kabsonline
Best SSL Train: S Stock Best Tube Train: 92 Stock
Posts: 686
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Post by kabsonline on Jan 9, 2011 23:22:25 GMT
i went up to london at the weekend using the met and was really suprised not to see a single s stock train. is there a reason for this? also are they coming to chesham on a regular basis yet?
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Post by citysig on Jan 10, 2011 10:01:06 GMT
As already mentioned in a couple of other threads  the S-stock at present is more or less "tied" to a couple of regular diagrams, and these are based around mainly Watford services, with 2 Uxbridge services. S-stocks to Chesham are fairly unlikely at this stage - though not impossible. We are reliant on train operator availability at present. The weekend operation of trains is also dependant on train operator availability, and being weekends there are generally operators booked on. Don't forget that each train currently needs a train operator and an accompanying instructor operator. |
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cso
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Post by cso on Jan 10, 2011 12:00:57 GMT
Don't forget that each train currently needs a train operator and an accompanying instructor operator. Why do they still need instructor operators? I'm assuming there's a good reason, but i was intrigued as to what it was... One of these days, I'll be lucky to actually get on an S-Stock  |
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Post by setttt on Jan 10, 2011 12:52:05 GMT
Don't forget that each train currently needs a train operator and an accompanying instructor operator. Why do they still need instructor operators? I'm assuming there's a good reason, but i was intrigued as to what it was... This is actually not the case. Arrangements are in place for an Instructor Operator to be available if the Train Operator requires it (which could be due to a variety of factors), but the presence of an I/Op is not compulsory and nor has it been for some time. |
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kabsonline
Best SSL Train: S Stock Best Tube Train: 92 Stock
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Post by kabsonline on Jan 10, 2011 15:06:43 GMT
how much difference is there is driving the s stock from the a stock?
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metman
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Post by metman on Jan 10, 2011 18:11:38 GMT
I would guess - a lot! One control, armchair, aircon, internal monitors, cab large enough for a disco!
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kabsonline
Best SSL Train: S Stock Best Tube Train: 92 Stock
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Post by kabsonline on Jan 10, 2011 18:40:04 GMT
sounds pretty cool!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2011 18:42:10 GMT
In London on wednesday, does anyone know what time would be best to try and get a trip on the new S Stock?
Are they out all day or is it just during peak hours?
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metman
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Post by metman on Jan 10, 2011 18:43:25 GMT
I would look to use the Watford service, there maybe 2 running Baker-Watford.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2011 18:49:13 GMT
ok thank you
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2011 23:18:13 GMT
Currently on this evenings 22.54 Baker Street - Chesham all stations, it's S stock! Think it's 21009/10 et al (in 22009).
Will try for some sort of photographic record if it does actually end up at Chesham ( hope so - I want to go to bed!).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2011 0:53:47 GMT
Well, it indeed made it to Chesham - got a few photos in the dark and damp and a nice video of it leaving again. Just need to work out where to put them so you can see them...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2011 14:57:22 GMT
Got on one two weeks running. Both 13.28 Monday at Pinner townbound.
Very nice.Smooth ride.
How long before the taggers get to work?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2011 15:09:35 GMT
Well, it indeed made it to Chesham - got a few photos in the dark and damp and a nice video of it leaving again. Just need to work out where to put them so you can see them... is a nice place for that - unless you haven't already found out/aren't using another service now |
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Post by citysig on Jan 11, 2011 19:00:21 GMT
Why do they still need instructor operators? I'm assuming there's a good reason, but i was intrigued as to what it was... This is actually not the case. Arrangements are in place for an Instructor Operator to be available if the Train Operator requires it (which could be due to a variety of factors), but the presence of an I/Op is not compulsory and nor has it been for some time. I'd call that splitting hairs. You cannot run a service based on "ifs" and "maybes" so therefore, regardless of the driver needing an I/O, one has to be available in case they are needed. No good a train turning up with the driver taking over needing an I/O. Where do we put the train if there is nobody to take it ;D So I stand by what I said, in that each train has to have a train operator and an instructor operator. The I/Os / 2nd person is also required for a few signal sighting issues that remain. |
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Post by setttt on Jan 11, 2011 19:48:49 GMT
I'd call that splitting hairs. You cannot run a service based on "ifs" and "maybes" so therefore, regardless of the driver needing an I/O, one has to be available in case they are needed. No good a train turning up with the driver taking over needing an I/O. Where do we put the train if there is nobody to take it ;D So I stand by what I said, in that each train has to have a train operator and an instructor operator. It doesn't, but I do appreciate your inability to appear wrong. The I/Os / 2nd person is also required for a few signal sighting issues that remain. This is news to me too. At locations where known sighting issues exist, the T/Op liaises with either the signaller or station staff as appropriate. I guess you've been briefed differently to those of us who actually operate the trains. |
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Post by citysig on Jan 11, 2011 20:22:53 GMT
