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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2006 22:34:19 GMT
Why is it that all of the modern trains with DVAs have them wired up such that when the driver changes the selector barrel to Off and removes his key, the DVA gets cut off?
AFAICT nearly all of the DVA-equipped stocks are wired up this way. Is it not possible to wire them up such that the DVA shuts down only after it is finished announcing?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2006 23:06:39 GMT
The refurb D stocks carry on with the terminus announcement after the driver removes the keys.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2006 23:17:27 GMT
The refurb D stocks carry on with the terminus announcement after the driver removes the keys. Excellent! The D stock is the only one I haven't heard yet at stations where the driver is removing his key during the announcement.
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Nov 13, 2006 2:04:44 GMT
The C stock will only cut off if the control key is removed.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2006 20:09:05 GMT
Why is it that all of the modern trains with DVAs have them wired up such that when the driver changes the selector barrel to Off and removes his key, the DVA gets cut off? I know what you're saying OneKEA, on the modern stocks (1992,95,96) it does indeed cut out, this being very handy during a crew change at Leytonstone when people who haven't been paying attention for the rest of the journey are wondering if it is an Epping train or one to Hainault
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2006 20:32:06 GMT
Often get told that we are supposed to leave the train 'live' until the auto anno has finished playing. However, you can't hear it that well from within the cab... So how are you meant to know without popping the J door every time?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2006 20:33:30 GMT
Often get told that we are supposed to leave the train 'live' until the auto anno has finished playing.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2006 16:52:00 GMT
the PNR or the rule? yay toilet humour
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2006 17:11:05 GMT
being a teenager hardcastle, I totally agree ;D
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2006 20:07:44 GMT
the PNR or the rule? yay toilet humourThat's hilarious!! Have to admit the slight double meaning didn't occour to me when first writing that post ;D
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Post by superteacher on Sept 18, 2007 20:22:50 GMT
the PNR or the rule? yay toilet humourThat's hilarious!! Have to admit the slight double meaning didn't occour to me when first writing that post ;D Was recently on a 1996 stock which was terminated at West Hampstead. The driver walked down the platform to detrain, but the "all change please" announcement kept going. I doubt whether the driver left his key in while he was out of his cab.
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Post by Chris M on Sept 26, 2007 2:47:40 GMT
Interesting, last time I travelled to the terminating point on a 1996 stock, all we got was "this station is Str" followed by silence. Presumably this was when the driver removed their key, but as I was in the middle of the train I'm not certain.
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Post by happybunny on Oct 2, 2007 13:50:18 GMT
On the 96 the automatic announcements cut out as soon as key is removed. If the driver keys in the all change announcement to play more than once, say presses it 5 times, when he shuts down the one that is currently playing cuts off, then the rest play even though trains shut down. It's a bit like a queue kinda thing. I know some drivers who when taking a train into service from depot press a long announcement about 20 times so they can listen to it all through the train as they goto the other end to check the PA is working in all cars (bit OTT if you ask me). It is deffo a better DVA than the D stocks, The D stocks is so rubbishy IMHO, you press for mind the doors and get sick of waiting, close up and when ur half way to the next stn it announces mind the doors and driver looks like an idiot!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2007 16:58:57 GMT
The D stocks is so rubbishy IMHO, you press for mind the doors and get sick of waiting, close up and when ur half way to the next stn it announces mind the doors and driver looks like an idiot! If you decide you don't want an announcement that you've already selected, lift the PA handset, press the fallback PA button and then replace the handset - that seems to cancel it without affecting the regular announcements.
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Post by happybunny on Oct 2, 2007 17:28:46 GMT
Thanks for the tip adw its just annoying the C stock dva's are the best from all the trains iv drove, which is only 3 lol, but still. One press and instant announcement, though it sometimes gets confused. adw do you have a list of the DVA codes for D stock, ie the disruption ones?
