Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2011 11:44:30 GMT
When Crossrail is built, is the operation likely to be franchised out to First, Govia, (NX), Arriva or someone else? Perhaps it might be a newly formed company like LOROL but owned by DB/MTR Laing?
Do you think the operating company might be able to brand Crossrail like First Crossrail or Arriva Crossrail?
TIA.
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Jun 5, 2011 12:10:34 GMT
From what I remember, the latest (or at least a recent) plan is that it will be a TfL-specified franchise. If so it is likely that, as with London Overground, that TfL control (or at leas specify) the branding. I wouldn't be surprised if a final decision has yet to be made though.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2011 14:11:02 GMT
Considering that current Overground franchise will end in 2014 or 2016 - perhaps Crossraill will be part of a bigger franchise from that moment?
|
|
|
Post by andypurk on Jun 5, 2011 14:35:02 GMT
My understanding is that it won't be a concession, like London Overground (similar to a franchise but where TfL specify the service levels and take the revenue risk, with LOROL running the trains for an agreed fee). Instead it will be a more conventional franchise, but with heavy TfL involvement specifying service level inside the zones, the branding etc. I would expect the end result to be a mixture between the conventional franchises and London Overground.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2011 20:06:17 GMT
Will they come up with a better name? I mean Crossrail works fine for the project name, but I'm not sure I'd like it just describing a service.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2011 21:03:09 GMT
Quite like the name Crossrail personally.
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Jun 5, 2011 21:38:28 GMT
I'm with cityboy, I think it works well for describing a cross-London rail service. In that regard it's better than any of the current TfL lines other than the Waterloo and City, West London Line and the Goblin. The East London Line under LU was also an accurate description, although now it's taking in more and more of south London it's lost this. The Circle post circularity is another example of this. The Bakerloo serves more than Baker Street to Waterloo, West Ruislip and Epping are hardly central, nor are East Ham and Plaistow either Hammersmith or the City. The Jubilee does not operate only on monarchical anniversaries [1] and while "District" is a vague term, Westminster and Monument are not the rural or suburban areas it sort of implies. Chesham and Croxley are not metropolitan locales, Morden isn't northern and Heathrow is a long way from Piccadilly. Victoria is but one stop, Richmond is not North London and neither Lewisham nor Stratford are in the docklands. [1] although Diana might disagree
|
|
|
Post by norbitonflyer on Jun 5, 2011 23:03:31 GMT
I'm with cityboy, I think it works well for describing a cross-London rail service. Crossrail is too vague, it could apply to any line which passes through Zone 1 and out the other side - Central, District, H&C, Jubilee, Northern, Piccadilly, Victoria, Thameslink - even ELL!
|
|
Ben
fotopic... whats that?
Posts: 4,282
|
Post by Ben on Jun 6, 2011 2:06:24 GMT
That might be the case if it were hyphenated, but to have it as a compound word kind of implies it is a name, and thus something specific.
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Jun 6, 2011 3:23:25 GMT
If you're preferring a name along the lines of the Bakerloo, might I suggest the "Paddy Field Line" (from Paddington, Abbey Wood and Shenfield). Not particularly descriptive of present day land use in it's catchment area, but with global warming it might be a name that will be grown into.
|
|
|
Post by railtechnician on Jun 6, 2011 6:02:00 GMT
It's impossible to give a name to any line that would be truly meaningful to all those that use it and certainly not to the majority. Why should the name be anything more than that?
In my view a pointless discussion really! A name that suits a few is unfair to the rest so perhaps a better idea would simply be to rename all lines numerically or alphabetically which would probably please nobody but be fair to everybody! I don't think the name is important at all and what on earth is Goblin, I've seen it used here often but have no idea what it is which proves somewhat that names are unimportant!
|
|
|
Post by ianvisits on Jun 6, 2011 7:46:15 GMT
Crossrail is too vague, it could apply to any line which passes through Zone 1 and out the other side - Central, District, H&C, Jubilee, Northern, Piccadilly, Victoria, Thameslink - even ELL! By that argument, why is the Bakerloo so called when it no longer runs just between Baker Street and Waterloo? Why is the Northern Line so called when trains run southbound? Why is the network in general called "The Underground" when most of it is actually above ground? The only place where names are usually applied in a manner traditionally designed to explain form and function is in science. OK, I wouldn't mind the lines being named after Latin/Greek combinations, but I doubt most people would like it. Crossrail is the only railway that has been specifically designed to go through London - in one end and out the other - and the name seems suitable.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 8:22:13 GMT
The name Crossrail works in relation to what it plans to do at the moment - crossing the whole of London (rather than just Zone 1), as well as crossing between several key existing stations. With time the name may become a glaring misnomer but, as mentioned above, all line names do so the more the line develops.
|
|
Ben
fotopic... whats that?