I'd call that splitting hairs. You cannot run a service based on "ifs" and "maybes" so therefore, regardless of the driver needing an I/O, one has to be available in case they are needed. No good a train turning up with the driver taking over needing an I/O. Where do we put the train if there is nobody to take it ;D So I stand by what I said, in that each train has to have a train operator and an instructor operator. It doesn't, but I do appreciate your inability to appear wrong. The I/Os / 2nd person is also required for a few signal sighting issues that remain. This is news to me too. At locations where known sighting issues exist, the T/Op liaises with either the signaller or station staff as appropriate. I guess you've been briefed differently to those of us who actually operate the trains. I have absolutely no problem with being wrong. However on this occasion, you maybe need to appreciate the bigger picture. Given that you are a Met train operator, I would hope you are aware of the many crewing issues at present. This includes not being able to guarantee a train operator who does not need an I/O. Therefore, to ensure against having a train stranded without a driver, the S-stock must not run if there is not both a Train Operator and Instructor Operator. The sighting issues do still exist, and in an attempt to reduce any delays (through having to liases with signallers etc,) the I/Os also help to perform a "second pair of eyes" function. Clearly I have been briefed very differently to you, but then as you are in charge of 1 train and I am responsible for 47 others at peak times on the Met, it is only to be expected. |
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Post by setttt on Jan 11, 2011 21:51:06 GMT
I have absolutely no problem with being wrong. However on this occasion, you maybe need to appreciate the bigger picture. Given that you are a Met train operator, I would hope you are aware of the many crewing issues at present. This includes not being able to guarantee a train operator who does not need an I/O. Absolutely, and of course that will not be guaranteed until all drivers are trained and have built up their confidence. That is why an I/Op is allocated to each S Stock duty to accompany the T/Op if required. Their presence is not compulsory if the T/Op does not require it. That is all that I was saying, in an effort to answer another member's question. Therefore, to ensure against having a train stranded without a driver, the S-stock must not run if there is not both a Train Operator and Instructor Operator. ...available, yes, but the latter does not need to be on the train unless they are actually needed for whatever reason, be it coaching or due to lack of trained operator. Naturally they must be available at the appropriate relieving point to cater for such an eventuality. |
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Post by citysig on Jan 12, 2011 19:00:50 GMT
That's ok, as long as we're all singing from the same hymn book. T/Op + I/Op = S-stock. If there isn't both, then the stock doesn't run.
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kabsonline
Best SSL Train: S Stock Best Tube Train: 92 Stock
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Post by kabsonline on Jan 12, 2011 19:57:04 GMT
does anyone no whenthe next one to chesham is
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2011 20:51:07 GMT
22:54 off baker street this evening.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2011 21:05:13 GMT
thats a big gap in service
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Post by Tomcakes on Jan 12, 2011 21:06:12 GMT
That's ok, as long as we're all singing from the same hymn book. T/Op + I/Op = S-stock. If there isn't both, then the stock doesn't run. <awkward mode> If there is an I/Op but no T/Op, can the train be driven by the I/Op? </awkward mode> |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2011 21:06:35 GMT
thats a big gap in service Judging by the thread, that seems to be the next service expected to be an S8 to Chesham. |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Jan 12, 2011 21:16:43 GMT
<awkward mode> If there is an I/Op but no T/Op, can the train be driven by the I/Op? </awkward mode> Depends on if the saying is true I guess: Those who can, do; those who can't, instruct! (No offence to those that do instruct, at the moment I am both doing and instructing a potential do-er; it has its moments!) |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2011 23:05:57 GMT
I/OP, T/OP. In the words of the latest Doctor Who, both are cool. So, all this stuff aside, anybody putting up pics or video of the grand occasion of an S8 at Chesham?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2011 23:54:46 GMT
<awkward mode> If there is an I/Op but no T/Op, can the train be driven by the I/Op? </awkward mode> LOL! Yes! As a fluke of coincidence I was chatting to a Lead S Stock Met Line Instructor about this the morning before this thread raised the issue. The train can be driven by an I/Op alone. The train can be driven by a trained T/Op alone (if they are happy to do so). If it is not known if the rostered T/Op wants an I/Op then an I/Op must be available. If the T/Op is known not to want the I/Op the I/Op may be deployed to other work. If an I/Op is rostered to drive the train any second I/Op may be deployed to other work. If the T/Op does not want an I/Op then the I/Op will probably not ride with the train and indeed the T/Op may decline their presence. If the train arrives and there is neither a trained driver nor an I/Op then the train has to be reformed. I think that about covers all the options and basically agrees with what MetDriver says and expands in different words what MetControl was saying! |
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Post by t697 on Jan 13, 2011 19:13:14 GMT
So, all this stuff aside, anybody putting up pics or video of the grand occasion of an S8 at Chesham? Don't have pics or video, it's not such a grand occasion now, but the best chance is rather late at night as a previous post mentions. It's been there several or even many times now. |
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SE13
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Post by SE13 on Jan 13, 2011 19:24:33 GMT
Can it be noted (and the Met guys should agree) that just because it's booked to run from A to B at X time doesn't follow that it'll happen.
A million things can happen in the meantime, and it's infinitely possible that the unit gets turned somewhere, switched in service or whatever, and it'll be winding it's way elsewhere with a different crew.
In the transport industry nothing is cut and dry.
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the S-stock at present is more or less "tied" to a couple of regular diagrams, and these are based around mainly Watford services, with 2 Uxbridge services. 
