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Post by ruislip on Feb 23, 2011 7:13:18 GMT
This is from 1975, featuring a reduced peak service M-F. Furthermore, "the dates on which it will be required ... will be notified by Traffic Circular or Timetable Notice." Is this the only example of a WTT that does not take effect on a fixed date, and which is limited to weekdays only?
Something else interesting I noticed about this WTT is that for the "Met Main" it lists the C stocks to/from Neasden depot and the British Rail services to/from Amersham/Aylesbury--but not the Piccadilly trains running between Uxbridge and Rayners Lane. Any reason(s) for this?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 9:44:24 GMT
There was a huge "grey area" in terms of WTT numbering around that time, mostly because of the staffing situation which affected most lines - basically a lack of guards and with many trains cancelled. Coupled with stock problems, the Northern Line, for example, often had 30 trains cancelled per peak (out of 95), and the Bakerloo 15 (out of a much reduced 32 - 45/47 was the norm!). Coupled with this was the aftermath of stock problems following the strike at Acton in 1969 - the 1938 Stock never did "recover" from it and six-car trains were still around (in small numbers) in the mid-1970s.
I'll dig through my WTT notes to see if I can make any sense of what was done (WTT-wise) and give a fuller reply later today
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Feb 23, 2011 10:23:37 GMT
Was it tubeprune who commented in another thread about Bakerloo passengers on the local waving frantically at the met drivers to get a train diverted their way?
Didn't know the 38 was still feeling the effects till the mid 70s. Is there a rough date for when 6 car working would have been abolished, or did it persist on and off till the main withdrawl in the 80s? Suppose it was an unfortunate blessing in some respects that passenger numbers were falling...
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Feb 23, 2011 12:02:11 GMT
This is from 1975, featuring a reduced peak service M-F. Furthermore, "the dates on which it will be required ... will be notified by Traffic Circular or Timetable Notice." Is this the only example of a WTT that does not take effect on a fixed date, and which is limited to weekdays only? Blimey, no not at all! There are (as reganorak mentions) lots of examples around this time, and not just from the Met. Other Met examples from this era (ones that I can lay my hands on) are - No1 C235 11/72 MF
- No1 E235 4/74 (Sats only used, but full galley)
- No2 C237 10/72
- ELL E242 4/74
- No1 245 7/75 SuO
- No2 247 5/75 SuO
- No1 248 1/75 MF
- No1 249 4/75 SaO
- No2 251 4/75 SaO (note in force 31/5/75 - 19/2/77)
- No2 256 6/75 MF
- No2 257 9/75 SuO
- No1 259 2/77 MF
- ELL 260 5/76
- No2 262 11/76 SaO (note in force from 26/2/77)
- No2 266 1/77 SuO
- No1 268 12/77 MF
- No1 269 11/77 SaO
- No1 270 11/77 SuO
- No2 271 12/77 MF
- No2 272 12/77 SaO
- No2 273 12/77 SuO
- No1 275 4/79
- No2 276 4/79
- ELL 277 4/79
These dates are publication dates, note that the two series are not necessarily consecutive, as there were also CWL WTTs. -but not the Piccadilly trains running between Uxbridge and Rayners Lane. Any reason(s) for this? The most likely explanation is that Ux - RL Piccadilly working hadn't been altered from the previous WTT - still an odd omission. |
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Post by tubeprune on Feb 23, 2011 12:20:33 GMT
Was it tubeprune who commented in another thread about Bakerloo passengers on the local waving frantically at the met drivers to get a train diverted their way? Yes it was. Couldn't do that today though. All the flexibility on the railway was taken out under the PPP divisions. Such folly. |
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Oracle
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Post by Oracle on Feb 23, 2011 12:39:19 GMT
I photographed a 6-car Bakerloo at Wembley Park in the late 1970s and it had a 3-car in train red and 3-car in bus red!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 13:57:20 GMT
MRFS has answered most of it, but from my archives, I would add -
The WTTs around that time were not only separated for MF, SO and Sun, but also for reduced peaks (prior/after Bank Holidays)
WTT No.254 was one of them.
Around the same time the Piccadilly had WTT No.10 for reduced peaks and WTT No.11 for Bank Holidays. Similarly, the District had WTT No.104 for reduced peaks.
Numbering Bank Holidays and reduced peaks didn't last long.
There were also WTTs which catered for reduced services in general, prefixed with various letters, C, D, E, the last for the most reductions. These were also used when we had the 3-day week and all the relevant industrial troubles in the 1970s.
On a personal note (I may have mentioned it before elsewhere some time ago - apologies if I have) but as a Controller on the Bakerloo in 1974, the WTTs were E60 and E61 with 32 trains in the peaks. One evening peak I had 15 of those trains cancelled for no guards, which left 17 to provide the service E&C-STA/QP (and four to Watford! - can't remember if they ran or I cancelled them). Of course, "even intervals" was the thing - a bit difficult with 50% of the service missing, and two branches to serve as eaually as possible. Anyway, this 6-car (!) train left E&C 12 minutes late at about 16.15, and arrived at Stanmore 48 mins late, such was the result of a shorter train. Happy days!!
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metman
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Post by metman on Feb 23, 2011 18:08:43 GMT
I assume the trains were formed from 6 cars displaced from the Northern(City?) Line or was this due to the shortage of compressors meaning the NDMs were removed!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 18:34:02 GMT
The 6-cars weren't generally from the Northern City as these weren't displaced until October 1975. When they were displaced very few made further service. Two complete units were kept for Extra Heavy Overhaul (EHO), being 10151 and 10187. Two trailers were also given an EHO, being 012380 and 012256, which replaced two 1949 Stock trailers which were EHO'd in error. 012256 is, of course, in the LT Museum's 4-car unit.
Most 6-car trains were formed of 2x3 M-T-M with the NDM removed from the 4-car unit. "Serious" reformations from 4- to 3-cars began in September 1969. Although the NDMs started to be put back after the Acton strike, not all 4-car units were reunited with their NDMs.
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metman
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Post by metman on Feb 23, 2011 23:05:49 GMT
While we're on the subject, the NDMs had compressors like the trailers, KLL4s if I'm not mistaken. Did the trailers have any equipment that the NDMs didn't?
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