Posts: 4,282
|
Post by Ben on Jun 6, 2011 9:03:28 GMT
Goblin - Gospel Oak - Barking LINe
|
|
|
Post by Deep Level on Jun 6, 2011 9:16:34 GMT
Will Crossrail have its own roundel? And if so, what colour would it be? Because the purple that is commonly used to illustate Crossrail is currently used for London Dial A Ride and the blue from the logo is being used for the Tfl logo. Black or yellow perhaps? And in answer to railtechnition's question, GOBLIN is the Gospal Oak to Barking Line now run by London Overground. Edit: It would appear that unlike me, Ben didn't get distracted whilst writing his post.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 9:26:06 GMT
I'm with cityboy, I think it works well for describing a cross-London rail service. Crossrail is too vague, it could apply to any line which passes through Zone 1 and out the other side - Central, District, H&C, Jubilee, Northern, Piccadilly, Victoria, Thameslink - even ELL! I see what you mean, but then all the lines you mention already exist and already have names so it won't really get confused with them. On the other hand "Crossrail" could be applied to any line where the train is late.........
|
|
|
Post by miff on Jun 6, 2011 11:40:01 GMT
what on earth is Goblin, I've seen it used here often but have no idea what it is which proves somewhat that names are unimportant! I agree the names don't matter much (why not re-name them all after District Dave contributers?, or X-factor finalists), but Goblin is one of the few that actually makes good geographical sense G(ospel)O(ak)toB(arking)LIN(e). (But I usually call it the BOG line, for no good reason I can remember!)
|
|
|
Post by railtechnician on Jun 6, 2011 15:31:55 GMT
what on earth is Goblin, I've seen it used here often but have no idea what it is which proves somewhat that names are unimportant! I agree the names don't matter much (why not re-name them all after District Dave contributers?, or X-factor finalists), but Goblin is one of the few that actually makes good geographical sense G(ospel)O(ak)toB(arking)LIN(e). (But I usually call it the BOG line, for no good reason I can remember!) Ye Gods! That was a local line to me up until 44 years ago and it was just 'the Barking line' to us, an alternative to travelling into Liverpool Street to travel to Southend-on-Sea. The last time I used that was when I was commissioning District line PA racks at the east end of the District circa 1987/8. It always was a dirty smelly diesel route, surely GOB is more appropriate than GOBLin but it makes no difference, neither is important to me!
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Jun 6, 2011 16:22:48 GMT
It's still a diesel route, but thanks to London Overground it's no longer dirty or smelly (for a diesel route). The inclination now just needs to be found to electrify it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 18:39:11 GMT
I've sparked some conversation.
Eh, keep the name. It's okay.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 18:54:51 GMT
Crossrail passes near or through areas famous for some of Britain's most impressive mass murderers. Whitechapel and Notting Hill (nearly!). So how about the "John Reginald Ripper Line" or better still, the "Jack The Christie Line". That way you could say "I'm just catching the Jack to Romford"......Class!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2011 20:58:30 GMT
The Maiden-Field line could be a name for Crossrail, Or Heath-Wood line etc.
|
|
Chris M
Global Moderator
Forum Quizmaster
Always happy to receive quiz ideas and pictures by email or PM
Posts: 19,758
|
Post by Chris M on Jun 6, 2011 21:09:32 GMT
Do we know yet what the service pattern will be? i.e. will all ex-Heathrow trains go to Abbey Wood or will there be trains from both western branches to both eastern ones (and vice versa)?
|
|
|
Post by littlebrute on Jun 6, 2011 22:18:17 GMT
Personally I think Crossrail as a name should be kept. It is what everyone knows it as and it is basically changing the name for the sake of it. Also, I think that it shouldn't be franchised to a separate company. Why not just keep the Crossrail branding and allow TfL to run it completely?
|
|