Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 19:53:40 GMT
I note that the Metropolitan line sets will have a different seating arrangement to the rest and also Met line diagrams are visible so is there any reason the handrails have not been painted maroon? I can understand that it wouldn't be practical to paint the District line S stock handrails green as some of them could end up running on the Circle/Hammersmith & City lines but the Met trains are unlikely to run on other lines.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 19:55:44 GMT
I agree, I think the handrails should be maroon.
|
|
metman
Global Moderator
5056 05/12/1961-23/04/2012 RIP
Posts: 7,421
|
Post by metman on Jan 21, 2011 20:11:38 GMT
There was something to do with DDA (now scrapped but bits put in the Equalities Act 2010) and having a uniform colour! I agree, they should have been Magenta!
|
|
prjb
Advisor
LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
Posts: 1,840
|
Post by prjb on Jan 21, 2011 20:17:39 GMT
The use of colour is indeed due to the requirements to ensure visually impaired customers can easily indentify the grab rails, this is mandated by RVAR (Rail Vehicle Accessibility Regulations). However the actual colours to be used are not mandated and it is more important to achieve a contrast, the 09ts is a good example of this where yellow isn't used at all but it still meets with the requirements.
The decision to use yellow was made because when taking into account the vehicle interior that colour meets the contrast. 'S' Stock was originally designed to be universal and interchangeable (in terms of parts) with no obvious line identity being apparent. The only major change came when the decision was taken to alter the S7 layout to all longitudinal seating.
|
|
SE13
In memoriam
RIP 23-Oct-2013
Glorious Gooner
Posts: 9,737
|
Post by SE13 on Jan 21, 2011 20:19:31 GMT
We covered handrails in a different thread, and it's all to do with standing out against the ambient colour. I'm sure prjb can add to this again if I'm mistaken.
EDIT
He's beaten me to it!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 20:23:38 GMT
However the actual colours to be used are not mandated and it is more important to achieve a contrast, the 09ts is a good example of this where yellow isn't used at all but it still meets with the requirements. I would have thought maroon would have been fairly visible. This would explain why the Jubilee and Northern line trains have yellow handrails though. I'm surprised brown was allowed on the Bakerloo line.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 20:25:41 GMT
However the actual colours to be used are not mandated and it is more important to achieve a contrast, the 09ts is a good example of this where yellow isn't used at all but it still meets with the requirements. I would have thought maroon would have been fairly visible. This would explain why the Jubilee and Northern line trains have yellow handrails though. I'm surprised brown was allowed on the Bakerloo line. Given the interiors, I would have thought that black especially would have contrasted well. The brown on the bakerloo doesn't do too badly.
|
|
prjb
Advisor
LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
Posts: 1,840
|
Post by prjb on Jan 21, 2011 20:34:23 GMT
In terms of contrast you are right - black would have been good, however the designers also needed to consider what colours are appropriate in terms of aesthetics as well.
Maroon was ruled out as this would have deviated from the design and maintenance intent to have a 'uniform' fleet.
|
|
prjb
Advisor
LU move customers from A to B, they used to do it via 'C'.
Posts: 1,840
|
Post by prjb on Jan 21, 2011 20:34:45 GMT
We covered handrails in a different thread, and it's all to do with standing out against the ambient colour. I'm sure prjb can add to this again if I'm mistaken. EDITHe's beaten me to it! ;D
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 20:38:40 GMT
So the Jubilee is the only line that would have not been allowed to have its colour on the handrails due to contrast rules?
|
|
|
Post by t697 on Jan 21, 2011 21:37:14 GMT
So the Jubilee is the only line that would have not been allowed to have its colour on the handrails due to contrast rules? Ah yes, if only.... Brushed stainless steel was so robust and long lasting. I was lucky enough to visit the Innotrans exhibition and see that the EC Disability regs are interpreted more flexibly in other EC countries' modern trains. There, brushed stainless steel handrails are still very common. Indeed in some cases they contrasted with surroundings well for me, but perhaps less so for someone with very low vision. The RVAR defines contrast as “contrast” means contrast in the amount of light reflected; The RVAR Guidance on handholds states "People who have low vision need to be able to identify the handrails against other surfaces within view in order to use them. Most people will find this easier when the handrail contrasts clearly with surrounding surfaces." Then when you recall that the suite of handholds includes a variety of surroundings ranging from near white panels to a general collection and variety of colour and texture when there are people in the car and floor to ceiling handrails, nothing that isn't a fairly bright colour is going to meet the spirit or letter of the not unreasonable requirement. Hence the Met line route colour really isn't going to be acceptable. As you may have seen, bright yellow, pale to mid blue, vivid green are used in various LU stock and there are other bright shades in some modern RVAR regulated TOC fleets. I think LU design taste wouldn't go for peppermint etc though! Quite right in my opinion.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 21:50:48 GMT
In that case then the Bakerloo shouldn't meet the regulations and even the Central line would be questionable due to the colour of the seats.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2011 21:53:02 GMT
I think, Met line purple would stand out more than the yellow, the interiors are already quite yellow especially the lighting and the ceiling being quite a cream colour
|
|
|
Post by t697 on Jan 21, 2011 22:22:17 GMT
In that case then the Bakerloo shouldn't meet the regulations and even the Central line would be questionable due to the colour of the seats. Probably true. Those decor schemes and the trains pre-date RVAR regs and currently RVAR does not apply to them.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2011 20:53:20 GMT
With the new "S-Stock" - Initially the users can also enjoy the "New Car Smell" initially, just like the new Victoria Line and Docklands light railway trains!!
|
|
|
Post by malcolmffc on Feb 7, 2011 6:48:39 GMT
Would it really take that long to repaint the bars yellow if it was decided to move an S8 to another line?
|
|
|
Post by railtechnician on Feb 7, 2011 7:04:21 GMT
I presume the Disability Regulations are not only to cover those with poor eyesight but also the colour blind.
It does seem to me as though all lines should have stock to identical internal and external decoration and that selectable visual and audible cues should be used to differentiate which line a train is running on and which destination it is running to. Why the need for expensive arty farty line identity as decoration except to placate designers ? As ever money, it seems, is no object.
At the end of the day I doubt that able bodied passengers are that fussy about decor, service and punctuality being far more important to the average commuter.
|
|
jazza
Guess my Favourite Number?
Posts: 196
|
Post by jazza on Feb 7, 2011 11:37:21 GMT
I presume the Disability Regulations are not only to cover those with poor eyesight but also the colour blind Interesting, I'm colour blind, the common type where red and green are almost indistinguishable to me along with some shades of brown and black. I would never have thought it to be an area that the DDA would have covered, more a simple "defect" that my body has which certainly places no restriction on my life, but I guess I may be luckier than others. I look at Ishihara tests online and while everybody is shouting out the hidden numbers, I'm quietly looking at the pretty colours saying nothing. ;D As far as traveling on LU or any other type of transport is concerned, I have never had a problem because most interiors of trains and buses are neutral colours, light blues, whites etc. which mean that any grab poles are highly visible to me should I need one. It simply may be the case that I don't recognise the colour that the pole is, but it is clearly visible all the same against a train or bus interior.
|
|