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Post by chrish on Oct 2, 2007 23:10:41 GMT
Thanks for the tip adw its just annoying the C stock dva's are the best from all the trains iv drove, which is only 3 lol, but still. One press and instant announcement, though it sometimes gets confused. adw do you have a list of the DVA codes for D stock, ie the disruption ones? Sometimes gets confused??? I can't remember the last time I had a C stock that worked properly! Reported one yesterday, and when I got the same train today, they had simply replaced the defect log book with a new one and done nothing to fix it! Plus, when I found the old log.. they had removed all traces of my report! HMPH! Plus, a little quirk on the D stocks... I got to Ealing Common today, and hit initialize route to get the DVA loading up, which seemed to confuse the system. When I closed the doors, the doors chimes didn't got off until I was well on the way to Ealing Broadway! And you thought "Mind the Doors" was bad!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2007 16:07:50 GMT
Why is it that all of the modern trains with DVAs have them wired up such that when the driver changes the selector barrel to Off and removes his key, the DVA gets cut off? Why does a car radio go off when you take your key out of the ignition? Excatly the same........ It makes sense, if you have shut the train down, you expect things to be shut down.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2007 16:16:10 GMT
Why is it that all of the modern trains with DVAs have them wired up such that when the driver changes the selector barrel to Off and removes his key, the DVA gets cut off? Why does a car radio go off when you take your key out of the ignition? Excatly the same........ It makes sense, if you have shut the train down, you expect things to be shut down. Actually I don't think that argument does make sense. When you take your key out of the car ignition, you want everything to switch off, otherwise when you come back to it you'll probably have a flat battery. On a train there is no such problem (assuming the train is on juice) and the passengers expect the terminus announcement to complete. If the driver is pushed for time he isn't going to sit there waiting for it to end before removing the keys.
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Post by Chris M on Oct 3, 2007 16:27:58 GMT
Certainly in my car, the power to the radio is almost completely independent of the ignition - you can listen to the radio whether the keys are in the ignition or not. The only time they interact is that the radio will sometimes turn off when you start the ignition, but I suspect this is because there is insufficient power for both radio and starter motor.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2007 18:04:59 GMT
Certainly in my car, the power to the radio is almost completely independent of the ignition - you can listen to the radio whether the keys are in the ignition or not. The only time they interact is that the radio will sometimes turn off when you start the ignition, but I suspect this is because there is insufficient power for both radio and starter motor. That depends on how you wire up the radio connections! It can be made to work independently of the ignition or it can be set to receive power only when the ignition key is in.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2007 7:28:01 GMT
DVA's are a pain in the a*se in my opinion. Nobody wants to listen to that woman droning on about Somerset House at half past eleven at night - or even nine o clock in the morning come to think of it. For those who aren't visually impaired there is a frieze running the length of the platform in tunnel sections and plenty of signage at the outside stations to tell you where you are.
If you don't know that you can change at Victoria for the Victoria line and/or are unable to read a tube map then frankly you shouldn't be allowed out of your house in the morning.
Nobody pays the blindest bit of notice to it anyway, they kind of "tune out" and it just becomes an annoyance to those wishing to carry on a conversation or listen to their walkman/ipod etc.
While I am against the whole big brother approach of LU management when it comes to PA's - You must make a PA after 30 seconds: "Ladies and Gentlemen we are being held at a red signal, unfortunately i'm not allowed to call the line controller to find out why for another minute and a half because of a long standing 2 minute rule, unfortunately the people who dictate our PA usage are completely out of touch with real life" (I've never done this but really wanted to). As far as i'm concerned a few timely PA's are more than sufficient, ie: "This train terminates here, please take your belongings, all change" etc. Or announcing the destination at junctions or big stations. There really is no need for some of these drivers who love the sound of their own voice to go on and on as it's funny for about one stop and then becomes downright grating. There is a particular bloke on the Vic and one on the Bakerloo who just never shut up. One look around the car while they are in full flow and you see the irritation etched on the faces of the passengers as they look up to the heavens as if to say "please just shut the f**k up". Unfortunately LU managers seem to think that winding up the passengers (and spending more time on the mic than concentrating on the road) is worthy of lots of "thanks to you" awards and these boring drivers have probably got vouchers coming out their ears! They should be sent on a course about the roles and responsibilities of a train driver, in the same way that using a mobile phone is a distraction to motorists (and train drivers) and is therefore illegal, the constant use of the PA system is surely exactly the same. I'll stop here as otherwise you'll never shut me up about excessive PA use, one of my all-time bugbears about my fellow workers!
The only reason I use the DVA is for blind people, and even most of them know where they're going - after all we got by for over a hundred years without it didn't we...
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Post by Colin on Oct 5, 2007 8:35:47 GMT
Yes we got by, but why struggle when something better (the DVA) comes along?
I agree with some of what you say - the D stock off-peak announcement at Tower Hill in particular is unnecessarily too long; and it doesn't even mention the Circle line interchange!
But on the other hand, if you were to observe loadings on a special service day, at say, Whitechapel (Whitechapel - Earls Court shutdown) or West Kensington (West Ken - Acton shutdown) and compare the difference between a non refurb and a refurb..........I guarantee you will see a difference.
