 trains atm? Pic is the obvious candidate now Tubelines and NLTC(?) are both back in house.
Another reason for EVOs on the northern will be fleet requirements after the upgrade. Sure I read somewhere that once both central and northern branches go towards 30tph stock allocation will be far too tight; Battersea would just make it worse.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2011 8:11:34 GMT
Shows they really shouldn't have tried to be remarket themselves more to the professionals. Everyone knows that's the part of the market Modern Railways addresses. The publishers of Rail would do well to recall the launch of Rail as 'Rail Enthusiast' some thirty years ago... Tom, the magazine site quoted is nothing to do with 'Rail' magazine which used to be Rail Enthusiast - it's just a similar and confusing web address! Although I agree that they have often got things wrong, on this occasion they're innocent! |
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 26, 2011 9:51:22 GMT
73TS should stay much longer. The phrase 'replacement of 73TS' should only be said after 2015. The phrase 'replacement of all tube stocks with EVO' is prohibited from now on.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2011 9:58:19 GMT
Those crowding maps were interesting |
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Post by underground2010 on Nov 27, 2011 23:23:47 GMT
To be honest, I can see it being quite some time until the 1992's get replaced. I know the trains have had their problems but that's due to neglect and lack of TLC which the trains are now getting. It would seem stupid to me for them to refurbish the trains and then decide to replace them, its a waste of money. The trains only came into service in 1993 as well and despite the three derailments that I know of, the trains haven't been bad. I can only recall one time I was on a faulty train and that was just the doors wouldn't open on the left hand side. But as mentioned, the Piccadilly line may not be getting new trains for some time, so who knows?  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2011 16:06:55 GMT
It would seem stupid to me for them to refurbish the trains and then decide to replace them, its a waste of money. They're only half-life, it would stupid to replace them without refurbishment. |
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 28, 2011 17:06:47 GMT
We should see first if driverless operation succeeds on line 1 in Paris. At least PED's are possible on curved platforms. I heard attention la marche/Please mind the gap between the train and the platform at some stations, and had PED's.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Nov 28, 2011 17:12:44 GMT
We should see first if driverless operation succeeds on line 1 in Paris. At least PED's are possible on curved platforms. I heard attention la marche/Please mind the gap between the train and the platform at some stations, and had PED's First MP05 trains already in service. |
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Post by chrisvandenkieboom on Nov 28, 2011 17:44:13 GMT
Yup. Haven't been on one yet. And won't be for a long, long time. Also, let's see what happens one year after everything is MP05 and the MP89 to line 4 (Though I personally like the MP59 more... it has the good ol' handle)
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Post by underground2010 on Nov 29, 2011 19:50:07 GMT
It would seem stupid to me for them to refurbish the trains and then decide to replace them, its a waste of money. They're only half-life, it would stupid to replace them without refurbishment. Trains have been replaced without refurbishment. The 1983 stock was scrapped without any refurbishment or major improvements. The point I am trying to make is what with the way everything is, LT would be wasting money on refurbishing the trains and then replacing them a few short years later. That's why the D stock trains are running longer, due to their recent refurbishment. It would be stupid to tart trains up just so they can be either scrapped or sent elsewhere and get another makeover for whatever purpose they will serve. |
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Post by littlebrute on Nov 29, 2011 20:18:02 GMT
OT, but why are some Northern Line trains dated as 1996?
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Nov 29, 2011 20:47:02 GMT
"It would be stupid to tart trains up just so they can be either scrapped or sent elsewhere and get another makeover for whatever purpose they will serve"
This happens lots though, especially in the privitised rail world. One LT example would be the final standard stock cars in the 1960ts trains. The standards received a refurbishment in 1983, despite being withdrawn less than a year later in 1984.
And I'm fairly certain that the D stock was supposed to have originally gone within 5 years of the refurb...
Another point; the 92ts was never neglected anymore so than other stocks... its problems stem fundamentally from poor build quality and insufficient engineering design. Bogies, mounting, brackets and body pannel tessellation all being good examples...
What was it they said at the time; after £xx milion spent on the central, it almost works as well as it did before the rebuild...
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Post by jardine01 on Nov 29, 2011 21:32:40 GMT
I think the 1992 stock will be in service at least another 25-30 years. If they have spend £150 million on new bogies they are not going to replace them just yet. If they do well thats £150 million down the drain then! The 1992 stock are good trains the fastest trains off the mark and make a nice noise when moving off. Unfortantly the 1992 stock was built on the cheap and not much thought was made when making it. Me personaly like the 1996 stock trains!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2011 11:01:12 GMT
"One LT example would be the final standard stock cars in the 1960ts trains. The 19060ts were prototypes, they wouldn't be refurbished, there would be no point, as prototypes last only about 5 years. |
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