To really illustrate the point, there was a peak morning last week where my train was terminated at Whitechapel, on a refurb; when I changed ends & much to my surprise, there wasn't one person left on the train.......I think that says something in support of the DVA system.....
FWIW, my personal opinion is that if something makes the job easier - in this case, the DVA means I don't need to bother making PA's unless there's a problem - well that's a good thing for us drivers.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2007 12:41:21 GMT
That depends on how you wire up the radio connections! It can be made to work independently of the ignition or it can be set to receive power only when the ignition key is in. You can use the radio when the ignition isnt on on my car too, but when you pull the key out the radio will go off, thats if it is on! On new stock you have to think of the barrell being the control key, and thus when you select "off" you are taking the control key out. Simple really, i cant understand the fuss.....
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Post by happybunny on Oct 5, 2007 12:59:15 GMT
It is overkill, on stations or trains. My local station, Ealing Common, has an announcement every 30 seconds, no smoking, take litter home, service update, the stupidest I heard was "Ladies and Gentlemen.. Welcome to London underground" I mean come on. A few years ago if I heard a voice on the tannoy there I KNEW it would be regarding my service locally and information I need to know. Now a days its probably something like minor delays at Chesham or for my safety im being watched by CCTV... so I and many others just switch off to all announcements because we hear so many.
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Post by Chris M on Oct 5, 2007 13:52:51 GMT
Even more annoying is when announcements get stuck on, as happened (for at least 45 minutes I believe) at Earl's Court the other day. As one person I overheard commented, "He's a bit deaf that Inspector Sands fellow!"
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Post by c5 on Oct 5, 2007 15:48:07 GMT
It is overkill, on stations or trains. My local station, Ealing Common, has an announcement every 30 seconds, no smoking, take litter home, service update, the stupidest I heard was "Ladies and Gentlemen.. Welcome to London underground" I mean come on. A few years ago if I heard a voice on the tannoy there I KNEW it would be regarding my service locally and information I need to know. Now a days its probably something like minor delays at Chesham or for my safety im being watched by CCTV... so I and many others just switch off to all announcements because we hear so many. And the worst thing about all these is that often they never have one saying where the nearest train is!
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Post by tubeprune on Oct 5, 2007 16:25:37 GMT
It is overkill, on stations or trains. My local station, Ealing Common, has an announcement every 30 seconds, no smoking, take litter home, service update, the stupidest I heard was "Ladies and Gentlemen.. Welcome to London underground" I mean come on. A few years ago if I heard a voice on the tannoy there I KNEW it would be regarding my service locally and information I need to know. Now a days its probably something like minor delays at Chesham or for my safety im being watched by CCTV... so I and many others just switch off to all announcements because we hear so many. When I first joined LU in the early 1960s, we were told, "Don't use the PA too much because people get fed up with it and switch off. Save it for the important things."
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2007 18:12:36 GMT
When I first joined LU in the early 1960s, we were told, "Don't use the PA too much because people get fed up with it and switch off. Save it for the important things." I remember this was the logic for many LU staff in the mid/late 1990's when I first started exploring the system, and I still think it is the most sensible way now. Was on the Northern a couple of times last week and the T/Op was giving service updates for all the lines over the PA! Times have changed. Worst DVA moment was the T/Op who played "This train will now terminate at Kennington, please ensure you have all your belongings with you when you leave the train" all the way from Waterloo platform to Kennington platform. I was travelling home in uniform and was getting some seriously annoyed looks, it really wound me up myself. Perhaps the T/Op found it funny
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2007 18:14:24 GMT
Even more annoying is when announcements get stuck on, as happened (for at least 45 minutes I believe) at Earl's Court the other day. As one person I overheard commented, "He's a bit deaf that Inspector Sands fellow!" I know from speaking to people that work at ect that there was a fault with a callpoint (the red things you need to push if you see a fire) last week, which resulted in Inspector Sands being called for non stop.
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Post by Colin on Oct 6, 2007 3:29:57 GMT
To go into slightly more detail, the station supervisor was doing a call point test for some sound acoustic test engineers - initially the reset key got jammed in the device. The key eventually came out but the device did not re-set. The supervisor made further attempts to re-set the device, but was unable to get the reset key to go back in. Other LUL staff are probably quite rightly thinking that it can't be that hard to re-set a call point. Trouble is, as 'upinthesky' (and probably 'chrish' too) can confirm, Earls Court and Fulham Broadway have a different reset key to the rest of LUL ( : - it's more like a pointy prong that you poke into a hole.........it's the silliest design I've seen and has failed to work properly many times. Oh and I believe the message went out for an hour and a half before it was fixed!
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